Atlantic Hockey Summer News

[d4rksabre]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

And in the meantime, you can keep growing a fat record that looks rather good in the tournament selection criteria by keeping us around.

We don't spend money, you get free wins. Everyone's happy!

Eventually though, the conference will need to change. The point of bringing in Niagara and Rob Mo is to increase the level of competition in the AHA. Should RIT continue to grow and attract better talent, and subsequently field better teams, there will come a point where playing in the AHA will no longer be beneficial as a means of competitive play if other teams don't also grow.

The hope would be that the recent success of RIT and the introduction of Niagara will help the rest of the conference in attracting higher level players so that the AHA grows as a whole.

 

[TigerFan86-87]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

It seems odd that such a rich, popular, powerhouse program would join us low-lifes instead.

Rich?? I have no idea how rich RIT is, but they've certainly made a fair share of money off of me over the years - 5 yrs undergrad + 8 grad courses to date, not to mention 25 seasons worth of hockey tickets

Popular?? popular amongst whom? I'm not even sure what that would mean. Until the FF run last year, virtually no one in the college sports world outside of Rochester, the AHA, and D-III hockey die-hards had any idea who RIT was. So I'm not sure what point you're making there.

Powerhouse????? Yeah, right. It will be many years before ANY AHA team (RIT, Bentley, or otherwise) will be able to even hint at that description unless they're talking about a non-conference opponent.

 

[schiegs]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

Rich??

Well what are they doing with all the fabulous money from those capacity crowds you metnioned? Certainly not scholarships? They must be swimming in the stuff. Amazed they'd choose to join a conference with a bunch of schools that don't have two hockey nickels to rub together.

Popular?? popular amongst whom?

ibid

Powerhouse?????

Yes, as compared to all those programs you said should be cast aside.

 

[Snively65]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

I don't have a problem with any school that wants to field a DI team, but it would be nice to see real commitments from the schools, on-campus arenas (perhaps with a minimum size), etc. that would result in the good fan support. For years, I heard that RIT couldn't be in DI because our arena was too small ... maybe that was true for some conferences, and if that's so and the AHA was the only conference that would let us in, then we owe the AHA a lot for that opportunity (and for giving us the momentum top get that bigger arena). I hope Bentley and others can do the same.

I think that whenever the economy turns around, which might be a few years unfortunately, you will see Bentley build a rink on campus, which will probably be called an "events center" and seat a couple of thousand.

For the time being, I am just happy to see Bentley get a chance to compete each year with D-I teams like RIT, AF, Army, SH, and HC (it was not that long ago that the Crusaders pulled off half of what RIT did in the NCAAs this past season), and I am looking forward to games with Niagara and Bobby Mo. But, what I really like is seeing the Falcons get up for OOC games and knock off teams like UMass.

 

[komey1]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

Eventually though, the conference will need to change. The point of bringing in Niagara and Rob Mo is to increase the level of competition in the AHA. Should RIT continue to grow and attract better talent, and subsequently field better teams, there will come a point where playing in the AHA will no longer be beneficial as a means of competitive play if other teams don't also grow.

The hope would be that the recent success of RIT and the introduction of Niagara will help the rest of the conference in attracting higher level players so that the AHA grows as a whole.

I think we have seen that in some programs already, which I think is partly due to the success of RIT and Air Force since they joined. Mercyhurst has certainly stepped up their play in the past couple years. Canisius seems to be rebounding from some bad years to be competitive.

One of the key reasons RIT chose to go to the AHA was because there was a chance to be competive in conference quickly. Success has come even quicker than several of us thought with 3 regular season championships, 1 tournament championship, and an improbable run to the Frozen Four. Let's also face that the Ritter really wasn't/isn't suitable to be playing in a major conference. A new arena changes that.

I would love to see the AHA grow as a whole, but some teams really don't apprear to be putting the effort into being a division 1 team for whatever reason. The AHA as a conference won't improve until the bottom tier teams improve. And if there is a shakeup in the landscape of Eastern hockey, the teams putting the effort in may jump to be in a conference with more prestigious teams in it.

 

[schiegs]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

One of the key reasons RIT chose to go to the AHA was because there was a chance to be competive in conference quickly. Success has come even quicker than several of us thought with 3 regular season championships, 1 tournament championship, and an improbable run to the Frozen Four. Let's also face that the Ritter really wasn't/isn't suitable to be playing in a major conference.

So what has changed that AHA might cease to be the best fit for RIT? Is it becasue RIT has fared better than expected? Or, was their the anticipation that the league would become something that it wasn't at the time? If the latter, I would suggest a paralell to "I married him becasue I thought I could change him."

People need to remember the original intent of AHA (MAAC.) It was never designed to be consistently competitive nationally. It was never designed to measure up to ECAC or any other conference for that matter. It was never designed to strike fear in the hearts of OOC opponents. While all of these are certainly worthy of effort and celebration, that is not what this boat is for. This conference was established with the primary purpose of providing a platform for institutions to sponsor a D1 hockey program (for various reasons) in a cost containment environment. These institutions either can not or will not provide the requisite resources to fund a 16 scholarship, 5,000 seat arena, 75-foot jumbotron type of program. If that is the environment you seek, I have bad news, you joined the wrong conference.

The calls for greater resources by the newcomers to the league is akin to going to Bonanza and griping that you can't have a bone-in filet au poivre with a '93 Chateau Lafitte. Capitol Grill is down the street.

 

[Jim]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

So what has changed that AHA might cease to be the best fit for RIT? Is it becasue RIT has fared better than expected? Or, was their the anticipation that the league would become something that it wasn't at the time? If the latter, I would suggest a paralell to "I married him becasue I thought I could change him."

People need to remember the original intent of AHA (MAAC.) It was never designed to be consistently competitive nationally. It was never designed to measure up to ECAC or any other conference for that matter. It was never designed to strike fear in the hearts of OOC opponents. While all of these are certainly worthy of effort and celebration, that is not what this boat is for. This conference was established with the primary purpose of providing a platform for institutions to sponsor a D1 hockey program (for various reasons) in a cost containment environment. These institutions either can not or will not provide the requisite resources to fund a 16 scholarship, 5,000 seat arena, 75-foot jumbotron type of program. If that is the environment you seek, I have bad news, you joined the wrong conference.

The calls for greater resources by the newcomers to the league is akin to going to Bonanza and griping that you can't have a bone-in filet au poivre with a '93 Chateau Lafitte. Capitol Grill is down the street.

Sheigs,
You hit it exactly on the head. The AHA is in a sense to hockey what a conference like say the Northeast Conference, or the America East are to basketball. They don't go in EXPECTING to win national Championships. But from time to time, their to teams CAN give anyone a run. And given the nature of the sport, in a 1 and done format, hockey is much more even than sports like basketball. What I look for in the AHA are good compettetive league games, and the occasional upset outside the league. Holy Cross's run a couple of years ago, RIT's last season, those are great and fun.

I guess I find it a bit obnoxious, too for newcomers to the league to be DEMANDING an increase in scholarships, or tha tothers build bigger or better facilities or that the "West" steal Sacred Heart and form its own league...as if their former league didn't collapse in part because 2 members, Army and Air Force, preferred to play in the AHA. And hey, instead of that plan, what if AHA had said, "Why not just let Niagara and Robert Morris fend for THEMSELVES?" Probalby both would have dropped the sport with the collapse of the CHA. As for RIT, they have a great history and tradition...in Division III. We're glad to have them, but jeesh, once again, they approached the AHA, not the other way around...theycould always stay D-3...

 

[CornwallAce]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

Publicly want to second Schiegs and Jim.

 

[RITShockSquad]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

On the plus side of this east vs west, newcomers vs ex-MAAC stuff, is that there is actually discussion on a non-pick'em AHA thread for the first time in a while

Now only if people would talk about actual hockey.....

 

[kingdobbs]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

On the plus side of this east vs west, newcomers vs ex-MAAC stuff, is that there is actually discussion on a non-pick'em AHA thread for the first time in a while

Now only if people would talk about actual hockey.....

Well, I thought I'd have something to talk about, but it turns out that when I went to Frietas today, the doors were locked.

Something about being on summer break or something. Let me tell you, a July without hockey is like a...bad thing without a good thing. I'm not up on my analogies today.

I'm sure if you give me until about...October 9th or so, I'll have had some hockey to talk about.

 

[MICZamboni]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

On the plus side of this east vs west, newcomers vs ex-MAAC stuff, is that there is actually discussion on a non-pick'em AHA thread for the first time in a while

Now only if people would talk about actual hockey.....

By the way, who won last season's regular season AHA pick'em?

 

[AFHockeyFan]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

there are certain programs in this conference that are barely (if at all) supported by their schools ($, facilities, fans) and in no way close to the way a Division I program should.

And who kill the RPI, respectability and out-of-conference record of the entire conference. And most of them reside in the East. Did anyone notice that a CHA team got an at-large bid last year? Even in their best seasons, neither Air Force nor RIT were close to making that happen.

The AHA as a conference won't improve until the bottom tier teams improve.

This.

On the plus side of this east vs west, newcomers vs ex-MAAC stuff, is that there is actually discussion on a non-pick'em AHA thread for the first time in a while!

And this.

 

[schiegs]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

And who kill the RPI, respectability and out-of-conference record of the entire conference. And most of them reside in the East. Did anyone notice that a CHA team got an at-large bid last year? Even in their best seasons, neither Air Force nor RIT were close to making that happen.

Why would anyone join a conference filled with such teams?

 

[AFHockeyFan]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

Probably because there wasn't any room in the "Big-4," and the only other "non-Big-4" conference was folding. But that doesn't mean it's OK for the AHA to remain mired in mediocrity for the foreseeable future.

Why is it so wrong to want the conference to get better (which, by the way, is happening whether you like it or not)? Why shouldn't Bentley, AIC, Sacred Heart and Canisius want to get out of their frozen rental barns and build viable, successful programs? Why is it wrong to think the AHA might be better off without them if they don't make a committment to improve their programs?

You didn't see Air Force whining and complaining when Boise State joined the Mountain West, even though it knocks them one peg lower in the bowl pecking order. Overall, it's an improvement to the conference, and it helps with revenue and recruiting to be part of a prestigious conference.

 

[schiegs]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

Probably because there wasn't any room in the "Big-4," and the only other "non-Big-4" conference was folding.

No one joined CHA because it was folding? CHA was folding because no one would join it. Here was a conference (with the door wide open) that matched the description many seem to want of the AHA, yet.....?

Why is it so wrong to want the conference to get better (which, by the way, is happening whether you like it or not)? Why shouldn't Bentley, AIC, Sacred Heart and Canisius want to get out of their frozen rental barns and build viable, successful programs?

Not wrong to want. Very wrong to join a conference who's m.o. is cost containment and then b!+ch about it.

Why is it wrong to think the AHA might be better off without them if they don't make a committment to improve their programs?

Boise State probably thinking the same thing about Air Force.

when Boise State joined the Mountain West, even though it knocks them one peg lower in the bowl pecking order.

Flat out wrong (if referring to the MWC being knocked down.)

 

[kingdobbs]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

And who kill the RPI, respectability and out-of-conference record of the entire conference. And most of them reside in the East. Did anyone notice that a CHA team got an at-large bid last year? Even in their best seasons, neither Air Force nor RIT were close to making that happen.

Factually untrue. In 2008-09, Air Force's ranking in the PWR was 14.

 

[komey1]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

Like it or not, I feel that RIT and Air Force have raised the profile of the conference itself. When RIT joined, many posters warned us of that there would be "AHA teams don't deserve to go to the NCAAs". And if I am not mistaken, prior to Holy Cross winning, I believe the best an AHA team had done is stay within 3 goals.

Now, nobody is saying that. Air Force almost beat Minnesota in their first NCAA tournament. Then a couple years later win a game and went to OT in the next game where they were beat by a puck going through the net. Last season, RIT made their great run.

The AHA is good for what it is - cost containment. But should that mean mediocrity? RIT and Air Force have shown it can be done. Maybe these teams are the "great" players on a team that wonder why nobody else can do what they do. Now now, it makes sense for RIT and AFA to stay in the conference. But if there is a shakup in conferences or changes in policy (i.e. RIT moving full DI to offer scholarships), then you could see changes.

 

[CornwallAce]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

You lost me at the Boise State comment....

As someone who follows AIC, I can say that sure! I'd love to see them do better, but if they don't, life goes on. Yes hockey is enjoyable, and winning is enjoyable, but there's more than hockey. Like this story.
"and was one of 24 American International College student-athletes to be named to the AHA all-Academic Team, setting a new league record for the most individuals to make the all-Academic Team from one institution."
http://www.aicyellowjackets.com/news/2010/7/2/MIH_0702101357.aspx

Because i have not been a wise *** today, let me trow this out. If you want better competition, send some ECAC players to the AHA East teams.

Probably because there wasn't any room in the "Big-4," and the only other "non-Big-4" conference was folding. But that doesn't mean it's OK for the AHA to remain mired in mediocrity for the foreseeable future.

Why is it so wrong to want the conference to get better (which, by the way, is happening whether you like it or not)? Why shouldn't Bentley, AIC, Sacred Heart and Canisius want to get out of their frozen rental barns and build viable, successful programs? Why is it wrong to think the AHA might be better off without them if they don't make a committment to improve their programs?

You didn't see Air Force whining and complaining when Boise State joined the Mountain West, even though it knocks them one peg lower in the bowl pecking order. Overall, it's an improvement to the conference, and it helps with revenue and recruiting to be part of a prestigious conference.

 

[kingdobbs]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

You lost me at the Boise State comment....

"The addition of Boise State to the Mountain West means that there are now four teams instead of three who are generally better than Air Force, meaning that Air Force now will likely be the fifth best choice for MWC-contracted bowls."

Of course, with Utah leaving for the Pac-Ten, that basically makes it a wash.

 

[AFHockeyFan]

Re: Atlantic Hockey Summer News

No one joined CHA because it was folding? CHA was folding because no one would join it. Here was a conference (with the door wide open) that matched the description many seem to want of the AHA, yet.....?


Not wrong to want. Very wrong to join a conference who's m.o. is cost containment and then b!+ch about it.


Boise State probably thinking the same thing about Air Force.


Flat out wrong (if referring to the MWC being knocked down.)

No, referring to Air Force being knocked one peg lower on the Mountain West's bowl pecking order. And Air Force isn't one of the programs holding the MWC back. They've had winning records and bowl appearances the past three seasons.

I guess I just don't understand the "cost containment" argument. Help me out. It must go something like this: "We want to offer D-1 hockey, but we're not going to commit to it financially and are therefore satisfied with perennially being in the bottom 10 in the country and having a winning season every once in a while just to keep our 500 fans and alumni satisfied."

I mean, what's the point in that? If you're going to do something, at least put a little effort into it. If it's not worth doing right, then it's not worth doing at all. Either ***** or get off the pot. Surely a decent accounting school can figure out how to run the numbers and make it work.

Factually untrue. In 2008-09, Air Force's ranking in the PWR was 14.

Only because they won the conference tournament. A loss, even in the championship game, would have tumbled them out of the Top 16. They were 19th going into the conference tournaments:
http://ndgoon.blogspot.com/2009/03/pair-wise-predictor-is-up.html
Trust me. I remember running the predictors. The only way they made the field was to win the tournament.

"The addition of Boise State to the Mountain West means that there are now four teams instead of three who are generally better than Air Force, meaning that Air Force now will likely be the fifth best choice for MWC-contracted bowls."

Of course, with Utah leaving for the Pac-Ten, that basically makes it a wash.

Yes, that's what I meant--for the whole 5 days between Boise joining and Utah leaving.