AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

[JohnsonsJerseys]

Re: AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

I know some programs in AH have been pushing for years to make this scholarship increase happen. I wonder how much of this move was that ground swell finally turning to action and how much of it might have been a defensive posture by AH to eliminate any potential motivation for a team to jump out of the conference if they see another D-I college shake-up on the horizon?

Ryan J

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

Re: AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

I have to agree that this helps offset some of the bad news coming out of the west.

 

[blazer777]

Re: AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

Ivy students are rich and therefore don't need the money. Money doesn't always matter. The academy students don't pay tuition but are bound to work for the branch for a set number of years after graduation. Is that a scholarship? I'd say so, everyone has to work somewhere. They know that deal going in.

Actually, it falls under the Federal Work Study Program .....of course it's a scholarship, you get a scholarship, he gets a scholarship, everybody gets a scholarship who attends a military academy. I believe David Robinson did not have to serve any time on active duty after he graduated though so there are exceptions to the rule that you have to give 6 years back to the service where you attended school.

 

[Snively65]

Re: AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

Might be because they get to play Army two to three times a year in the AHA and only once if they weren't in the conference. Plus...with Navy joining D-1 in hockey and the AHA, it's a party! (please note, I have no evidence to support this statement!)

Two times one year, and four times another year, right?

 

[giwan]

Re: AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

Actually, it falls under the Federal Work Study Program .....of course it's a scholarship, you get a scholarship, he gets a scholarship, everybody gets a scholarship who attends a military academy. I believe David Robinson did not have to serve any time on active duty after he graduated though so there are exceptions to the rule that you have to give 6 years back to the service where you attended school.

He did serve but only 2 yrs and regardless it was probably the best PR for the Navy. He also needed and got special consideration as he was too tall to even join.

 

[Go___Tech_Gold]

Re: AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

Might be because they get to play Army two to three times a year in the AHA and only once if they weren't in the conference. Plus...with Navy joining D-1 in hockey and the AHA, it's a party! (please note, I have no evidence to support this statement!)

Back to scholarships, it's a shame the NCAA has a rule that reduces a teams ability to compete (not that RIT is hurting from it for the most part) but imagine if they could offer them, I think they would!

If you look at Navy's website on this question they say they don't want to set them up to fail by going D1.

D1 Hockey is also expensive.

 

[joecct]

If you look at Navy's website on this question they say they don't want to set them up to fail by going D1.

D1 Hockey is also expensive.

For the price of one F-35 aircraft, you could fund Navy Hockey in perpetuity.

 

[jericho]

Re: AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

The academy students don't pay tuition but are bound to work for the branch for a set number of years after graduation. Is that a scholarship? I'd say so, everyone has to work somewhere. They know that deal going in.

I believe that rule applies only if they stay all four years, correct? If they leave after two, they don't have to go serve. But your point is still valid.

 

[blazer777]

Re: AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

He did serve but only 2 yrs and regardless it was probably the best PR for the Navy. He also needed and got special consideration as he was too tall to even join.

Navy Recruiter....hmmm, you seem too tall to join.

David Robinson...I'm an excellent basketball player!

Navy Recruiter...Off to the Academy you go!

Yes, quite the PR job for the Navy but they all knew he'd never get sea duty out of this gig but it was a good result for all involved.

 

[blazer777]

Re: AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

Two times one year, and four times another year, right?

Sure, why not....play AFA one night, an OCC game the next out in Denver and vice versa or just play each other in their own barns for two games twice a year. I could research it but I bet their attendance is at the max when they play each other.

 

[blazer777]

Re: AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

Ivy students are rich and therefore don't need the money. Money doesn't always matter. The academy students don't pay tuition but are bound to work for the branch for a set number of years after graduation. Is that a scholarship? I'd say so, everyone has to work somewhere. They know that deal going in.

Looks like they changed the rules for athletes at West Point back in 2005. If they sign a pro contract, just two years of service required and four years in the reserves.

http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/west_point_to_loosen_service_requirements_for_athletes/

So, your David Robinson two years of service would make sense as this rule probably apply to all academy's

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

I believe that rule applies only if they stay all four years, correct? If they leave after two, they don't have to go serve. But your point is still valid.

The second you start your junior year, you are committed. Leaving after two is not a commitment.

 

[TigerFan86-87]

Re: AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

Ivy students are rich and therefore don't need the money.

That's not necessarily true. Many are from wealthy families, but as has been stated, there is need-based financial aid for the rest of the real world to have a chance to attend... IF AND ONLY IF they can actually get in academically. The Ivy League stance is that academics are the priority. Students can play sports while in school if they so desire. They aren't going to be given any financial incentive to do so, at least not any more than any other student has access to. It's kind of impressive they are able to recruit athletes that can balance the demands of both an Ivy League education and Division I competition. Most of the schools that prioritize athletics this way are Division III and would hardly dream of competing at that level.

 

[TigerFan86-87]

Re: AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

Technically AFA and Army are the only schools that can give more than 18 scholarships the whole team is on scholarship.

The NCAA rule says only 18 hockey specific scholarships but a school can give everyone a scholarship and that's ok.

Even if you consider the academy athletes to be on "scholarship" (to a school that has no tuition), the fact that the entire team is on "scholarship" is offset by the fact that the entire school is on "scholarship". The rules about financial assistance are usually interpreted with respect to how it is available to athletes in comparison to the rest of the student body at that school. There aren't many, if any, athletes that attend military academies for sports only. That military commitment is not a trivial thing. And besides, admission to a military academy isn't exactly a walk in the park. Not only are the requirements stringent, you also need one of your state's Senators to sponsor you, if I understand correctly.

 

[TigerFan86-87]

Re: AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

The unusual 16 limit was designed to keep bigger schools out of the conference but eventually Army and Air Force joined which actually can offer more than 18 since all the students are on scholarship, since they are not hockey-specific it was a loophole, finally rendered moot by this change.

Actually, the limit used to be even less than the 14 it is now. It was not that way to keep larger schools out (like any would really want to join this conference anyhow). The MAAC and eventually AHA was founded with cost containment one of their primary objectives so that Division I programs that didn't have the resources (or the desire, in some cases) to fully support an actual D-I hockey team would have a place to play and compete with similar programs.

 

[TigerFan86-87]

Re: AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

Ivy league colleges have no athletic scholarships but everyone is entitled to needs based financial assistance so no issue with attracting kids and competing. RIT is also needs based financial assistance no issue there,

You make that sound so easy. Those are very expensive schools. Not many students qualify for full financial need assistance. So there still is a fair amount of cost to attending these institutions for most students. Not all athletes are willing so shell that kind of cash out, especially if there is a scholarship out there and available at another comparable program.

 

[giwan]

Re: AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

You make that sound so easy. Those are very expensive schools. Not many students qualify for full financial need assistance. So there still is a fair amount of cost to attending these institutions for most students. Not all athletes are willing so shell that kind of cash out, especially if there is a scholarship out there and available at another comparable program.

I'm quite sure RIT does not have the financial endowment like the Ivies do to give out FA. What is the story on RIT and Union deal with the NCAA. Doesn't make sense to cut a deal that says sure we'll let you play up but we will handicap you because of this this this.........

 

[Patman]

I'm quite sure RIT does not have the financial endowment like the Ivies do to give out FA. What is the story on RIT and Union deal with the NCAA. Doesn't make sense to cut a deal that says sure we'll let you play up but we will handicap you because of this this this.........

It's not Division I's doing, it's division iii's doing and it's been that way since the 1980s when they eliminated scholarships at that level save for grandfathered programs playing at a higher level.

People don't usually realize this but there are different governing bodies for each of the 3 levels under the NCAA banner. Some things cover all divisions but not all things

 

[kwm4385]

Re: AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

I'm quite sure RIT does not have the financial endowment like the Ivies do to give out FA. What is the story on RIT and Union deal with the NCAA. Doesn't make sense to cut a deal that says sure we'll let you play up but we will handicap you because of this this this.........

RIT has made it clear they are more than willing to give out the full amount of scholarships if allowed. Our endowment is more than almost all of the rest of the AHC combined.
Here's an article with more info, also includes a quote that Union is still uninterested in getting scholarships. http://www.democratandchronicle.com.../01/31/rit-hockey-ncaa-scholarships/22651989/

 

[blazer777]

Re: AHA Ups Scholarship Limit to 18

Even if you consider the academy athletes to be on "scholarship" (to a school that has no tuition), the fact that the entire team is on "scholarship" is offset by the fact that the entire school is on "scholarship". The rules about financial assistance are usually interpreted with respect to how it is available to athletes in comparison to the rest of the student body at that school. There aren't many, if any, athletes that attend military academies for sports only. That military commitment is not a trivial thing. And besides, admission to a military academy isn't exactly a walk in the park. Not only are the requirements stringent, you also need one of your state's Senators to sponsor you, if I understand correctly.

Except this guy from AFA who got Bernie Sanders to sponsor him!

Number -11
Name - Renda, Vince
Hometown - Montreal, Quebec
Last Team - Brockville Bears (CCHL)