I'm curious -- no one on the thread seems at all disappointed that Ben Guite didn't get HC job. Maine alum, lots of NHL experience, from Quebec and native French-speaker = great for recruiting. Am I missing something? Does Guillaume Richard -- clearly a Guite recruit -- decommit now that the coaches he signed on with are no longer there?
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The Barr Has Been Raised at UMaine
- Thread starter acs64
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AMC
Registered User
Drew S. is. The rest of us feel that we have been losing for a decade and are ready to move on from anyone that has been associated with that stretch.
umhockey91
Well-known member
Is it wrong that I don’t really care if we lose some Gendron/Guite recruits?
Richard absolutely has to stay. Other than that, I would trust Barr and Co. to evaluate and see which ones he wants to stay and which ones he'd be fine losing.
UMASS fan here- not sure what the issues are in Orono if any, but if Barr needs to address things and he follows Carvel's approach, there will be a lot of turnover in the players. Carvel's approach was that he did not want any a**h***s on the team so many were moved on. That is why in his first year UMASS won only 5 games. In the long run, that approach paid big dividends. Of course, at the time, he was not under the spotlight like Barr will be at Maine.
Fishman'81
Black Bear since D-2
Fishman'81
Black Bear since D-2
Not disputing your comment, just wondering who those plenty of present NHL/former ECHL coaches are.
I’m still very sad for Ben Guite but feel a lot better about things after hearing Barr’s press conference yesterday.
I think history will be very kind to Red & Co. In five years or whatever when we look back it will be obvious they were able to get things headed in the right direction.
i dont think he’ll need quite the purge that Carvel did. I dont think Maine has any azzholes. We got a lot of slow guys who can’t possess the puck or create any offense. But they’re not azzholes, so at least there’s that
MEbear
Registered User
I feel bad for Guite to have this unfortunate situation of Reds premature passing lead to the rug being yanked out from under him and his family like this, but I guess that uncertainty is part of being in the coaching game and all coaches are aware of that uncertainty. I haven’t followed Maine Hockey much in recent years but I used to and I remember how much I enjoyed watching Guite as a player. Apparently he worked hard and did a good job as an assistant, but it appears that Barr has done that job even better and longer so I support the difficult decision the committee had to make. I’m sure that Guite will continue to succeed and grow as a coach and hopefully his turn to head up a D1 program will come not too far in the future. I wish nothing but the best for him.
Barr sounds like a great choice for lots of reasons and I expect the program will now have a new energy and his prowess as a recruiter will improve the level of talent and that will lead to a lot more success once “his” guys are established on the team. I really like that he’s not starting off by complaining about the difficulty of recruiting kids to play in a ‘cultural backwater’ like Orono, Maine and I don’t expect to hear him using that as an excuse for a lack of success in the future. It sure didn’t seem to impede Walsh or Standbrook! I get that some kids want to play in a big city like Boston or go to an elite school like BC or Notre Dame, but there are plenty of great kids who are singularly focused on their development as a hockey player but would like to get a degree too as sort of a backup plan in case their dream of pro hockey doesn’t happen. Playing in front of a lively crowd and supportive fan base that always packs the arena, along with the chance to play for a coach who they think will help them achieve their goals will speak more loudly to the sort of player Maine needs than the chance to party or the culture available in a big city or the chance for an elite school degree. I’m a UMaine engineering alum and if I had it to do over I’d again choose Maine even if cost wasn’t a factor. As an undergrad I found that the professors had WAY more knowledge to impart than my little brain could possibly absorb. A more “elite” engineering program would have been wasted on me as far as cramming knowledge into my head because I was already pretty maxed out and I suspect that most 18-22 year old hockey players would feel the same way Plus, I didn’t even play a varsity sport and between on campus activities and studying and part time jobs I didn’t have either the time or money or inclination to enjoy city life. Years later I did live in downtown Boston and enjoyed it but by then I had a lot more time or resources than as a college student. So, I think UMaine has plenty to offer young hockey players and that, combined with Barr’s reputation as an energetic recruiter and his record of past success will draw more talent to Orono and in a few years we’ll all be discussing how to get the best deal on flights to frozen fours again. Its an exciting time to be a Maine Hockey fan again! I wish Barr well and hope he and his family enjoy life in this area.
Barr sounds like a great choice for lots of reasons and I expect the program will now have a new energy and his prowess as a recruiter will improve the level of talent and that will lead to a lot more success once “his” guys are established on the team. I really like that he’s not starting off by complaining about the difficulty of recruiting kids to play in a ‘cultural backwater’ like Orono, Maine and I don’t expect to hear him using that as an excuse for a lack of success in the future. It sure didn’t seem to impede Walsh or Standbrook! I get that some kids want to play in a big city like Boston or go to an elite school like BC or Notre Dame, but there are plenty of great kids who are singularly focused on their development as a hockey player but would like to get a degree too as sort of a backup plan in case their dream of pro hockey doesn’t happen. Playing in front of a lively crowd and supportive fan base that always packs the arena, along with the chance to play for a coach who they think will help them achieve their goals will speak more loudly to the sort of player Maine needs than the chance to party or the culture available in a big city or the chance for an elite school degree. I’m a UMaine engineering alum and if I had it to do over I’d again choose Maine even if cost wasn’t a factor. As an undergrad I found that the professors had WAY more knowledge to impart than my little brain could possibly absorb. A more “elite” engineering program would have been wasted on me as far as cramming knowledge into my head because I was already pretty maxed out and I suspect that most 18-22 year old hockey players would feel the same way Plus, I didn’t even play a varsity sport and between on campus activities and studying and part time jobs I didn’t have either the time or money or inclination to enjoy city life. Years later I did live in downtown Boston and enjoyed it but by then I had a lot more time or resources than as a college student. So, I think UMaine has plenty to offer young hockey players and that, combined with Barr’s reputation as an energetic recruiter and his record of past success will draw more talent to Orono and in a few years we’ll all be discussing how to get the best deal on flights to frozen fours again. Its an exciting time to be a Maine Hockey fan again! I wish Barr well and hope he and his family enjoy life in this area.
Chuck Murray
WIS & Effingwoods Hockey Almanac
I suspect he's referencing guys like Cassidy and Laviolette (sp?), perhaps a couple more?
Chuck Murray
WIS & Effingwoods Hockey Almanac
I think that's a great approach, one I've long adopted in coaching a different sport at a lower level.
Cost us a few talented players, but our teams always thrived when there were no distractions.
Specific individual recruits aside, the general feeling is that there has been a lack of overall talent on the roster. Guite, as the lead recruiter, has to shoulder a large chunk of the blame. You say "great for recruiting" but it hasn't appeared to translate, for whatever reason.
Blackbear96
Active member
I think it's worth bringing up since Richard is one of the better on-paper recruits that we've had in awhile, but I have a counterpoint to your concern. Any incoming player, or current player, can clearly see his track record at WMU, Union, Providence, and UMass. What exactly about Coach Barr would make you want to leave? I mean he had a hand in developing Cale Makar just two seasons ago, so I don't see how young Mr Richard could look at that and not see an opportunity to get better.
Possibly it's my glass half-full optimism, but I don't foresee any of those issues and quite frankly if any existing players leave, it allows Barr to put his blueprint on the club earlier than anticipated.
lol. You're delusional.
Cross Check
Doggie Out! Afuera!
Nothing is a guarantee of course, but I'd say on paper this looks like as a good of a move as Maine could have hoped for.
Sean Pickett
2009 NCAA Champions
Drew, I know that you have supported Coach Gendron here, but I disagree with you on this. There are a lot of different facets to coaching in college, but by every objective measure his head coaching tenure at Maine was a failure. His career winning percentage was 0.438 after eight seasons; that puts him at 142 out of 167 coaches (the bottom 16%). Of course, regular season and postseason success are also factors, and Coach Gendron had just 3 winning seasons out of eight and you can argue that he only had 2 of them because of an outstanding goalie, while he had no conference semifinal or NCAA appearances in those eight seasons*. Of the other 166 coaches 52 never reached the equivalent of their league semifinals, but 7 won one or more regular season titles, leaving just 45. Of those another seven made the DI, DII or DIII Frozen Four, and two others made one NCAA tournament, leaving just 36 other coaches with no regular season or postseason success. Of those 14 had no opportunity to win a league regular season title or participate in a league tournament, leaving 22 coaches, of which 9 had a winning cumulative record. That leaves just 13 other coaches along with Coach Gendron with both a losing record and no regular season or postseason success of any kind out of 167 (8%). Furthermore, I added up the records of every coach to see what the cumulative winning percentage for every first year, second year, etc. is and after eight season the winning percentage for the 167 coaches is currently 0.540, fully 0.100 higher than Coach Gendron. You may have seen my chart of the Maine coaches cumulative winning percentage vs each other, but I created a new one that also includes the combined winning percentage for all the coaches:
As can clearly be seen, Coach Gendron was above the overall coaches percentage only for his first season. If Coach Whitehead is considered a failure despite being above the combined percentage for his entire tenure and his postseason success, than I find it hard to believe that Coach Gendron will be looked upon favorably in the future.
Sean
*I know that there was no postseason in 2019-20 and that Maine was 15th in the pairwise, but a win in the Hockey East quarterfinals and making the NCAAs was not guaranteed.
Drew, I know that you have supported Coach Gendron here, but I disagree with you on this. There are a lot of different facets to coaching in college, but by every objective measure his head coaching tenure at Maine was a failure. His career winning percentage was 0.438 after eight seasons; that puts him at 142 out of 167 coaches (the bottom 16%). Of course, regular season and postseason success are also factors, and Coach Gendron had just 3 winning seasons out of eight and you can argue that he only had 2 of them because of an outstanding goalie, while he had no conference semifinal or NCAA appearances in those eight seasons*. Of the other 166 coaches 52 never reached the equivalent of their league semifinals, but 7 won one or more regular season titles, leaving just 45. Of those another seven made the DI, DII or DIII Frozen Four, and two others made one NCAA tournament, leaving just 36 other coaches with no regular season or postseason success. Of those 14 had no opportunity to win a league regular season title or participate in a league tournament, leaving 22 coaches, of which 9 had a winning cumulative record. That leaves just 13 other coaches along with Coach Gendron with both a losing record and no regular season or postseason success of any kind out of 167 (8%). Furthermore, I added up the records of every coach to see what the cumulative winning percentage for every first year, second year, etc. is and after eight season the winning percentage for the 167 coaches is currently 0.540, fully 0.100 higher than Coach Gendron. You may have seen my chart of the Maine coaches cumulative winning percentage vs each other, but I created a new one that also includes the combined winning percentage for all the coaches:
As can clearly be seen, Coach Gendron was above the overall coaches percentage only for his first season. If Coach Whitehead is considered a failure despite being above the combined percentage for his entire tenure and his postseason success, than I find it hard to believe that Coach Gendron will be looked upon favorably in the future.
Sean
*I know that there was no postseason in 2019-20 and that Maine was 15th in the pairwise, but a win in the Hockey East quarterfinals and making the NCAAs was not guaranteed.
Sean, I think the issue with an analysis like yours assumes every coach starts from the same place. That obviously doesn’t happen and I think when we can look at the totality of Red’s work his tenure will look a lot better. As I’ve said before it’s not another the wheat you reap but the seeds you sew.
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