2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

[Bakunin]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

My proposed solution: drop the corporate tax rates to zero and offer some additional incentives as needed to get companies to locate here. Offset the lost corporate tax revenue by raising the other tax rates (such as capital gains and income) and/or removing deductions/credits.

People might ***** about paying higher taxes, but in this economy, it's a lot better to be *****ing about higher taxes than it is to be *****ing about not having a ****ing job.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

My proposed solution: drop the corporate tax rates to zero and offer some additional incentives as needed to get companies to locate here. Offset the lost corporate tax revenue by raising the other tax rates (such as capital gains and income) and/or removing deductions/credits.

People might ***** about paying higher taxes, but in this economy, it's a lot better to be *****ing about higher taxes than it is to be *****ing about not having a ****ing job.

That's fine. There's tons of ideas on the table. None of them ever get implemented.

 

[Kepler]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

Tim Pawlenty, Herman Cain, John Huntsman, and Rick Santorum are all losing to Palin and Guiliani in NH

IMHO the fact that Rudy could be holding a lead in anything is enough to dismiss polling 7 months before the first primary, which is itself 10 months prior to the election, as nothing more than name recognition.

Huntsman and Johnson are too sane.
Santorum and Bachmann are too crazy.
Gingrich and Giuliani are years past their expiration dates.
Paul refuses to pander to the psychotics.

That leaves Romney, TPaw and Cain to muddle through, while Perry watches Obama's numbers and angles whether to rescue the RNC at the last minute, and Palin calculates what will keep her on the front page of Derp Digest.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

That leaves Romney, TPaw and Cain to muddle through, while Perry watches Obama's numbers and angles whether to rescue the RNC at the last minute, and Palin calculates what will keep her on the front page of Derp Digest.

Pawlenty now that he isn't on a stage with Romney is flapping his gums again.

Back on the air with Fox News’ Sean Hannity, Pawlenty said of Romney, “I don’t think you can prosecute the political case against President Obama if you are a co-conspirator in one of the main charges against the President on a political level. "

http://www.startribune.com/politics/blogs/124069909.html

What a wimp.

I guess it's Romeny and Cain. And if Romney gets in he gets in the same way McCain did. By accident.

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

That's why I anticipate US Bankruptcy to be inevitable.


Tim Pawlenty, Herman Cain, John Huntsman, and Rick Santorum are all losing to Palin and Guiliani in NH.

Somebody stands to get some scooby snacks:

Pawlenty's super-rich tax cuts

Hey rich folks, Tim Pawlenty wants to cut your taxes. A lot.

Under the terms of his recently revealed economic plan, Americans in the top 20% of earners would see their taxes cut by an average of $23,500, an 8.6 percentage point drop in their tax rate, according to an analysis by the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center.

And the top 1% would get an annual average reduction of $261,000, a 14.8 percentage point drop.

Meanwhile, Americans in the lowest 20% of income would see their taxes drop by an average of only $23, a 0.2 percentage point change in their tax rate.

Put another way, Americans who earn between $40,000 and $50,000 a year will see their after-tax income increase by 1.7%, while Americans who earn more than $1 million will see a 24.1% bump.

Under Pawlenty's plan, taxes on capital gains, interest income, dividends and estates would all be eliminated. Individuals would pay a 10% tax rate on their first $50,000 in income and 25% on all additional earnings.

If you thought the Bush tax cuts were big, Pawlenty's are on steroids.

"This is taking the Bush policy and doubling down, and maybe even doubling down again," said Joe Rosenberg, a researcher at the Tax Policy Center. "It's really quite dramatic."

Add in Pawlenty's corporate tax plan, and all that cutting means the federal government will bring in almost $7.6 trillion less in revenue over ten years.

For a government that already spends far more than it brings in, that spells trouble, according to Rosenberg, who said revenue would end up around 13.5% of GDP, far below historical norms.

"The revenue yield makes it an implausible tax system to implement," Rosenberg said.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Pawle...7.html?x=0&sec=topStories&pos=6&asset=&ccode=

 

[Bakunin]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

The bulk of the taxes paid by people earning between $40,000-$50,000 are of the payroll variety. Even if you cut the income tax rate to nothing, their income wouldn't climb all that much, since many of these people get deductions and credits that significantly reduce their tax exposure. If you really wanted to increase the take home pay of this income group, their OASDI tax rate would have to be cut, or their state income / property tax rates would have to drop.

We really don't need think tanks to tell us this, do we?

 

[joecct]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

The bulk of the taxes paid by people earning between $40,000-$50,000 are of the payroll variety. Even if you cut the income tax rate to nothing, their income wouldn't climb all that much, since many of these people get deductions and credits that significantly reduce their tax exposure. If you really wanted to increase the take home pay of this income group, their OASDI tax rate would have to be cut, or their state income / property tax rates would have to drop.

We really don't need think tanks to tell us this, do we?

But the think tanks need the dollars.

But to blow up the tax code and start all over again is impossible as long as the 500+ idiots are inhabiting the salons of Congress.

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

The bulk of the taxes paid by people earning between $40,000-$50,000 are of the payroll variety. Even if you cut the income tax rate to nothing, their income wouldn't climb all that much, since many of these people get deductions and credits that significantly reduce their tax exposure. If you really wanted to increase the take home pay of this income group, their OASDI tax rate would have to be cut, or their state income / property tax rates would have to drop.

We really don't need think tanks to tell us this, do we?

No. But I think you're looking past the main point here. The top one percent will get average tax reduction of $260k. Lower middle income segments will see approximately zero reduction. I am of the opinion that things are pretty close to how they should be. Not more money for the rich...not more money for the poor.

Problem is this $260k gift is happening at a time when the govt needs more revenue not less.

 

[Bakunin]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

But to blow up the tax code and start all over again is impossible as long as the 500+ idiots are inhabiting the salons of Congress.

And bankrolling these idiots are various groups that will fight tooth and nail to retain their favored deductions and credits.

End the child tax credit? Attack ad: "____ wants to take money from parents so that little Johnny can't get his immunizations."
End the mortgage interest deduction? Attack ad: "____ wants to make homes less affordable for working families."

Unless there is some sort of widespread agreement on both sides to reign in their rabid interest groups, there will never be any real reform of the tax code.

 

[Bakunin]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

No. But I think you're looking past the main point here.

Not at all. I already dismissed his proposal as idiotic, and unless he turns things around, he doesn't stand a snowball's chance in **** of getting the GOP nomination.

The top one percent will get average tax reduction of $260k. Lower middle income segments will see approximately zero reduction.

You can't reduce tax liability for a group that pays next to nothing in income taxes. Any income tax reduction plan has to face this reality. That's why the Democrats' phrase "tax cut for the rich" is really redundant. Of course it's for the rich - they're paying the bulk of the income tax. By the same token, if income tax rates were left alone (or increased) while the payroll tax rates were lowered, that would be a tax cut for the poor / middle income earners.

I am of the opinion that things are pretty close to how they should be. Not more money for the rich...not more money for the poor.

I think things aren't at all where they should be and are needlessly complicated. Let's abandon this nonsense of different federal taxes and different rates for all of them. Call everything "income" and tax it accordingly, whether it's an inheritance, a capital gain, a dividend, a paycheck, or gambling winnings. And the payroll tax can be rolled into the overall income tax rate structure. There's no need to keep the ****ing thing separate.

Problem is this $260k gift is happening at a time when the govt needs more revenue not less.

It isn't happening, and THAT is the point. It's just a stupid idea floated by an idiotic candidate who isn't even polling in the double digits in his own party's nominating process. If he somehow becomes president and then floats this steaming turd and has a sympathetic ear in both houses of Congress, THEN we've got a problem and can start worrying about it. With our fiscal situation being as craptastic as it is, this proposal is DOA even if he's elected, IMHO.

 

[joecct]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

And bankrolling these idiots are various groups that will fight tooth and nail to retain their favored deductions and credits.

End the child tax credit? Attack ad: "____ wants to take money from parents so that little Johnny can't get his immunizations."
End the mortgage interest deduction? Attack ad: "____ wants to make homes less affordable for working families."

Unless there is some sort of widespread agreement on both sides to reign in their rabid interest groups, there will never be any real reform of the tax code.

Sad, but true.

 

[Kepler]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

Sad, but true.

This is particularly true whenever you go up against militarism. "___ wants to give away everything our brave troops fought for." It's the same sucker's game.

 

[geezer]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

IMHO the fact that Rudy could be holding a lead in anything is enough to dismiss polling 7 months before the first primary, which is itself 10 months prior to the election, as nothing more than name recognition.

Huntsman and Johnson are too sane.
Santorum and Bachmann are too crazy.
Gingrich and Giuliani are years past their expiration dates.
Paul refuses to pander to the psychotics.

That leaves Romney, TPaw and Cain to muddle through, while Perry watches Obama's numbers and angles whether to rescue the RNC at the last minute, and Palin calculates what will keep her on the front page of Derp Digest.

You're implying that Cain is more sane than Santorum and Bachmann. Isn't he the guy that wants to put Muslims in concentration camps or something? It's starting to look like Romney gets the default nomination, like Dole & McCain did. I'm sure he will equal their success in a national campaign.

 

[Patman]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

You're implying that Cain is more sane than Santorum and Bachmann. Isn't he the guy that wants to put Muslims in concentration camps or something? It's starting to look like Romney gets the default nomination, like Dole & McCain did. I'm sure he will equal their success in a national campaign.

Seems to be that from process of elimination... with Romney being a complete deceitful tool who is more about saying things that sound good rather than staring down reality.... Huntsman a liberal whose only hope is rampant abuse of open primary system by liberals (remember... "sane" means agreeing with liberals to the point that they will tolerate... example: McCain was sane until he came between liberal and the presidency)... that its between Pawlenty and Palin (have you even seen the reaction the media has had to reading her e-mails, Kepler, or are you fully drunk on the narrative?) Of course, I tend to discount any "rationalist" who ended up voting for Obama over McCain... more and more Obama is showing that he's exactly who he always was but nobody wanted to believe. The whole man was one large story line.

It really seems like the primaries are going to be more a process of elimination than an affirmation of any one person's ideas.

 

[walrus]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

You're implying that Cain is more sane than Santorum and Bachmann. Isn't he the guy that wants to put Muslims in concentration camps or something? It's starting to look like Romney gets the default nomination, like Dole & McCain did. I'm sure he will equal their success in a national campaign.

I think he said he wasn't comfortable with Muslims being in his cabinet, thats a far cry from concentration camps

 

[Foxton]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

I think he said he wasn't comfortable with Muslims being in his cabinet, thats a far cry from concentration camps

Pretty much. Basically he wants a loyalty oath but since he doesn't think any Muslim can be trusted any oath means nothing so they just need not apply. He also made a nazi comparison.

Of course this raises the question of why do republicans hate the constitution?

<iframe width="640" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/aDXCwd65R5o" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

Ya stupid red meat stance Cain took here. Everyone evaluates the background of every cabinet member. Why single out Muslims if you don't mean it?

If Paul sneaks in there, I may go GOP. I said that last election...until I heard about his newsletters. Even so, his foriegn policy is just too compelling.

 

[Bakunin]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

This is particularly true whenever you go up against militarism. "___ wants to give away everything our brave troops fought for." It's the same sucker's game.

The bigger the dollar value of whatever is at stake, the harder it is to fight the entrenched interest. This is why defense spending has pretty much achieved equal footing with social security and medicare as untouchable (or nearly so).

 

[Kepler]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

The following ad appears to be genuine.

 

[Bakunin]

Re: 2012 Elections Part I: All Politics is Yokel

That ad is awesome. If we had more political ads like that one, it'd almost make campaign season worth watching.