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119th congress: must be at least 75 to chair a committee!
FadeToBlack&Gold
Microlot Marxist
No, Ed Bastian and Glen Hauenstein really needed their Q4 bonuses.
Jimjamesak
Already insane, UAA making it worse
There are many reasons why I believe that this country is headed towards a violent breakup, but this is the main one. All paths to nonviolent change through the political process are completely blocked. “Vote blue, no matter who!” is a foolish idea when the leadership capitulates to fascists at every turn and changing said leadership is an impossibility due to bribery.
The only way anything in this country will change is behind the barrel of a gun and a sea of blood.
walrus
Wind up workin' in a gas station
Been more than just one
MichVandal
Well-known member
So I never look at this thread, but I know that most will be super alarmed that D's apparently capitulated.
But what if they didn't by doing this?
What they are asking for is an extension of the tax credits for healthcare, right? So it's "here's what we offer to talk- say yes to something that almost all R's want as well as D's, since this is super popular" and we can open things back up. (include SNAP if you like, too)
R's want to reopen and get this done, too, in theory. But they are so beholden to the orange moron that they are letting D's frame this as "R's don't want you to have something you want AND want to keep things closed" because their moron doesn't want to negotiate and wants to abolish the filibuster. And I'm sure that D's can even say "we want to give billionaires tax cuts" and they will say no.
So they are throwing themselves under the bus just to point out that this is an R choice to keep things closed, since what they "object" is popular on a bipartisan level. Almost the most popular thing.
(I suspect, but saw a good analysis that suggested this, too)
Now any pain we all feel is all due to Rs. It's totally in their lap.
But what if they didn't by doing this?
What they are asking for is an extension of the tax credits for healthcare, right? So it's "here's what we offer to talk- say yes to something that almost all R's want as well as D's, since this is super popular" and we can open things back up. (include SNAP if you like, too)
R's want to reopen and get this done, too, in theory. But they are so beholden to the orange moron that they are letting D's frame this as "R's don't want you to have something you want AND want to keep things closed" because their moron doesn't want to negotiate and wants to abolish the filibuster. And I'm sure that D's can even say "we want to give billionaires tax cuts" and they will say no.
So they are throwing themselves under the bus just to point out that this is an R choice to keep things closed, since what they "object" is popular on a bipartisan level. Almost the most popular thing.
(I suspect, but saw a good analysis that suggested this, too)
Now any pain we all feel is all due to Rs. It's totally in their lap.
ticapnews
Never graduate.
Chuck Schumer says the Baileys had tickets to fly to Hawaii for Thanksgiving so he had to act.
FadeToBlack&Gold
Microlot Marxist
I just can't believe they would do that! Can someone please inform Jeanne Shaheen?
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Leadership doesn't even vote Blue ask Zohran...
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
How dumb do you think the average Dem voter is? Because even Trump wouldn't buy that load of manure.
MichVandal
Well-known member
Lets see how this plays out. Sounds like the offer to talk was already turned down, so it's not as if anything has actually happened, other than R's clearly saying they are not willing to talk about popular policy, let alone pass it.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Hey now. Let's be fair. Republicans are (x) squared. Democrats are (-x) squared.
ticapnews
Never graduate.
Vote blue no matter who!*
Offer not valid in all states. Terms and conditions may apply. If the candidate in question has ever said anything remotely progressive then vote Independent or for the Nazi.
dxmnkd316
Lucia Apologist
And guess what? Nothing has changed and we’ll be shut down again in January.
So all this rending of garments over caving is just a tantrum without actually surveying what happened.
We got them to admit they won’t do ACA and now we’ve gotten SNAP back fully funded, federal workers might be able to pay their mortgages and rent this month and next, and we have fair warning of what to expect in January.
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Right but the Dems got cucked. They have no leverage to get anything now because they already agreed to zero. They don't have the will to walk away they proved it.
The House will vote for it cause Trump needs them too. They will vote on subsidies like promised (vote no) and the people are screwed.
But we even if your scenario is right... the Dems had all that anyways. The people spoke voted Blue in record numbers. 5 days later the Dems stuck the knife in. They won't forget that.
The House will vote for it cause Trump needs them too. They will vote on subsidies like promised (vote no) and the people are screwed.
But we even if your scenario is right... the Dems had all that anyways. The people spoke voted Blue in record numbers. 5 days later the Dems stuck the knife in. They won't forget that.
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Kepler
Si certus es dubita
God I hope not. I really really hope not. The 19th century US Civil War was an exception because it was economic, so while it was gory it wasn't barbaric.
Tribal civil wars are barbaric. They are not fought with weapons, they are fought with genocide, torture, slavery, and mass rape. Humans in a state of a true civil war are not rational any longer, they are pure id.
Two things about that. (1) Mass suffering on a scale only China, Russia, and Africa have ever seen. (2) Who says we win? US territory commands a nuclear arsenal and the good guys are all concentrated in a handful of cities. The Morlocks are perfectly capable, technologically and psychologically, of killing 50M of us by pressing a button. They'll just tell themselves God told them to. Even if the Eloi could do that psychologically (and I'll bet we could -- it's to save women and minorities from misogyny and racism WE HAVE NO CHOICE ARGLE BARGLE!!!!) there is no way to mass murder the rurals -- they are too spread out, and their females 12-52 are mindless larvae-extruding meat sacks so they just make more.
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Jimjamesak
Already insane, UAA making it worse
You can hope in one hand and shit in the other…
The only way to actually change anything in this country would be through constitutional amendments or a completely new constitution, and that is not happening without a complete turnaround in political thought in 90% of the country. And it’s not going to happen peacefully.
We’re heading for a bloody, dark future, best to prepare now.
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
What makes you think SNAP will be funded? You keep pretending this was negotiated in good faith the deal isn't worth the paper if it's written on and if you are right and another shutdown happens Trump will cut it off again if he wants to. There were Senate GOPers saying as much when the shutdown started the Dems have zero reason to trust any deal.
The Dems will have zero leverage in January. You cant whine about Health Care Costs when twice in under a year you refused to anything meaningful about it and that is what the Dems have done. And spoiler alert...they wint in January either because they dont have the balls to do what must be done under pressure. When 60% of the voters are behind you and you cave you arent playing the game you arent part of the orgy you are just in the corner jerking off...
This is not an academic argument...in the real world the Dems are going to be hurt electorally by doing this. I will say it again there is a reason that prior to the Shutdown the Dems polled worse than the GOP and it is because of stuff like this. They have no heart, and no fight. Whats worse is they actively spit in the face of the people who do fight. Its all perfirmative...like Nancy Pelosi wearing a dashiki and taking a knee. (She would have never made this deal though)
Next time there is a No Kings rally the people should protest the Dems too.
MichVandal
Well-known member
How many people are willing to die because they are racists? That's is what this comes down to. They talk a lot, sure, but when someone shoots back, then what? Let alone, the only shooting that has happened so far is right on right. Twice now.
Let alone the people with money will lose it all if that happens- so they have a vested interest in bringing it back in.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
There's too much excitement and bravado in that prediction. It's an MCU view of conflict. War as epic adventure.
Real war, without limits, is manure pouring from your child's infected intestinal wound while she screams in agony for days until she dies.
A hundred years of tyranny is better than one week of true barbarism.
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