What's new
USCHO Fan Forum

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

  • The USCHO Fan Forum has migrated to a new plaform, xenForo. Most of the function of the forum should work in familiar ways. Please note that you can switch between light and dark modes by clicking on the gear icon in the upper right of the main menu bar. We are hoping that this new platform will prove to be faster and more reliable. Please feel free to explore its features.

2020 Democratic Challengers III: The Wrath of Warren

Status
Not open for further replies.
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: The Wrath of Warren

You either haven’t been paying attention or are a complete idiot lol. His record on voting against desegregated busing, mass incarceration, and pining for the days of working with segregationists, speaks for itself.

Even Ta-Nehisi Coates said he didn’t think Biden was a racist. So maybe you should stop with the Trumpian lying about your political opponents.

This is the part where you reply with a childish half-capitalized post.
 
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: The Wrath of Warren

I am in Seth's district and he truly is fantastic. I do think he is ahead of his time here though. When he first ran for congress I immediately viewed him as a potential candidate for 2028 or 2032.... gain more experience in congress then run for Markey's seat when he retries, or for Governor after Baker. I hope his run here does not hurt any future chances he has, but rather gives him better name recognition for future consideration.

I work in his district so that's how I've seen him (he's come by my workplace as a guest speaker). Before he announced for this go around, I had also pegged him for 4-8 years down the road (depending on how 2020 went).
 
I almost can't believe that my entire prime earning years have been watching this dumpster fire go from a small blaze to a complete inferno.

It’s gotten more and more depressing. We’re so propagandized that we still have millions who somehow idolize these dip****s who bought Atlas Shrugged when they feared they might lose a few of their millions and feared the people might turn to socialism.

The ceo I mentioned talked about “right sizing” the company and used the talking point that they were quick to downsize when he wanted to sway the board to his favor.
 
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: The Wrath of Warren

He also said Biden shouldn't be President, which I would agree with, but we're also living in a world where Dump is the current CinC.

I’m not sure how that’s relevant. I mean it is, but not to the point we’re debating.
 
Not to mention, should we really judge some 1975 opinions by 2019 standards?
Certain candidates currently running were marching with civil rights activists back then...
Even Ta-Nehisi Coates said he didn’t think Biden was a racist. So maybe you should stop with the Trumpian lying about your political opponents.

This is the part where you reply with a childish half-capitalized post.
He’s not the sole arbiter of whether someone is racist or not.
 
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: The Wrath of Warren

He also said Biden shouldn't be President, which I would agree with, but we're also living in a world where Dump is the current CinC.

No he shouldnt be...but if it is Biden vs. GOP (let alone Trump) the answer is clear. Any sort of rationalization otherwise is ridiculous.

Kepler has said it best a thousand times...the worst Democrat is better than the best Republican currently. It wasnt always this way and it wont always be this way but for now it is 100% true.
 
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: The Wrath of Warren

Certain candidates currently running were marching with civil rights activists back then...He’s not the sole arbiter of whether someone is racist or not.

Nope, but he’s certainly better than you or me.
 
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: The Wrath of Warren

How exactly do you figure that? There’s plenty of smart people saying otherwise.
 
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: The Wrath of Warren

Kepler has said it best a thousand times...the worst Democrat is better than the best Republican currently. It wasnt always this way and it wont always be this way but for now it is 100% true.

Screw Kepler. I came up with that! :mad: ;)
 
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: The Wrath of Warren

Kepler has said it best a thousand times...the worst Democrat is better than the best Republican currently. It wasnt always this way and it wont always be this way but for now it is 100% true.

I have my doubts that we'll ever see a better Republican again. There are too many issues right now they're dead wrong on. Maybe in a 100 years.
 
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: The Wrath of Warren

I have my doubts that we'll ever see a better Republican again. There are too many issues right now they're dead wrong on. Maybe in a 100 years.

Given the trajectory of the party since 1978 I cannot imagine this continues for much longer. 40 years ago the GOP was a center-right, corporatist party, basically indistinguishable from mainline conservatives in Canada or Europe. In the 80s they embraced stupidity with Reagan, and in the 90s they embraced hatred with Gingrich. In the 00s they became militarist with Dubya, and now they've gone full bore fascist with Dump. There just isn't anywhere to go farther right without an actual coup and the end of the rule of law. And as Dump edges towards that and the rest of the GOP talk themselves into justifying it by accusing us of that which they themselves are doing, the system breaks at that point -- we will actually get tanks in the streets if this keeps up.

I'm not saying they can't win; they've gotten this far. But we are close to a core dump confrontation. Until now it's been a continuous function but we are close to the Tyrannical Singularity.
 
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: The Wrath of Warren

Except you are defending those that, in your example, would be acting counter to that.
No I'm saying what is realistically going to happen and why. There's a reason so many people who are either moderate or on the left have completely tuned out of electoral politics and that's many decades in the making. The party has literally abandoned the working class, they don't do **** for unions or labor or poor people, Bill Clinton's admin basically just sold the poor people out during his administration as did Obama during the housing crisis (we all saw what happened to black wealth during that time and why) and all the hope and change rhetoric went out the window the second he got into office and brought the Citibank board into his cabinet. On the right they have the infrastructure built via terrestrial radio, cable news, and now facebook where they can just scare their rube voters into voting but that same fear doesn't resonate with the center/left nearly as much and the $$$$/infrastructure isn't quite there either.

Heck, I don't think I even voted in 2014 because I was renting, didn't have my license up to date with my new address, and nobody was home to vouch for me to go vote and the utilities weren't in my name. And I wasn't dirt poor, lived in liberal MN where it's relatively easy to vote, rather than say a poor person from Alabama where you have to go 50 miles outside the city on the third weds of the month during work hours to get your voter ID and somehow do it via public transit. And I'm someone who's relatively well educated and saw the importance of voting just to avoid another Bush II or worse.

If those people think their vote is just going to go to some snake oil salesman who is barely better than a Republican they're just not going to vote, they deem it not worth their time because things likely won't change for the better (and let's be honest, they didn't under the regimes mentioned and Clinton got lucky with the tech boom). Christ my brother is a doctor and has gotten completely apathetic about politics, pretty sure he voted for Gary Johnson while living in WI in 2016. Obviously people who are super tuned in to politics and discuss it online or whatever know the importance of the Supreme Court and the appointment of federal judges but if you think the average person, even relatively intelligent ones, get the importance of it, you're deluding yourself. You seem to live in some fantasy land where people are just going to magically make these calculations and vote for the lesser of evils when history has repeatedly shown that they haven't. And if you think they're solely to blame for this (and I'm not absolving them of all blame but American exceptionalism is a thing and people didn't think fascism can ever happen here until it did) you're absolving the party of all responsibility for its decades of failure. Which is ludicrous.
 
Last edited:
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: The Wrath of Warren

A couple of thoughts:

1) Sorry Kep, but Republicans will continue to get worse. You don't just cure racial resentment overnight even if they do suffer a few electoral setbacks. As long as whiny Baby Boomer and Silent Generation loons represent the dominant block in that party, its going to get a lot worse before it gets worse. Think Louis Goehmert or Jim Jordan as a future presidential nominee.

2) trix, you basically want to live in a world where there's no personal responsibility whatsoever. The people who decide to drop out if they don't get 100% of what they want are the heroes, and everybody else is a sell out. That's great, but it goes both ways. Spewing hate rhetoric about fellow Dems will only make you people persona non grata when the Dems do actually achieve power. I'm sure you'd consider that to be a badge of honor, but it keeps you that much further away from getting anything accomplished. You then become Scooby - perpetually disappointed but never in doubt.

But you do serve a purpose. You are exhibit A of why Kep's socialist revolution will never happen. At some point most people leave college, and their parents basement, get jobs and take on added responsibilities (marriage, house, kids, etc). When that starts happening, absolutism starts losing its appeal because its unworkable if life as it is in politics. May you someday leave mom and dad's house and experience this yourself. ;)
 
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: The Wrath of Warren

And you want to live in a world where the party that has failed miserably for a long time is completely absolved of responsibility for Trump. Sorry but we've historically seen here and elsewhere that neoliberal reforms tend to lead to fascism in the long run and this is a well documented phenomenon. Just because you're historically illiterate and don't want to acknowledge it doesn't magically absolve you of responsibility.
 
Last edited:
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: The Wrath of Warren

No I'm saying what is realistically going to happen and why. There's a reason so many people who are either moderate or on the left have completely tuned out of electoral politics and that's many decades in the making. The party has literally abandoned the working class, they don't do **** for unions or labor or poor people, Bill Clinton's admin basically just sold the poor people out during his administration as did Obama during the housing crisis (we all saw what happened to black wealth during that time and why) and all the hope and change rhetoric went out the window the second he got into office and brought the Citibank board into his cabinet. On the right they have the infrastructure built via terrestrial radio, cable news, and now facebook where they can just scare their rube voters into voting but that same fear doesn't resonate with the center/left nearly as much and the $$$$/infrastructure isn't quite there either.

Heck, I don't think I even voted in 2014 because I was renting, didn't have my license up to date with my new address, and nobody was home to vouch for me to go vote and the utilities weren't in my name. And I wasn't dirt poor, lived in liberal MN where it's relatively easy to vote, rather than say a poor person from Alabama where you have to go 50 miles outside the city on the third weds of the month during work hours to get your voter ID and somehow do it via public transit. And I'm someone who's relatively well educated and saw the importance of voting just to avoid another Bush II or worse.

If those people think their vote is just going to go to some snake oil salesman who is barely better than a Republican they're just not going to vote, they deem it not worth their time because things likely won't change for the better (and let's be honest, they didn't under the regimes mentioned and Clinton got lucky with the tech boom). Christ my brother is a doctor and has gotten completely apathetic about politics, pretty sure he voted for Gary Johnson while living in WI in 2016. Obviously people who are super tuned in to politics and discuss it online or whatever know the importance of the Supreme Court and the appointment of federal judges but if you think the average person, even relatively intelligent ones, get the importance of it, you're deluding yourself. You seem to live in some fantasy land where people are just going to magically make these calculations and vote for the lesser of evils when history has repeatedly shown that they haven't. And if you think they're solely to blame for this (and I'm not absolving them of all blame but American exceptionalism is a thing and people didn't think fascism can ever happen here until it did) you're absolving the party of all responsibility for its decades of failure. Which is ludicrous.

Then realistically, they are to blame. It doesnt matter if they are right in every way their choice is still on them. They would screw over everyone else for their beliefs. That is their right but no amount of "well we did it for this reason" changes the basic fact. You either vote Dem or you are helping the R. That is all we have now.

And the annoying thing is, when they cause the loss they will be the first in the streets protesting looking like fools. You want to move the country back Left you friggin win. You dont throw the game and protest after the fact. Rover is right you get Biden in office and you win more Progressive members in Congress. Biden doesnt have the stomach to fight Progressive Wing (especially not a vocal and powerful one like exists now) so if he wins he can be moved. He is far from perfect, but for Pete's sake he will be Lincoln compared to Trump. Then, if the Progressives have learned anything, you bolster up for the next step in the move Left. If Biden wins you play the long game...you do it right you will have even more power in 4 or 8 years plus a string of years where the world wasnt worried our President will sell us to pay off his Russian debters.

I still dont think Biden wins the nom so this hopefully is all academic. But if he does the Progressives and the Bernie Bros need to shut up, back him for his run and do so again in 4 years. Meanwhile they keep pushing their agenda forward and getting support down ballot. They have all the momentum in the world time to use it not just for the fight directly ahead of us but for the fights to come. Biden is an empty suit, but he also can get us at least SOME of our country back and right now that is a start. Hell the unions love him and the Dems need the unions back on their side.

And BTW if they think he is "barely better than a Republican" then they are morons. Sorry they are. If they cant see the difference then they arent paying any attention and they arent worth the effort you are putting in trying to make them sound smarter than they actually are. They are just Trumpers of a different cloth...believing their gut over their eyes and brains.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top