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2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bull!!

Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

http://www.racer.com/f1/item/109575-alonso-calls-for-closed-cockpits-rethink

Please excuse the rambling here, my thoughts are all over the place right now

Selfishly I can't help but think adopting cockpits, like fenders in Indycar changes the sport radically into something closer to Nascar...and I've just never been interested in closed cockpit closed wheel cars.

Also, it seems a bit over the top to call for cockpits when Bianchi's hit was such a 1 in 1,000,000 accident. I don't recall ever seeing a car spin out of control and hit a tractor like that.

I wonder what Jackie Stewart, Alain Prost, Nigel Mansell, Niki Lauda, Nelson Piquet, Emerson Fittipaldi and on and on think about the idea of closed cockpit cars.

EDIT: This polemic brings to mind two quotes from Indycar drivers I've heard relative to the inherent danger of their sport

Al Unser Jr. "It's the nature of the beast"

Michael Andretti "He knew the risks,” Michael Andretti said. “We all know the risks when we get in the car. It’s a terrible thing, but unfortunately in our sport we’ve had a lot of days like these. They suck, but that’s the way it is."

Obviously I don't put my life on the line racing cars like these but in a way it's part of why I hold these drivers in such high regard. The Senna's, the Clark's, the Andretti's etc.

and in the end, most people who knew them seem to say if Senna knew the outcome, or Moore knew the outcome etc they likely wouldn't change a thing...
 
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Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

alfablue said:
For a more optimistic view, Jules's injury is the same on Richard Hammond suffered when he crashed the jet dragster back in 2006. Big head injury when the car's cage dug into the ground while rolling. He's come back.

Not to say Jules is the same, but for a glimmer of hope for such a horrific injury.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the hope glimmer.

I don't think enclosed cockpits are the answer. Massa getting hit in the head was also a one in a million thing when you look at all the laps of all the open cockpit cars race each year. Jules was a perfect storm so to speak. With Weldon the steel post was inside instead of outside the fence, with Franchitti the car got airborne, something the rear fenders are supposed to take care of. People die in closed race cars as well. Racing and most sports are dangerous. Life is filled with danger for you and I.
 
Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

solovsfett said:
and in the end, most people who knew them seem to say if Senna knew the outcome, or Moore knew the outcome etc they likely wouldn't change a thing...
Click to expand...

Nelson Piquet during his F1 days once confided to another driver (can't remember who, but I think it was either Stewart or Lauda) that he fully expected to die in a race car one day.
 
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Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

This is from Forbes

The Chopper: One of the most serious indictments of the handling of the race was this simple fact: after his accident, Bianchi was driven to the hospital by ambulance because the weather was too bad for the Medi-vac helicopter that was on standby to transport injured drivers to fly. There are currently no indications that the delay caused by the grounding of the helicopter had an impact on Bianchi’s condition or his prognosis. But that seems to be an eminently sensible rule of thumb: if the weather is bad enough that the rescue helicopter cannot fly, the race should be stopped or at least slowed by the safety car (emphasis added).
Click to expand...
 
Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Picked up the Russian race at lap 35. Not much of a race.

And I don't like the track much- long, sure, but it looks like a city track in the middle of a parking lot (other than the olympic buildings). I guess I wait for a few more years.

On to Austin.
 
Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Russell Jaslow said:
Nelson Piquet during his F1 days once confided to another driver (can't remember how, but I think it was either Stewart or Lauda) that he fully expected to die in a race car one day.
Click to expand...

wow...I didn't know that...I actually don't know very much about Nelson Piquet but it's not surprising any of the drivers (particularly from the older generations 80's, 70's etc) would confide that sort of thing to a colleague
 
Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Caterham to miss the next two races. My guess is that they are done.
 
Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

I guess at least Marussia and Caterham can take solice in that they outlasted HRT and Marussia scored 2 points. :(
 
Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Russell Jaslow said:
And now it's official. Marussia also enters administration.

http://en.espnf1.com/marussia/motorsport/story/180949.html

Who's next? Lotus? Sauber? Force India?
Click to expand...

Based on the headlines, I'd bet Lotus, even though it used to be Renault. Force India seems to have weathered their storm, but could be wrong. Sauber- well, they seem to be able to just chug along while struggling.

Sure does speak to a rather large problem in F1.
 
Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Didn't see the race yet....Bernie has suggested the rich teams send some cash to the poor teams to help them stay afloat. I suggest BERNIE send some of HIS money to the poor teams to help them stay afloat (and fill out the grid per whatever contractual obligations there are for him to meet), his net worth is 4.2 billion. In the end I really don't feel bad for the small underfunded teams, it's their choice to toss their hat into the ring and play the game.
 
Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Timothy A said:
Didn't see the race yet....Bernie has suggested the rich teams send some cash to the poor teams to help them stay afloat. I suggest BERNIE send some of HIS money to the poor teams to help them stay afloat (and fill out the grid per whatever contractual obligations there are for him to meet), his net worth is 4.2 billion. In the end I really don't feel bad for the small underfunded teams, it's their choice to toss their hat into the ring and play the game.
Click to expand...

Outside of the top two places (which was exciting for a lap), the rest of the racing was really, really good.

For the better drivers, the wheel to wheel action was amazing. Alonso really showed that he's REALLY tough, but incredibly fair. Constantly challenging for positions, but never coming close to touching. Vettel was really good, too- making some great passes. The real interest at the end- when Hamilton and Rosberg came to lap a nice battle for the last few points spots.

As for the lower teams- throw them a bone, for God's sake. A little sharing the massive wealth will keep the fields big and interesting. I'm not really looking forward to seeing 3 cars from each big team but none of the smaller teams.
 
Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

I thought the race was good. That track really is a good one. Several places to attempt passes and it looks good on TV all things considered.

I'm not sure what to do with F1 and the spending. I want more than just a McLaren, Ferrari, Mercedes field but on the other hand I don't think just handing money to any small team is the way to go either. I guess if I was running things I would...

1. Open up the rules as far as the engines are concerned. Allow in season changes, but keep the limit on # of them. Same thing with the transmissions.
2. Open up the areo rules some (I'm not a aerodynamic expert but I think the current rules are kind of restricting in a bad way).
3. Provided that the above two items are done, then I am OK with either a spending cap/revenue sharing/luxary tax. I prefer luxary taxes but I am unsure how to do it in the world of F1.

Basically my goals would be to 1. reward smart engineering not just throwing $ at the car, and 2. limit spending or at least penalize too much spending.
 
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Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

MattS said:
I thought the race was good. That track really is a good one. Several places to attempt passes and it looks good on TV all things considered.

I'm not sure what to do with F1 and the spending. I want more than just a McLaren, Ferrari, Mercedes field but on the other hand I don't think just handing money to any small team is the way to go either. I guess if I was running things I would...

1. Open up the rules as far as the engines are concerned. Allow in season changes, but keep the limit on # of them. Same thing with the transmissions.
2. Open up the areo rules some (I'm not a aerodynamic expert but I think the current rules are kind of restricting in a bad way).
3. Provided that the above two items are done, then I am OK with either a spending cap/revenue sharing/luxary tax. I prefer luxary taxes but I am unsure how to do it in the world of F1.

Basically my goals would be to 1. reward smart engineering not just throwing $ at the car, and 2. limit spending or at least penalize too much spending.
Click to expand...

I think a lot of the aero packages are more restricted by the 100l fuel requirement than the rules. Drag is such a big deal now that they can't just add downforce without keeping the drag low enough to finish the race.

And I'm a fan of the fuel limit + the flow limit. To the point that they should not have an RPM lower limit- give the designers some room to play around with some of the trim, since they can make more power at lower speeds due to the lower aero losses. Theoretically, some of this can trickle down to real road cars. Although a fuel economy Ferrari or AMG Mercedes isn't something anyone thinks of. Renault, on the other hand- if it's applicable, both Renault and Nissan will benefit by the technology.
 
Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

alfablue said:
I think a lot of the aero packages are more restricted by the 100l fuel requirement than the rules. Drag is such a big deal now that they can't just add downforce without keeping the drag low enough to finish the race.

And I'm a fan of the fuel limit + the flow limit. To the point that they should not have an RPM lower limit- give the designers some room to play around with some of the trim, since they can make more power at lower speeds due to the lower aero losses. Theoretically, some of this can trickle down to real road cars. Although a fuel economy Ferrari or AMG Mercedes isn't something anyone thinks of. Renault, on the other hand- if it's applicable, both Renault and Nissan will benefit by the technology.
Click to expand...

I was thinking more along the lines of eliminating diffusers and the winglets, etc. on the aero side.

I agree with you. I have no issue with the fuel limit and flow limit. I should maybe have been clearer. I don't necessary have an problem with the rules surrounding what can or cannot be done to the engines, but I do have an issue that the manufacturers cannot change them (drastically) during the season.
 
Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Timothy A said:
Didn't see the race yet....Bernie has suggested the rich teams send some cash to the poor teams to help them stay afloat. I suggest BERNIE send some of HIS money to the poor teams to help them stay afloat (and fill out the grid per whatever contractual obligations there are for him to meet), his net worth is 4.2 billion. In the end I really don't feel bad for the small underfunded teams, it's their choice to toss their hat into the ring and play the game.
Click to expand...

Looks like CVC is going to put up the money to guarantee a base pay to the lower tier teams. The upper tier teams already get a bonus fee just for showing up, above and beyond whatever Constructor's points money they earn.
 
Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

Re: 2014 Open Wheel Racing - if it's white smoke, it's not a good sign & that's no bu

So the preliminary list of teams for 2015 is out:

Infiniti Red Bull Racing
Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team
Scuderia Ferrari
Lotus F1 Team
McLaren Honda
Sahara Force India F1 Team
Sauber F1 Team
Scuderia Toro Rosso
Williams Martini Racing
Manor F1 Team
Caterham F1 Team
Click to expand...

Interesting even if it is preliminary. So it appears as if Marussia is done (maybe Stefan GP can get their spot?). Caterham is still surviving although they have not paid the fee for next season yet which is due at the end of the month. And Manor is entering! I wonder if either Manor (possible) or Caterham (doubtful) will make the grid.

I also read that Caterham is "planning" on racing in Abu Dhabi. Of course I am "planning" on attending this race. Although I am just like Caterham....I don't have the money to attend but I can still plan on it.


Also Formula E is hiring. They are in need of an "International Travel Consultant" and a "Security Manager"! No, I'm serious! If interested send your CV to: hr@formulae.com :)
 
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