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BouncyBall 2013/2014
- Thread starter RaceBoarder
- Start date
French Rage
NICKERSON HAS [CENSORED]
Re: BouncyBall 2013/2014
As bad as the Michigan loss to NJIT is, it's distracting everyone from Drexel's loss to something called Univerisy of the Sciences: http://philadelphia.cbslocal.com/2014/12/05/university-of-sciences-savors-upset-win-over-drexel/
As bad as the Michigan loss to NJIT is, it's distracting everyone from Drexel's loss to something called Univerisy of the Sciences: http://philadelphia.cbslocal.com/2014/12/05/university-of-sciences-savors-upset-win-over-drexel/
Hammer
We'll be back.
Re: BouncyBall 2013/2014
And it's starting to happen again against Eastern Michigan.
And it's starting to happen again against Eastern Michigan.
MissThundercat
Are the cis okay?
Spartanforlife4
Generic Catchy Message
Re: BouncyBall 2013/2014
With Zona and SMU next, that streak could definitely be 4 straight before Coppin St. comes to town.
With Zona and SMU next, that streak could definitely be 4 straight before Coppin St. comes to town.
MountieBoyOz
Eater of Worlds
Re: BouncyBall 2013/2014
So I went to this game last night- terrible game- not because we lost, because it was just poorly played- we left at half time when the score was 21-19. The low score was not due to great defense, but really bad shooting as EMU and Michigan had a ton of open chances. Good thing they had $5 tickets and that included watching the wormen get beat by 30.
Anyway, that's not why I'm posting.
But an observation. Looking at the Michigan sidelines- there are 8 players who were clearly back ups- some ready to go, some not so much. Then there's the 5 on the floor- so for the game, 11 players. Perahps 5 more in street clothes at the end of the bench. So call the team 16.
There were also 8 guys in suits. One being the HC. And another 6 or so guys in polo shirts.
That's a really high coach/player ratio and an even higher staff/player ratio. For the actual players, there were as many coaches + staff as players total.
I'm assuming the suit guys were coaches of some type.
What gives with all of those coaches?
It's particularly odd to me when I've been watching hockey for so long and used to seeing at most 3 coaches and two helpers- for the 20 or so players that are there. Heck, even football has way more players than coaches+ staff.
Why do they need so many people to help the team? (not to mention how poorly they play with all of that help)
So I went to this game last night- terrible game- not because we lost, because it was just poorly played- we left at half time when the score was 21-19. The low score was not due to great defense, but really bad shooting as EMU and Michigan had a ton of open chances. Good thing they had $5 tickets and that included watching the wormen get beat by 30.
Anyway, that's not why I'm posting.
But an observation. Looking at the Michigan sidelines- there are 8 players who were clearly back ups- some ready to go, some not so much. Then there's the 5 on the floor- so for the game, 11 players. Perahps 5 more in street clothes at the end of the bench. So call the team 16.
There were also 8 guys in suits. One being the HC. And another 6 or so guys in polo shirts.
That's a really high coach/player ratio and an even higher staff/player ratio. For the actual players, there were as many coaches + staff as players total.
I'm assuming the suit guys were coaches of some type.
What gives with all of those coaches?
It's particularly odd to me when I've been watching hockey for so long and used to seeing at most 3 coaches and two helpers- for the 20 or so players that are there. Heck, even football has way more players than coaches+ staff.
Why do they need so many people to help the team? (not to mention how poorly they play with all of that help)
MissThundercat
Are the cis okay?
Re: BouncyBall 2013/2014
Kobe passed MJ on the all-time scoring list tonight.
Not as big a deal as ESPN makes it out to be. They didn't rewrite the rules for Kobe.
Kobe passed MJ on the all-time scoring list tonight.
Not as big a deal as ESPN makes it out to be. They didn't rewrite the rules for Kobe.
Spartanforlife4
Generic Catchy Message
Re: BouncyBall 2013/2014
The guys with suits are indeed coaches.
All those guys in the polos are managers. I know a couple on Michigan. Believe it or not those guys on the bench don't even make up all the managers. There's also one guy recording the game, plus about 4-6 that don't even get to sit with the team due to bench space.
They probably don't need so many during the game, but they do give a lot of specialized tasks. Two years ago my friend's job was to write the play name for the players during the timeout. At CMU they have a kid whose job is just to track the type of fouls each ref calls. Another simply tracks whether he used the correct mechanics.
I know both my friends were up until 4am in Brooklyn a couple weeks ago after the Oregon win putting together scouting film and a report that would be ready for the coaches in the morning. They also use a lot of guys for rebounding during pregame, to help during drills, and basically make everything "appear" during practice and games so the coaches can focus solely on coaching.
Honestly, I don't know why they have so many compared to other sports, but I would guess part of it is due to attrition. I know quite a few kids quit MSU/UM each year just because it's such a huge time commitment. Hockey and football are generally weekend only, with two or three distinct start times, so there's a routine that you can get into. Basketball, on the other hand, has games any day of the week during the non-conference season, with about 10-12 possible start times. Even when conference season hits the only regularity you have is that you know you won't be playing Monday or Friday, but all others are fair game. That's only Big Ten too, most other conferences still play seven days a week.
The guys with suits are indeed coaches.
All those guys in the polos are managers. I know a couple on Michigan. Believe it or not those guys on the bench don't even make up all the managers. There's also one guy recording the game, plus about 4-6 that don't even get to sit with the team due to bench space.
They probably don't need so many during the game, but they do give a lot of specialized tasks. Two years ago my friend's job was to write the play name for the players during the timeout. At CMU they have a kid whose job is just to track the type of fouls each ref calls. Another simply tracks whether he used the correct mechanics.
I know both my friends were up until 4am in Brooklyn a couple weeks ago after the Oregon win putting together scouting film and a report that would be ready for the coaches in the morning. They also use a lot of guys for rebounding during pregame, to help during drills, and basically make everything "appear" during practice and games so the coaches can focus solely on coaching.
Honestly, I don't know why they have so many compared to other sports, but I would guess part of it is due to attrition. I know quite a few kids quit MSU/UM each year just because it's such a huge time commitment. Hockey and football are generally weekend only, with two or three distinct start times, so there's a routine that you can get into. Basketball, on the other hand, has games any day of the week during the non-conference season, with about 10-12 possible start times. Even when conference season hits the only regularity you have is that you know you won't be playing Monday or Friday, but all others are fair game. That's only Big Ten too, most other conferences still play seven days a week.
Re: BouncyBall 2013/2014
My dad actually noticed the same thing at a smaller state school out west.
The manager ones, I'm ok with- many of them are student volunteers. Or some are work/study kids, too- and this is the (cool) job that they have to do.
I'm even ok with the volunteer coaches.
Since you have friends who may be closer- how many of the coaches are paid staff? To me, if the ratio is even close to 1 coach/ 3 players, something seems odd. More so that such a simple game needs that many coaches and it's still played very randomly.
I guess that's one place all of the athletic money is going....
My dad actually noticed the same thing at a smaller state school out west.
The manager ones, I'm ok with- many of them are student volunteers. Or some are work/study kids, too- and this is the (cool) job that they have to do.
I'm even ok with the volunteer coaches.
Since you have friends who may be closer- how many of the coaches are paid staff? To me, if the ratio is even close to 1 coach/ 3 players, something seems odd. More so that such a simple game needs that many coaches and it's still played very randomly.
I guess that's one place all of the athletic money is going....
Re: BouncyBall 2013/2014
Perhaps it depends upon whether you have a winning program or not?
The UConn men's and women's basketball teams both have a head coach, an associate head coach, and two assistant coaches on staff and have for years. The latter three work with position players on position-specific drills during practice while the head coach oversees the whole program. That hits your "1 coach / 3 players" ratio perfectly.
Part of the situation involves off-season activities (e.g., recruiting). Top-level college coaching these days is year-round, not just during season.
Perhaps it depends upon whether you have a winning program or not?
The UConn men's and women's basketball teams both have a head coach, an associate head coach, and two assistant coaches on staff and have for years. The latter three work with position players on position-specific drills during practice while the head coach oversees the whole program. That hits your "1 coach / 3 players" ratio perfectly.
Part of the situation involves off-season activities (e.g., recruiting). Top-level college coaching these days is year-round, not just during season.
Spartanforlife4
Generic Catchy Message
Re: BouncyBall 2013/2014
I'll expand a bit on what Fish said. That's not only successful programs that go with four coaches, that's all D1 programs. Even NJIT has 4 coaches. One for head coach, one for associate head coach, and two assistants. Between the three assistants, they're generally selected based on strengths. One will be good with defense, another with big men, another with guards, or some combination.
Other guys in suits on the bench include: Director of Basketball Operations (I know MSU puts him on the bench at least), one or two grad assistants, and possibly the trainer, though they may be in the classic polo and khakis.
Now, about pay: Managers aren't paid. It's against NCAA rules because you can only pay a certain number of people on your staff. They are paid during summer camps and whatnot, but cannot be compensated for anything in-season. However, they are allowed to give out some scholarships, which I believe are donor funded endowments. One of my friends got a small scholarship for being one of the head managers. It's actually a decent sized scholly, but when you stretch it out into the amount of hours put in during the year it comes out to near minimum wage, maybe even below.
So, given the 12 scholarships, plus three or four walkons to make it 16, you're looking at a 4 to 1 ratio, 3 to 1 if you include grad assistants.
I'll expand a bit on what Fish said. That's not only successful programs that go with four coaches, that's all D1 programs. Even NJIT has 4 coaches. One for head coach, one for associate head coach, and two assistants. Between the three assistants, they're generally selected based on strengths. One will be good with defense, another with big men, another with guards, or some combination.
Other guys in suits on the bench include: Director of Basketball Operations (I know MSU puts him on the bench at least), one or two grad assistants, and possibly the trainer, though they may be in the classic polo and khakis.
Now, about pay: Managers aren't paid. It's against NCAA rules because you can only pay a certain number of people on your staff. They are paid during summer camps and whatnot, but cannot be compensated for anything in-season. However, they are allowed to give out some scholarships, which I believe are donor funded endowments. One of my friends got a small scholarship for being one of the head managers. It's actually a decent sized scholly, but when you stretch it out into the amount of hours put in during the year it comes out to near minimum wage, maybe even below.
So, given the 12 scholarships, plus three or four walkons to make it 16, you're looking at a 4 to 1 ratio, 3 to 1 if you include grad assistants.
Re: BouncyBall 2013/2014
Well, for all of the coaches that are present, and all of the apparent coaching that goes on year round... well...
Especially what is visible on court with the eleible players. 7-8 suits visible vs. 11 players.
Whereas hockey there are at most 3 guys in suits with 22 players on the bench.
The games seem to be played very equally randomly. Seems like one coach and two assistants should be all that is needed.
Thanks for the clarification.
Well, for all of the coaches that are present, and all of the apparent coaching that goes on year round... well...
Especially what is visible on court with the eleible players. 7-8 suits visible vs. 11 players.
Whereas hockey there are at most 3 guys in suits with 22 players on the bench.
The games seem to be played very equally randomly. Seems like one coach and two assistants should be all that is needed.
Thanks for the clarification.
MountieBoyOz
Eater of Worlds
JF_Gophers
2147483647
Re: BouncyBall 2013/2014
Rondo to the Mavs.
Rondo to the Mavs.
Re: BouncyBall 2013/2014
During games, probably; during practice, maybe; but year-round, when you also factor in recruiting? The coaching staff never has an off-season.
During games, probably; during practice, maybe; but year-round, when you also factor in recruiting? The coaching staff never has an off-season.