Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
Patriot Ledger article on Coyle leaving. www.patriotledger.com
Patriot Ledger article on Coyle leaving. www.patriotledger.com
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Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
- Thread starter steakbomb
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claver2010
*****
Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
He told the Freep he wasn't leaving, I don't believe the Freep could be outscooped by "a 16 year old in Chestnut Hill with an internet connection"
He told the Freep he wasn't leaving, I don't believe the Freep could be outscooped by "a 16 year old in Chestnut Hill with an internet connection"
Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
Just came out of a brief 6 day coma. Don't really feel like reading the posts I missed in the last thread.
Who do you guys think is going to carry the extra burden in the few games Coyle misses at WJC? My money is on Trivino.
Just came out of a brief 6 day coma. Don't really feel like reading the posts I missed in the last thread.
Who do you guys think is going to carry the extra burden in the few games Coyle misses at WJC? My money is on Trivino.
carltonbarrett
New member
Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
If my math is correct, with Coyle and Trivino gone and with Cisse being redshirted, BU now only has 18 skaters on the roster. Better hope there's no injuries....
If my math is correct, with Coyle and Trivino gone and with Cisse being redshirted, BU now only has 18 skaters on the roster. Better hope there's no injuries....
Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
Umm Cisse redshirted last year? 13 forwards until Santana gets healthy, at which point it'd be 14, along with 7 defensemen
Umm Cisse redshirted last year? 13 forwards until Santana gets healthy, at which point it'd be 14, along with 7 defensemen
Harry Cleverly
New member
Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
I don't think that Coyle flunked out. Yet. But his comment that he no longer wanted to be a student-athlete, but to just concentrate on hockey, speaks volumes on where he is academically.
Grades are not out yet. Some finals are still to be taken. But Coyle leaving in midseason, and saying he no longer wants to be a "student-athlete" is like the employee who quits just before they are fired, because they knew what was coming. Coyle most likely knew what was coming, and jumped before he was pushed.
I think BU will really miss what Coyle was finally starting to become on the ice: a real presence. Until recently, I viewed him as all hype and very little push. But he started to do some of the little things, and big things, a lot better.
BU will miss what Coyle might have become in the second half a lot more than what we was over his season and a half. And they will miss Trivino even more, because he was the much better all around player this season.
There are two things that I will remember most about Coyle's BU "career." His best performance came against the University of Toronto in an exhibition game before his varsity career officially started. He looked like the second coming of Colin Wilson that night, and never again. He also "won" Hockey East Rookie of the Year honors almost soley on reputation. The numbers just didn't bear out him receiving the award. You could make a case that Gill, Noonan and Clendening were as deserving as he was.
When some suggested that Coyle might not return for is sophomore year, I thought he would be crazy to go pro after showing so little. Even this year, as he started to play better, he still didn't appear even remotely close to being ready to go.
I wouldn't classify Coyle as a bust by any stretch, but he certainly has not come close to his advanced billing.
For someone that always wanted to play at BU, to follow in the footsteps of his relative, Tony Amonte, and to have been given Amonte's No. 3, and then to walk away in midseason to go to the Quebec Juniors is more than a little disappointing.
I don't think that Coyle flunked out. Yet. But his comment that he no longer wanted to be a student-athlete, but to just concentrate on hockey, speaks volumes on where he is academically.
Grades are not out yet. Some finals are still to be taken. But Coyle leaving in midseason, and saying he no longer wants to be a "student-athlete" is like the employee who quits just before they are fired, because they knew what was coming. Coyle most likely knew what was coming, and jumped before he was pushed.
I think BU will really miss what Coyle was finally starting to become on the ice: a real presence. Until recently, I viewed him as all hype and very little push. But he started to do some of the little things, and big things, a lot better.
BU will miss what Coyle might have become in the second half a lot more than what we was over his season and a half. And they will miss Trivino even more, because he was the much better all around player this season.
There are two things that I will remember most about Coyle's BU "career." His best performance came against the University of Toronto in an exhibition game before his varsity career officially started. He looked like the second coming of Colin Wilson that night, and never again. He also "won" Hockey East Rookie of the Year honors almost soley on reputation. The numbers just didn't bear out him receiving the award. You could make a case that Gill, Noonan and Clendening were as deserving as he was.
When some suggested that Coyle might not return for is sophomore year, I thought he would be crazy to go pro after showing so little. Even this year, as he started to play better, he still didn't appear even remotely close to being ready to go.
I wouldn't classify Coyle as a bust by any stretch, but he certainly has not come close to his advanced billing.
For someone that always wanted to play at BU, to follow in the footsteps of his relative, Tony Amonte, and to have been given Amonte's No. 3, and then to walk away in midseason to go to the Quebec Juniors is more than a little disappointing.
Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
I'm sorry but this is apples and oranges. Frankly, I don't even understand the comparison. You're specifically talking about individuals...no teams involved. Coyle was part of a team. There's a reason this almost never happens in college hockey. It's poor form leaving midseason when you're depended upon as a top six forward.
I'm sorry but this is apples and oranges. Frankly, I don't even understand the comparison. You're specifically talking about individuals...no teams involved. Coyle was part of a team. There's a reason this almost never happens in college hockey. It's poor form leaving midseason when you're depended upon as a top six forward.
Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
Jofa: "The BC crowd is boosting him up so as to make BU look like they really took a big hit. Trust me DW and others were laughing about what a bust Coyle was not that long ago. Overrated was used many times to describe him in the past by the same crowd."
Wait just a minute now...I'm not boosting Coyle up and I've also never called him a bust/overrated. I've been consistent in saying no matter how disappointed you might have been in his development, there's a reason he was your #2 center. The guys behind him aren't any better.
Jofa: "The BC crowd is boosting him up so as to make BU look like they really took a big hit. Trust me DW and others were laughing about what a bust Coyle was not that long ago. Overrated was used many times to describe him in the past by the same crowd."
Wait just a minute now...I'm not boosting Coyle up and I've also never called him a bust/overrated. I've been consistent in saying no matter how disappointed you might have been in his development, there's a reason he was your #2 center. The guys behind him aren't any better.
brassbonanza
Super Serial
Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
I'm with you on this. Coming from the TV/Film program in COM, where 80% of the students had one foot out the door to LA the whole time they were at BU, I get where Dave is coming from, but it's not applicable to sports. Academics are a personal thing, other students don't have anything invested in your success, as they do in sports. So the student who leaves doesn't affect any other student's prospects or success at the school, as is the case with a team losing a player. Also, the scenario Dave laid out would imply that Coyle left for a supposedly better opportunity. Now I'm no expert on the Canadian leagues, but by all accounts, he left to go to an equal at best league, making it more or less a lateral move. Additionally, it was reported that Minnesota told him he could go AHL or Q right now, and he chose the lower level option.
I'm with you on this. Coming from the TV/Film program in COM, where 80% of the students had one foot out the door to LA the whole time they were at BU, I get where Dave is coming from, but it's not applicable to sports. Academics are a personal thing, other students don't have anything invested in your success, as they do in sports. So the student who leaves doesn't affect any other student's prospects or success at the school, as is the case with a team losing a player. Also, the scenario Dave laid out would imply that Coyle left for a supposedly better opportunity. Now I'm no expert on the Canadian leagues, but by all accounts, he left to go to an equal at best league, making it more or less a lateral move. Additionally, it was reported that Minnesota told him he could go AHL or Q right now, and he chose the lower level option.
You never know...BUTerrierfan
New member
Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
While losing 2 of the top players is not something one would wish for, BU is a hockey TEAM, a team sport, so let's see how the TEAM responds. This is an opportunity for players to show that despite these losses, they can and will continue the tradition for success and excellence that is Boston University hockey.
Step it up Terriers!
While losing 2 of the top players is not something one would wish for, BU is a hockey TEAM, a team sport, so let's see how the TEAM responds. This is an opportunity for players to show that despite these losses, they can and will continue the tradition for success and excellence that is Boston University hockey.
Step it up Terriers!
candycanes99
HAVE SOME CLASS
Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
Let me put it this way. Coyle's abilities are very good for his age. Coming from a league like the EJHL, I expected it would take some time for him to adjust, so his current situation hasn't tried my patience. Coyle was making passes his teammates weren't expecting at this level. I think his performance at WJC is going to be a good one and we'll see what we're missing if we look over at the stats he'll put up in a league with exaggerated scoring like the Q. That said, I don't like the Q as much as the NCAA for developing a power forward type. He might emerge with great puck handling skills but might not ever be the guy bullying his way to the net.
Let me put it this way. Coyle's abilities are very good for his age. Coming from a league like the EJHL, I expected it would take some time for him to adjust, so his current situation hasn't tried my patience. Coyle was making passes his teammates weren't expecting at this level. I think his performance at WJC is going to be a good one and we'll see what we're missing if we look over at the stats he'll put up in a league with exaggerated scoring like the Q. That said, I don't like the Q as much as the NCAA for developing a power forward type. He might emerge with great puck handling skills but might not ever be the guy bullying his way to the net.
collegefan06
New member
Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
I'm with you on your assessment but will take it further, which I believe you will disagree with.
I believe Coyle is going to be a very big loss not only for the typical move your 3rd line center to 2nd, etc. but because he did and does so many little things that don't show up on the scoresheet that many fans on this site are not able to appreciate. It's one thing to lose one top player but to have two gone in less then a week will be a body blow for the team.
As to what you will disagree with, I believe the problems this team has and have had in general start at the top with very poor leadership. Many say Jack is a disciplinarian and rationalize that quality that they see (which is just what he chooses to allow fans to see) as the way he is with the players on a day to day basis. I don't know the facts of specifically why Coyle is leaving but my opinion is that this life long Terrier fan didn't value the opportunity to be a BU Hockey player enough to do what he is capable of to stay on the team. If he determined that his BU experience in reality was far from what he expected that may account for much of his not doing what he needed to to remain on the team becuase he'd prefer to live in a very different environment rather then continue in the BU hockey world he's been in.
I don't know how much Parker's public response to the Trivino mess impacted Coyle or others but as I've said repeatedly Jack's public thrashing of Trivino is odd and doesn't add up. There are so many ways to respond to that situation without the public "I told you so" and wrecking him publically as opposed to dealing with details internally is a better way to handle it in my opinion. Going the public route risks a real backlash from the rest of the team who all know what the actual facts with Trivino are and may see Parker's response as very inappropriate.
I respect that others see it differently but I just look at the bottom line, which is constant turmoil with players, kids regularly kicked off the team, trashing of players publically, questionable coaching hires and the list goes on. To me that is a leadership problem and as it comes on so many different fronts I don't know how you don't ultimately look at the one common denominator......Jack Parker.
I'm with you on your assessment but will take it further, which I believe you will disagree with.
I believe Coyle is going to be a very big loss not only for the typical move your 3rd line center to 2nd, etc. but because he did and does so many little things that don't show up on the scoresheet that many fans on this site are not able to appreciate. It's one thing to lose one top player but to have two gone in less then a week will be a body blow for the team.
As to what you will disagree with, I believe the problems this team has and have had in general start at the top with very poor leadership. Many say Jack is a disciplinarian and rationalize that quality that they see (which is just what he chooses to allow fans to see) as the way he is with the players on a day to day basis. I don't know the facts of specifically why Coyle is leaving but my opinion is that this life long Terrier fan didn't value the opportunity to be a BU Hockey player enough to do what he is capable of to stay on the team. If he determined that his BU experience in reality was far from what he expected that may account for much of his not doing what he needed to to remain on the team becuase he'd prefer to live in a very different environment rather then continue in the BU hockey world he's been in.
I don't know how much Parker's public response to the Trivino mess impacted Coyle or others but as I've said repeatedly Jack's public thrashing of Trivino is odd and doesn't add up. There are so many ways to respond to that situation without the public "I told you so" and wrecking him publically as opposed to dealing with details internally is a better way to handle it in my opinion. Going the public route risks a real backlash from the rest of the team who all know what the actual facts with Trivino are and may see Parker's response as very inappropriate.
I respect that others see it differently but I just look at the bottom line, which is constant turmoil with players, kids regularly kicked off the team, trashing of players publically, questionable coaching hires and the list goes on. To me that is a leadership problem and as it comes on so many different fronts I don't know how you don't ultimately look at the one common denominator......Jack Parker.
Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
Very thoughtful and accurate (IMO) synopsis...
Very thoughtful and accurate (IMO) synopsis...
Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
He was thinking of the golfer, Lee Trevino, which IS spelled that way...
He was thinking of the golfer, Lee Trevino, which IS spelled that way...
Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
Can you blame him? With the way all of these coaches have been eviscerated lately! Now everyone is coming out of the woodwork to make an accusation. You knew that once the first crack appeared the floodgates would open. So now we have to sort out what is credible and what is a fabrication. So Parker was being proactive and laying it out there so that there would be NO "misinterpretation." A little too much detail? Maybe...but that's what you get when you rip apart peoples' private lives. You can't have it both ways. The media wants all the skeletons out of the closet? Fine...this is what you get. Nothing is off limits anymore. If you don't like it, go back to the way it was fifty years ago when the media members who traveled with teams had an implicit agreement to keep all of the "personal" stuff out of the papers. Those days are gone. You want the accolades? You get the dirt along with it. Either accept it or get out. These people are put up on a pedestal - rightfully or wrongfully so. It's their choice to get off the pedestal and go do something else. Nobody is FORCING them to be here. In fact, may I be the first to speculate that perhaps there was also something "going on" with Coyle, which is maybe why he is getting out now. Food for thought...
Can you blame him? With the way all of these coaches have been eviscerated lately! Now everyone is coming out of the woodwork to make an accusation. You knew that once the first crack appeared the floodgates would open. So now we have to sort out what is credible and what is a fabrication. So Parker was being proactive and laying it out there so that there would be NO "misinterpretation." A little too much detail? Maybe...but that's what you get when you rip apart peoples' private lives. You can't have it both ways. The media wants all the skeletons out of the closet? Fine...this is what you get. Nothing is off limits anymore. If you don't like it, go back to the way it was fifty years ago when the media members who traveled with teams had an implicit agreement to keep all of the "personal" stuff out of the papers. Those days are gone. You want the accolades? You get the dirt along with it. Either accept it or get out. These people are put up on a pedestal - rightfully or wrongfully so. It's their choice to get off the pedestal and go do something else. Nobody is FORCING them to be here. In fact, may I be the first to speculate that perhaps there was also something "going on" with Coyle, which is maybe why he is getting out now. Food for thought...
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carltonbarrett
New member
Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
Whether or not Coyle lived up to his high expectations doesn't change the fact that he was one of your best all-around players. If Sidney Crosby played for BU and only put up 50 points he would be considered a disappointment too, but he still put up 50 points. As someone else pointed out earlier, Coyle was the guy that could go into the corners with 2 opposing players on his back and somehow find a way to put the puck on a teammates stick right in front of the net. At the end of the day, isn't it better to have blue chipper come in and underachieve and only put up 30 points than to have a walk-on come in and overachieve and put up 20 points? Losing one of these two guys would be tough, but both is going to be really hard to overcome.
Whether or not Coyle lived up to his high expectations doesn't change the fact that he was one of your best all-around players. If Sidney Crosby played for BU and only put up 50 points he would be considered a disappointment too, but he still put up 50 points. As someone else pointed out earlier, Coyle was the guy that could go into the corners with 2 opposing players on his back and somehow find a way to put the puck on a teammates stick right in front of the net. At the end of the day, isn't it better to have blue chipper come in and underachieve and only put up 30 points than to have a walk-on come in and overachieve and put up 20 points? Losing one of these two guys would be tough, but both is going to be really hard to overcome.
Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
Maine had a player who was charged with domestic violence and the team looked into what he did and did NOT throw him off the team.
as I recall... the "victim" who called the police had started a very loud and very in appropriate screaming fit in a public place, yelling at the player's new girlfriend, walking away and coming back to yell and swear even more.... she walked away once again, and the player followed her, trying to calm her down and put his hand on her shoulder to let her know he was right behind her and get her to turn around.
In MAINE, this constitutes the legal definition of battery... unprivileged TOUCHING... she told the cops that she did not give permission... had this happened to anyone else buy a former boyfriend or former husband IN MAINE, nothing would have been done, but IN MAINE, the police are told NOT to use any judgment whatsoever and to make the arrest for domestic violence so he was arrested....
Now... If someone can show that this girl was someone Trivino had visited night after night after night, for a long time... and everything was always hunky dory.. and THEN he visited her while she was trying to study for finals, does that make any difference to any of you?
I know that no means no under the law, but... trying to kiss and fondle the girl he "visited" night after night after night is not quite the same as "repeatedly breaking and entering and attempting sexual assault" (didn't her door have a lock?)
just sayin' (no police report EVER includes anything but allegations that would make a conviction stick, so you are not going to learn about everything that led up to it)
remember back in the day when I was the ONLY poster who stood up for John Sabo??? and I was right?
I completely disagree, IF the dismissal was purely due to the allegation.
Maine had a player who was charged with domestic violence and the team looked into what he did and did NOT throw him off the team.
as I recall... the "victim" who called the police had started a very loud and very in appropriate screaming fit in a public place, yelling at the player's new girlfriend, walking away and coming back to yell and swear even more.... she walked away once again, and the player followed her, trying to calm her down and put his hand on her shoulder to let her know he was right behind her and get her to turn around.
In MAINE, this constitutes the legal definition of battery... unprivileged TOUCHING... she told the cops that she did not give permission... had this happened to anyone else buy a former boyfriend or former husband IN MAINE, nothing would have been done, but IN MAINE, the police are told NOT to use any judgment whatsoever and to make the arrest for domestic violence so he was arrested....
Now... If someone can show that this girl was someone Trivino had visited night after night after night, for a long time... and everything was always hunky dory.. and THEN he visited her while she was trying to study for finals, does that make any difference to any of you?
I know that no means no under the law, but... trying to kiss and fondle the girl he "visited" night after night after night is not quite the same as "repeatedly breaking and entering and attempting sexual assault" (didn't her door have a lock?)
just sayin' (no police report EVER includes anything but allegations that would make a conviction stick, so you are not going to learn about everything that led up to it)
remember back in the day when I was the ONLY poster who stood up for John Sabo??? and I was right?
Re: Boston University 2011-2012 Season Thread: Part III: Now What?
Excellent analogy...and I can vouch for that as someone who lived next to a music major freshman year. That's absolutely true. And part of the reason this is receiving so much attention is BECAUSE 5000 fans go to every game and follow the team. It's an "ongoing" cycle, as opposed to going to the Symphony which is more typically a "once a season" thing (except for those who have season tickets - but those numbers are much smaller than those for sporting events). One doesn't typically "follow" the career of a musician - unless they have REALLY made it big time - and it's no exaggeration to say that THOSE people are literally one in 10 million...
Excellent analogy...and I can vouch for that as someone who lived next to a music major freshman year. That's absolutely true. And part of the reason this is receiving so much attention is BECAUSE 5000 fans go to every game and follow the team. It's an "ongoing" cycle, as opposed to going to the Symphony which is more typically a "once a season" thing (except for those who have season tickets - but those numbers are much smaller than those for sporting events). One doesn't typically "follow" the career of a musician - unless they have REALLY made it big time - and it's no exaggeration to say that THOSE people are literally one in 10 million...
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