Best Arena?

[robertearle]

Re: Best Arena?

Yes, UW reports number of tickets sold.

But with regard to the crowd at the outdoor game at Camp Randall and the discussion here, there was a single ticket for admission to both games. So for the women's game, if they'd reported tickets sold, the number would have been the 50K (or whatever) the crowd for the men's game was reported at. So the 8500 (or whatever) has to have been tickets scanned in by some point in time during the women's game - start of the 3rd period, maybe.

 

[WiscDC]

Re: Best Arena?

Yes, UW reports number of tickets sold.

But according to a web site wunderground.com, there was no snow in Madison the day you describe (Feb 3rd, 2012). I was there, but I have no particular recollection of the day, the game, the crowd, or the weather. I do remember slogging through a heavy snow storm from the bus stop to my bank to use the ATM, and then from the bank to the Kohl Center for a 2 PM start; maybe during the 2009-2010 season? And I don't think I've ever seen that few people at the Kohl Center (since 2008-2009 season, when I moved back to Madison).

I remember that game. I don't remember the exact order of weather events, but I do remember the roads were next to un-driveable.

 

[WiscDC]

Re: Best Arena?

But with regard to the crowd at the outdoor game at Camp Randall and the discussion here, there was a single ticket for admission to both games. So for the women's game, if they'd reported tickets sold, the number would have been the 50K (or whatever) the crowd for the men's game was reported at. So the 8500 (or whatever) has to have been tickets scanned in by some point in time during the women's game - start of the 3rd period, maybe.

I really wonder when the cutoff was. I wonder if people wandering in halfway through the third were counted.

 

[HankScorpio]

Re: Best Arena?

Yes, UW reports number of tickets sold.

But according to a web site wunderground.com, there was no snow in Madison the day you describe (Feb 3rd, 2012). I was there, but I have no particular recollection of the day, the game, the crowd, or the weather. I do remember slogging through a heavy snow storm from the bus stop to my bank to use the ATM, and then from the bank to the Kohl Center for a 2 PM start; maybe during the 2009-2010 season? And I don't think I've ever seen that few people at the Kohl Center (since 2008-2009 season, when I moved back to Madison).

EDIT: by that I mean I don't think I've ever seen as few as the 450 you claim, and NOT that there were that few at the snowstorm game.

Just looked up the weather history too, and I was off by a week! I believe it was the Friday, Jan. 20, 2012 against Minnesota Duluth. One of those Minnesota schools lol. But the reported attendance for that was still 1,924, and there was snow that day.

If that's the case, which you haven't really confirmed, then UND is the exception. Usually major weather events that affect local travel make the discrepancies obvious. Think about any highly-touted sellout streak. That doesn't mean every single ticket was accounted for at every game. I know the Washington Capitals are in a big sellout streak, but you can see enough empty seats to be sure that some of those tickets simply never made it to the venue. The Red Sox had an 820 game sellout streak, which is just over 5 seasons. I don't believe for a second that in a 5 year span, nobody ever ate a Red Sox ticket, whether or not it was their plan.

You may want the information that gives you how many actual people entered the gates, but I don't know what you expect, because it's not only the more common practice, but it's the expected practice. I remember there was a Florida Marlins game after a huge, damaging storm that drew a few hundred people according to head counts. I forget what the paid attendance was, but I know it was at least a few thousand. Nobody lost their mind, because that's what they all expected.

Edit: To be clear, I wish actual attendnance figures were more readily available in any sport. I just never expect them to be.

Well a "sellout" doesn't mean every single seat has someone sitting in it, which you did already point out. You could technically have a sellout and only have 10 people in the building. Sure you sold every ticket possible, but that doesn't mean everyone is there redeeming their tickets. That's why sellouts at the Ralph have different attendance numbers.

I just think there should be a standard to use. Either everyone uses "attendance" which is the number of people that attended. Or everyone reports tickets sold, but that's a very slippery slope when it comes to recruiting. And it's not just women's hockey, it's a lot of minor sports too. Lots of schools have packages where you buy one pass that allows you access to all the minor sports, and then those get counted as a ticket sold for each sport, even if the pass holder never plans on attending a single soccer match in their life.

 

[robertearle]

Re: Best Arena?

Just looked up the weather history too, and I was off by a week! I believe it was the Friday, Jan. 20, 2012 against Minnesota Duluth. One of those Minnesota schools lol. But the reported attendance for that was still 1,924, and there was snow that day.

Three inches.

 

[WiscDC]

Re: Best Arena?

Just looked up the weather history too, and I was off by a week! I believe it was the Friday, Jan. 20, 2012 against Minnesota Duluth. One of those Minnesota schools lol. But the reported attendance for that was still 1,924, and there was snow that day.

That was it! I remember better now. Definitely UMD on a Friday, and even that 1,924 figure rings a bell. I remember looking it up, knowing it would be high.

 

[robertearle]

Re: Best Arena?

I do remember slogging through a heavy snow storm from the bus stop to my bank to use the ATM, and then from the bank to the Kohl Center for a 2 PM start; maybe during the 2009-2010 season?

My best guess is Feb 21, 2009; a Saturday 2 PM start against Bemidji. Seven inches that day. UW web site doesn't have crowd size for the game.

 

[Hux]

I really wonder when the cutoff was. I wonder if people wandering in halfway through the third were counted.

I was told that for the Frozen Fenway game between UNH and Northeastern (2010) they counted the tickets scanned from gates open until the end of the game.

 

[NMH]

Re: Best Arena?

I just think there should be a standard to use. Either everyone uses "attendance" which is the number of people that attended. Or everyone reports tickets sold, but that's a very slippery slope when it comes to recruiting. And it's not just women's hockey, it's a lot of minor sports too. Lots of schools have packages where you buy one pass that allows you access to all the minor sports, and then those get counted as a ticket sold for each sport, even if the pass holder never plans on attending a single soccer match in their life.

Don't forget that scanning your ticket to enter is a fairly recent invention. So until recently there wasn't an easy or accurate way to get a count on the number of people in the building. Getting the number of tickets sold from the computers that issued them was the quickest way to get an attendance number for many, many years and I would bet that's why it became the accepted use number.
Sure, they used things like the little clicker counters and turnstiles and then had to try to add those numbers together to get an actual number of people in the building. It's understandable why this didn't become the standard.

 

[Eeyore]

Re: Best Arena?

It's also worth noting that attendance figures get fudged all the time. The University of Michigan football program is (or at least was when I lived there) notorious for counting everyone on the premises, including players, coaches, and refs in order to ensure that they had the largest crowds in the country. And of all the things to complain that the NCAA needs to straighten out, coming up with uniform rules for counting attendance descends so far down into the trivial that it's not worth getting into.

 

[5550]

Re: Best Arena?

Just finished watching BU and PC over internet. Great game. Couldn't help notice the upgrades to Schnieder since I was there last. Anyone have any first hand impressions of the new digs?

 

[robertearle]

Re: Best Arena?

Don't forget that scanning your ticket to enter is a fairly recent invention. So until recently there wasn't an easy or accurate way to get a count on the number of people in the building. Getting the number of tickets sold from the computers that issued them was the quickest way to get an attendance number for many, many years and I would bet that's why it became the accepted use number.
Sure, they used things like the little clicker counters and turnstiles and then had to try to add those numbers together to get an actual number of people in the building. It's understandable why this didn't become the standard.

It can also occasionally go the other way.

Before the Badgers moved into LaBahn, they used to hold "Kid's Day at the Kohl Center" the closest Friday to Halloween. And they'd schedule a 2 PM women's game to coincide. So from noon until two, kids and adults could come in, wander the halls, get treats from various sponsors, meet team members from other Badger teams (football, BB, golf, rowing, etc) 'shoot a free throw', 'sink a putt', 'play' on a rowing machine, etc etc... and then go in and watch the hockey game, all for free - no ticket at all.

So the reported attendance for the day was the number of tickets sold, which might very well have been a *smaller* number than people in the arena.

(They'd also have 'the Axe' there; I have held the Axe!)

 

[robertearle]

Re: Best Arena?

(We've kind of gone 'off-topic' here, haven't we. Sorry 'bout that.)

 

[WiscDC]

Re: Best Arena?

Don't forget that scanning your ticket to enter is a fairly recent invention. So until recently there wasn't an easy or accurate way to get a count on the number of people in the building. Getting the number of tickets sold from the computers that issued them was the quickest way to get an attendance number for many, many years and I would bet that's why it became the accepted use number.
Sure, they used things like the little clicker counters and turnstiles and then had to try to add those numbers together to get an actual number of people in the building. It's understandable why this didn't become the standard.

At UW Volleyball games, I've seen them use those counter things that you click with your thumb. This year, they started scanning my red card's bar code, but previously, they would just look at it, click the clicker thing, and wave me through. On student nights, however, we just show our IDs, and they let us in without scanning a ticket. I imagine on those nights they'd rather go by the counter thingies.

 

[WiscDC]

Re: Best Arena?

(We've kind of gone 'off-topic' here, haven't we. Sorry 'bout that.)

Back to the original topic - American International wins, easily.

 

[HankScorpio]

Re: Best Arena?

It's also worth noting that attendance figures get fudged all the time. The University of Michigan football program is (or at least was when I lived there) notorious for counting everyone on the premises, including players, coaches, and refs in order to ensure that they had the largest crowds in the country. And of all the things to complain that the NCAA needs to straighten out, coming up with uniform rules for counting attendance descends so far down into the trivial that it's not worth getting into.

Very good point, that's why I think the NCAA should step in and set a rule for what can be reported as attendance.

Back to the original topic - American International wins, easily.

Possibly best quote ever. LOL

 

[Eeyore]

Re: Best Arena?

Very good point, that's why I think the NCAA should step in and set a rule for what can be reported as attendance.

Why do you care that much? What difference does it make?

 

[HankScorpio]

Re: Best Arena?

Why do you care that much? What difference does it make?

Ever heard of recruiting?

 

[Eeyore]

Re: Best Arena?

Ever heard of recruiting?

Yeah, I have and if a recruit is making her choice based upon posted attendance figures, that is itself the problem, not whether the figures adhere to a specific standard. This just is not an important enough matter to merit centralized rules.

 

[HankScorpio]

Re: Best Arena?

Yeah, I have and if a recruit is making her choice based upon posted attendance figures, that is itself the problem, not whether the figures adhere to a specific standard. This just is not an important enough matter to merit centralized rules.

I don't think anyone is making a decision based upon the figures, but you don't think it gets brought up by coaches in the recruiting process? "We have one of the best fan bases in the country, we average 1,300 fans each home game." White lies are still lies.