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Atlantic Hockey Summer News
- Thread starter BC/HE
- Start date
Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News
Come on ... look at a map ... we're not in the "middle of nowhere" ...
we're "at the edge of nowhere" (with a great lake on the other side!).
As you've all been discussing, the academic reputation is a complicated thing and acceptance rate doesn't equal selectivity. My program is very selective, but I tell lots of people each year to not bother applying, that will artificially raise my acceptance rate. I could easily get down below 10% if that was a stat that mattered. RIT is at the very top of the heap in a few select fields and, well, not-so-much in others. Last I heard, the most difficult undergrad program to get into and the one with the highest SATs is Film & Animation.
Another minor point is that RIT is in a growth phase ramping up to about 17K students, where we plan to level off. If our rep. keeps growing as it has, then there will be more applications and the selectivity will go up since our size will be capped.
While I have no problems whatsoever with being part of the AHA, we'd also have no problem holding our own academically and on the ice in the ECAC. My guess is that we aren't moving unless, and until, there is a general shakeup of conferences in the east.
Come on ... look at a map ... we're not in the "middle of nowhere" ...
we're "at the edge of nowhere" (with a great lake on the other side!).
As you've all been discussing, the academic reputation is a complicated thing and acceptance rate doesn't equal selectivity. My program is very selective, but I tell lots of people each year to not bother applying, that will artificially raise my acceptance rate. I could easily get down below 10% if that was a stat that mattered. RIT is at the very top of the heap in a few select fields and, well, not-so-much in others. Last I heard, the most difficult undergrad program to get into and the one with the highest SATs is Film & Animation.
Another minor point is that RIT is in a growth phase ramping up to about 17K students, where we plan to level off. If our rep. keeps growing as it has, then there will be more applications and the selectivity will go up since our size will be capped.
While I have no problems whatsoever with being part of the AHA, we'd also have no problem holding our own academically and on the ice in the ECAC. My guess is that we aren't moving unless, and until, there is a general shakeup of conferences in the east.
Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News
Quite honestly, neither one. I'll stay right where I am - far away from either.
Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News
Will it be in the Consol Energy Center (or whatever they're going to call it)?
If so, that's a huge step-up from the BCA. Of course, if they don't put at least six or seven thousand in the seats, it's going to be a barren wasteland, and atmosphere is going to be hard to come by.
Will it be in the Consol Energy Center (or whatever they're going to call it)?
If so, that's a huge step-up from the BCA. Of course, if they don't put at least six or seven thousand in the seats, it's going to be a barren wasteland, and atmosphere is going to be hard to come by.
Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News
This is for the NCAA Championship event, not the Atlantic Hockey Championship, it should be noted.
This is for the NCAA Championship event, not the Atlantic Hockey Championship, it should be noted.
Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News
Rochester is hardly the middle of nowhere. It's not a top-tier city, but it's not Binghamton, Plattsburgh, or Watertown, either.
Powers &8^]
Rochester is hardly the middle of nowhere. It's not a top-tier city, but it's not Binghamton, Plattsburgh, or Watertown, either.
Powers &8^]
Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News
Actually, Rochester has a similar problem (proportionally).
Powers &8^]
Actually, Rochester has a similar problem (proportionally).
Powers &8^]
CornwallAce
Patron Saint of Defunct Teams
21st Century Schizoid Man
Registered User
Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News
I've never been to Rochester, but Bingo is depressing enough. Didn't half the people move away in the last 30 years or so?
I've never been to Rochester, but Bingo is depressing enough. Didn't half the people move away in the last 30 years or so?
TigerFan86-87
R!!!!...I!!!!!...T!!!!!!
Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News
This coming from a Troy-let
Binghamton and Rochester is like apples and oranges. Depends on your taste in city size. Rochester is significantly larger than Bingo and Rochester's suburbs aren't anywhere near as rural as Bingo's. It's like night and day. And yes, from what I understand, Bingo is in a bit of an economic recession. The city of Rochester isn't much better although Monroe County is doing "ok", all things considered. But being that we're all in this tax & spend state that is as financially strapped as it is, it's a wonder any of us still have jobs.
I don't remember, but I'm guessing whomever called Upstate New York the middle of nowhere must be from Boston. Give me a break. Rochester is the third largest city in New York (second largest if you don't count the cess-pool in downstate). The county has ~ 800k population (may be less after this year's census). So middle of nowhere isn't exactly what I would call it.
This coming from a Troy-let
Binghamton and Rochester is like apples and oranges. Depends on your taste in city size. Rochester is significantly larger than Bingo and Rochester's suburbs aren't anywhere near as rural as Bingo's. It's like night and day. And yes, from what I understand, Bingo is in a bit of an economic recession. The city of Rochester isn't much better although Monroe County is doing "ok", all things considered. But being that we're all in this tax & spend state that is as financially strapped as it is, it's a wonder any of us still have jobs.
I don't remember, but I'm guessing whomever called Upstate New York the middle of nowhere must be from Boston. Give me a break. Rochester is the third largest city in New York (second largest if you don't count the cess-pool in downstate). The county has ~ 800k population (may be less after this year's census). So middle of nowhere isn't exactly what I would call it.
TigerFan86-87
R!!!!...I!!!!!...T!!!!!!
Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News
Geography major, anyone?
When did Boston get relocated to the South?
You do know that if you go pretty much straight WEST on I-90 from Boston, you end up in Buffalo, about 30 minutes from Niagara Falls. So unless I'm missing something, I'm not sure that 2 or 3 degrees difference in latitude indicates a significant difference enough to say NU wants to be the BC of the North, really.
Geography major, anyone?
When did Boston get relocated to the South?
You do know that if you go pretty much straight WEST on I-90 from Boston, you end up in Buffalo, about 30 minutes from Niagara Falls. So unless I'm missing something, I'm not sure that 2 or 3 degrees difference in latitude indicates a significant difference enough to say NU wants to be the BC of the North, really.
Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News
Da*n reading comprehension. Thanks for the clarification.
You're right, compared to Canton, Potsdam, Watertown, Utica, etc., Rochester is hardly the middle of nowhere. But when comparing to Boston (the original comparison, since schiegs brought up BU and BC), Providence, etc., Rochester is very much so the middle of nowhere. Especially when you get out to the more rural-type suburbs (such as Rush, Henrietta, Brockport, etc.).
And, I grew up and lived in Spencerport for 18 years, I think I'm allowed to pass judgement on my home city.
Da*n reading comprehension. Thanks for the clarification.
You're right, compared to Canton, Potsdam, Watertown, Utica, etc., Rochester is hardly the middle of nowhere. But when comparing to Boston (the original comparison, since schiegs brought up BU and BC), Providence, etc., Rochester is very much so the middle of nowhere. Especially when you get out to the more rural-type suburbs (such as Rush, Henrietta, Brockport, etc.).
And, I grew up and lived in Spencerport for 18 years, I think I'm allowed to pass judgement on my home city.
Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News
Something can be a somewhere on its own, and still be in the middle of nowhere relatively speaking.
Las Vegas, for example.
Something can be a somewhere on its own, and still be in the middle of nowhere relatively speaking.
Las Vegas, for example.
Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News
Buffalo is a bit further north than Boston, but you're right it isn't that far north...somehow though in January it sure seems that way. It is probably more like Manchester New Hampshire maybe, which is maybe 75-100 miles north. My point wasn't geography though. It was just that I never quite understood Niagara's insistence on playing in a league like the CHA. It isn't like they were playing against the elite of the sport, and in the AHA/MAAC, where I really think there was a desire to have them, they'd have had a pretty good chance to get tourney bids, and they could have scheduled out of conference probalby as well as they did in the CHA when you look at who other AHA teams play/have played. I'm not knocking the schools in the CHA, but Bimidji isn't Minnesota, nor is Wayne State, Michigan. I'm not sure what the goal was, that's all. For all intents and purposes, both leagues were single bid leagues most years. and at the top, they were both pretty good...both have as many final four teams since they both got autobids as the much more highly heralded ECAC I think, so its not like they had no chance to make a run. The AHA I think has at least as many, maybe more 1st round wins.
By the way, I actually think that it is Buffalo, not Rochester that is the 2nd largest city in New york state. The metro areas might be close though. Not really sure, though I suspect if you include the Canadaian side Buffalo is significantly larger there too.
Geography major, anyone?
When did Boston get relocated to the South?
You do know that if you go pretty much straight WEST on I-90 from Boston, you end up in Buffalo, about 30 minutes from Niagara Falls. So unless I'm missing something, I'm not sure that 2 or 3 degrees difference in latitude indicates a significant difference enough to say NU wants to be the BC of the North, really.
Buffalo is a bit further north than Boston, but you're right it isn't that far north...somehow though in January it sure seems that way. It is probably more like Manchester New Hampshire maybe, which is maybe 75-100 miles north. My point wasn't geography though. It was just that I never quite understood Niagara's insistence on playing in a league like the CHA. It isn't like they were playing against the elite of the sport, and in the AHA/MAAC, where I really think there was a desire to have them, they'd have had a pretty good chance to get tourney bids, and they could have scheduled out of conference probalby as well as they did in the CHA when you look at who other AHA teams play/have played. I'm not knocking the schools in the CHA, but Bimidji isn't Minnesota, nor is Wayne State, Michigan. I'm not sure what the goal was, that's all. For all intents and purposes, both leagues were single bid leagues most years. and at the top, they were both pretty good...both have as many final four teams since they both got autobids as the much more highly heralded ECAC I think, so its not like they had no chance to make a run. The AHA I think has at least as many, maybe more 1st round wins.
By the way, I actually think that it is Buffalo, not Rochester that is the 2nd largest city in New york state. The metro areas might be close though. Not really sure, though I suspect if you include the Canadaian side Buffalo is significantly larger there too.
TigerFan86-87
R!!!!...I!!!!!...T!!!!!!
Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News
Well, just about any city (outside of the jam-packed areas like the New England and the Tri-State NYC areas) will have suburbs that become more rural the farther away from the city you get. I don't think that is enough to classify a city as "in the middle of nowhere". Rush is three suburbs away from Rochester, while Brockport is at least a 30-45 minute drive depending where you're coming from. And I don't know how long it's been since you lived in this area, but currently Henrietta is one of the furthest things from "rural" that you'll find in this area. There is so much space being used for retail and industrial it's probably worse than Greece in that respect. And on top of that, a LOT of people live there, too (it's more affordable than other suburbs that close to the city). There may not be much open space left in that town except in the southern quarter of it closest to Rush. I would classify Spencerport as much more rural than Henrietta any day.
Well, just about any city (outside of the jam-packed areas like the New England and the Tri-State NYC areas) will have suburbs that become more rural the farther away from the city you get. I don't think that is enough to classify a city as "in the middle of nowhere". Rush is three suburbs away from Rochester, while Brockport is at least a 30-45 minute drive depending where you're coming from. And I don't know how long it's been since you lived in this area, but currently Henrietta is one of the furthest things from "rural" that you'll find in this area. There is so much space being used for retail and industrial it's probably worse than Greece in that respect. And on top of that, a LOT of people live there, too (it's more affordable than other suburbs that close to the city). There may not be much open space left in that town except in the southern quarter of it closest to Rush. I would classify Spencerport as much more rural than Henrietta any day.
TigerFan86-87
R!!!!...I!!!!!...T!!!!!!
Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News
I didn't say Rochester was the 2nd largest. I said Rochester was the 3rd largest and then parenthetically said that it was the 2nd if you do not count NYC, the cess-pool in downstate.
I think someone else kind of alluded to it, but their reasoning was that they were hoping to land in either CCHA or HEA within a few years of going D-I. So in the meantime, they'd join what was not so much a conference but a scheduling arrangement for D-I independents where they would not be restricted on scholarships and would have a larger window for NC games against as many quality opponents as possible. Hence they're ability to land an at-large bid to the tournament and beat UNH 5-1, (like who hasn't?) pretty early in their D-I life (fourth year as a program, first or second actually playing a full D-I schedule).
I didn't say Rochester was the 2nd largest. I said Rochester was the 3rd largest and then parenthetically said that it was the 2nd if you do not count NYC, the cess-pool in downstate.
Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News
This was most apparent from the league's own self-described objective of "cost-containment" as one of its primary concerns. Further, a key element of this philosophy was the limitation on scholies (though I think that is a false argument ... scholies do not represent hard costs, i.e., out of pocket expenditures). So, while I agree that we could have scheduled OOC just as well from AHA, though probably a few games less, we could not have taken the ice with the same opportunity for success when we played "up" games.The evidence for that is in the interleague records, you can look it up if you really think you need to.
Is that any clearer for you?
BTW ... originally being from Utica area - when you look at a map of NYS, I think Utica is about as close to the middle as you can get in such an irregularly shaped state. And there is not all that much around it, either, so is Utica truly a little bit of something in the absolute middle of nowhere?
Jim, let me try again. I believe our preference for the CHA essentially revolved around two points. The first was that there was a more serious intent on our part to develop the hockey program to a higher level. Hence, although unsuccessful, we did seriously bid for the ECACHL open spot that went to Q-pac. We continued to hold out hope that we might see one of the Big Four conferences step up "for the greater good" of D1 hockey when it became apparent that CHA would eventually fold. Neither did that happen. We didn't achieve our aspirations ... are you going to blame us for having higher goals and trying to achieve them? But our hopes for a program that reached higher levels in D1 aligned more closely with those of the core schools in CHA than the apparent program objectives of most, if not all, of the AHA schools.
This was most apparent from the league's own self-described objective of "cost-containment" as one of its primary concerns. Further, a key element of this philosophy was the limitation on scholies (though I think that is a false argument ... scholies do not represent hard costs, i.e., out of pocket expenditures). So, while I agree that we could have scheduled OOC just as well from AHA, though probably a few games less, we could not have taken the ice with the same opportunity for success when we played "up" games.The evidence for that is in the interleague records, you can look it up if you really think you need to.
Is that any clearer for you?
BTW ... originally being from Utica area - when you look at a map of NYS, I think Utica is about as close to the middle as you can get in such an irregularly shaped state. And there is not all that much around it, either, so is Utica truly a little bit of something in the absolute middle of nowhere?
Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News
Having spent the last 25 years living in (or at least near) Utica, I often think of it as nothing in the middle of somewhere.
If the volume of discussion in this thread is any indication, then the addition of NU and RMU to the AHA is a major improvement. The only thing that has kept a league thread from falling off the face of the earth has been the in season pick 'em.
I always made it a point to read the CHA thread because it seemed like the folks posting there genuinely supported each other and understood that the sucess of any of the teams benefited the league as a whole. Sometimes it seems that has been missing from the AHA.
Having spent the last 25 years living in (or at least near) Utica, I often think of it as nothing in the middle of somewhere.
If the volume of discussion in this thread is any indication, then the addition of NU and RMU to the AHA is a major improvement. The only thing that has kept a league thread from falling off the face of the earth has been the in season pick 'em.
I always made it a point to read the CHA thread because it seemed like the folks posting there genuinely supported each other and understood that the sucess of any of the teams benefited the league as a whole. Sometimes it seems that has been missing from the AHA.
Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News
Hmmm ... probably a better description than mine.Having spent the last 25 years living in (or at least near) Utica, I often think of it as nothing in the middle of somewhere.