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Women's Team, Challenge for a Spot!!!

Y

YabaDabaDoo

New member
Because of all the politics associated with USA Hockey and the selection process for both Select & National Teams, I think there should be a process to challenge for a spot! Now, I don't have it all figured out but it would seem to me "Just like in both High School & College" I was able to challenge for a seat in Jazz or the Orchestra! The process would probably be more like having a requirement of having a form signed off by three (3) college coaches "from different Colleges or Universities" who believe that you have the right stuff and next, once or twice a year "much like the Olympic team walk on tryouts" a meeting would be setup and a panel of judges would watch the challenger and challenged compete for the spot.

Right now there is a strange dormant Active Player Pool list on the USA Hockey Website with names of potential players that was supposed to be updated? By whom? What is the criteria? I believe that the man/women behind the curtain needs to explain and be subject to rebuttal.

There are players who train from a very early age for the opportunity and have very successful careers but never get a sniff and never learn why? I have been to 5 years of player development camps and know a lot of coaches and the common thread seems to be that there are really about 15 to 20 girls each year that are really being looked at and the rest :for lack of a better term" are fodder to make up team to see how these others interact and perform. This seems to start in the Player development program and continue from there. The best players have been selected "as alternates" in the past having never had to show up for player development tryouts? while other players know prior to selection that they will be on a certain team prior to the tryout or announcement of the individuals selected to tryout?

Anyway I feel that there needs to be term limits or challenges otherwise the players coming up through the process really have nothing to aspire.

I would like this tread to cause thought and the aforementioned is only my thoughts, observations and hopes!
 
Re: Women's Team, Challenge for a Spot!!!

No what? and what is your reasoning? also, why is it "do you think" that they have the Olympic team walk-on/tryout the year either before or of the Olympics?

I hope to hear from you!
 
Re: Women's Team, Challenge for a Spot!!!

Sorry your girl did not get picked.

If a player is not on the 18U or 22U National Teams (or real close) then you most likely are not on the radar to have a shot at the USA National Team. What you describe would be a waste of time & and a waste of money.

I do not know, but when was the last time someone made the USA National team through the “open try” outs? The entire point of the Payer Development Program is to find and develop player for the USA National Team. Not to train & get girls ready to play at a “higher level.” Life is not fare. Neither is USA Hockey.
 
Re: Women's Team, Challenge for a Spot!!!

If hockey was like swimming, where one could line people up and compare them in a totally objective manner, such as in a race or against the clock, then maybe we could arrive at teams where everyone agreed. In the case of swimming, the clock doesn't lie, and the swimmer who finishes third by a hundredth of a second or two may not like it, but they can understand why they are left off of the Olympic team.

There are no such unbiased measures for hockey players. On a typical national team, there are probably 12-15 players that would be selected by just about any reasonable process. The rest of those spots will be awarded based on what the decision makers are seeking -- size, speed, hands or something a bit more biased such as a member of a certain college team's roster. The process will be imperfect by nature. The more people involved in the decision making the less likely it is to be biased, but that doesn't mean that the resulting team will improve. As in "Miracle", the best players don't always produce the best team.

So some people will be overlooked and never get a chance they deserve. About all they can do is strive to improve to the point that they are one of those 12-15 best players that are impossible to leave off of the roster. It isn't completely fair, but the problem is inherent in picking a team in any team sport, because individuals may compare players and never reach a consensus on whom is best.
 
Re: Women's Team, Challenge for a Spot!!!

NoGo said:
Sorry your girl did not get picked.

If a player is not on the 18U or 22U National Teams (or real close) then you most likely are not on the radar to have a shot at the USA National Team. What you describe would be a waste of time & and a waste of money.

I do not know, but when was the last time someone made the USA National team through the “open try” outs? The entire point of the Payer Development Program is to find and develop player for the USA National Team. Not to train & get girls ready to play at a “higher level.” Life is not fare. Neither is USA Hockey.
Click to expand...

Thanx but that's not the case! I have done it all. I just don't have answers for those really good players other than to tell them to keep working and they will find you!
 
Re: Women's Team, Challenge for a Spot!!!

Yes, but this doesn't answer the question of accountability or what they need to do? I have already participated at the highest levels in USA hockey! Having said that, I don't have the answer other than to say, Keep working hard and they will find you!

I don't believe this to be the case and I still wonder way I made it when I felt that so many were as good!

And yes! I know that talent is only one of many factors.

Thanx!
 
Re: Women's Team, Challenge for a Spot!!!

YabaDabaDoo said:
Yes, but this doesn't answer the question of accountability or what they need to do? I have already participated at the highest levels in USA hockey! Having said that, I don't have the answer other than to say, Keep working hard and they will find you!

I don't believe this to be the case and I still wonder way I made it when I felt that so many were as good!

And yes! I know that talent is only one of many factors.

Thanx!
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There is just nothing about this idea that is any good. Comparing a team sport like hockey to playing a musical instrument is just laughable at best.

As for accountability, I'm just going to trust that the people that do this for a living are doing a better job at it than those of us on USCHO. It's ridiculous to think that the US is trying NOT to put their best team on the ice.
 
Re: Women's Team, Challenge for a Spot!!!

WIrinkrat said:
....Snip....
As for accountability, I'm just going to trust that the people that do this for a living are doing a better job at it than those of us on USCHO. It's ridiculous to think that the US is trying NOT to put their best team on the ice.
Click to expand...

Best answer yet!
 
Re: Women's Team, Challenge for a Spot!!!

Call It said:
Perhaps, however there seem to be some funny selections.
Click to expand...
Which do you find more puzzling, that certain players are selected, or that others are not?
 
Re: Women's Team, Challenge for a Spot!!!

You missed the boat completely, and as for the "trust the people who do this for a living"??? What a weird statement! Think about the ramifications of that thought!!! I could point out at least 20 women who were selected to either USA select or national teams and or camps in the past 6 years that were out of their league while far better players were over looked. Having said that, that is not what this was supposed to be about! This was supposed to be about legit actionable critiquing so that when the player/candidates went back after Player Development of any of the selection camps they would have a clear idea of what areas they needed to work! Case in point, A number of years ago I was at player development camp and at the conclusion I had the opportunity to sit own with a couple of high level coaches and was informed that I was being considered for national team play and congratulations. nothing in writing but I understood that a file was being kept of my progress. I went on to play on national teams and was selected to to national level camps. I heard from numerous players about their exit evals and most if not all were thin? I proceeded to watch the who's who of the selection process and my observations were confirmed. There are a few who are being looked at the majority are there to support their evals!
That is why I would like to see the curtain pulled back and for the up and comers to have real evals if they are truly the best so that they can get better. If you were or are able to go back 6 to 8 years take a look at who the relatives were, who taught who and who's organization flourished as a result. It has only been a few years that USA Hockey has looked outside of women's hockey for talented young ladies! Anyway, That's my two bits! I for one have been extremely blessed and have made so many great friends, not to mention received a great education! I was just thinking back after a camp I worked when a young lady approached me and ask how I got there!
 
Re: Women's Team, Challenge for a Spot!!!

Your observations are not scientific data. The fact you feel a certain way does not make it so.

I'll ask you again. Why would the USA...a country that is known for excellence in athletics and cares about little beyond winning and being the best on a world stage whether it's sports, industry, or anything else... be intentionally and knowingly TRYING to not put their best team on the ice?

Until you can provide a solid reason for that there is no reason to entertain your wild conspiracies based solely on your opinions and no real hard data or evidence.
 
WIrinkrat said:
Your observations are not scientific data. The fact you feel a certain way does not make it so.
I'll ask you again. Why would the USA...a country that is known for excellence in athletics and cares about little beyond winning and being the best on a world stage whether it's sports, industry, or anything else... be intentionally and knowingly TRYING to not put their best team on the ice?

I would have thought that you would have known? Women's hockey is going the way of women's softball!!! Period!! Between Canada and Us we knock the snot out of everyone! Why do you think Angelia R. A lot of our top coaches and a compliment of our young talent have been sent around the world to train these teams up? There is a reason! Like myself MOST of us don't enjoy trashing teams!
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Re: Women's Team, Challenge for a Spot!!!

YabaDabaDoo said:
I would have thought that you would have known? Women's hockey is going the way of women's softball!!! Period!! Between Canada and Us we knock the snot out of everyone! Why do you think Angelia R. A lot of our top coaches and a compliment of our young talent have been sent around the world to train these teams up? There is a reason! Like myself MOST of us don't enjoy trashing teams!
Click to expand...

So either your premise is that we are so much better than everyone but Canada that we can afford to put less than our best out there and serve the purpose of winning AND keeping some un-named person happy by somehow serving their political needs by only selecting certain less talented players...

or....

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOSH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Re: Women's Team, Challenge for a Spot!!!

I don't believe that there is a political agenda other than trying to keep the games going. By the way, what happened to the U22's ? MLP = Fin, Rus, Swe, Can, Ger, Sui NO USA? the Warren Strelow program? Started with Olympians & top D1 goalies Now No Olympians a couple of D1 Goalies the rest HS? and USA Hockey's "Active Player Pool 2011" was supposed to be updated every few months? Hasn't been? is that because no up and comers are good enough or is it that the best are already on the list?

Like I said, I now work several camps and the aforementioned are but a few of the questions that I field. Really just looking for answers!
 
Re: Women's Team, Challenge for a Spot!!!

YabaDabaDoo said:
I don't believe that there is a political agenda other than trying to keep the games going. By the way, what happened to the U22's ? MLP = Fin, Rus, Swe, Can, Ger, Sui NO USA? the Warren Strelow program? Started with Olympians & top D1 goalies Now No Olympians a couple of D1 Goalies the rest HS? and USA Hockey's "Active Player Pool 2011" was supposed to be updated every few months? Hasn't been? is that because no up and comers are good enough or is it that the best are already on the list?

Like I said, I now work several camps and the aforementioned are but a few of the questions that I field. Really just looking for answers!
Click to expand...

If that is how you feel then it's a lose-lose. If you think we are fielding weaker teams to "keep the games going" and thus not providing opportunities to better players, then if we entertain your crazy notion wouldn't taking all these great players out there that aren't getting a chance and making our countries best roster to go out and slaughter and embarrass every other country then "make the games stop" and thus take the chances away from everyone?

I don't care what camps you've done or where you have been. In this conversation it's like you came down off the moon.
 
Re: Women's Team, Challenge for a Spot!!!

Do you have an answer for what I have put forth or just a criticism? I don't have any answers and I don't think you do either so you slam others! And as for you lame commit about coming down from the moon? if that is the case you should feel right at home! I need to paddle faster! I hear banjos!
 
Re: Women's Team, Challenge for a Spot!!!

There are no answers because there aren't any questions to answer for except the ones created by the hallucinations in your brain where you've somehow managed to actually convince yourself that the USA is trying not to ice it's best team so that we can continue to have international women's ice hockey.
 
Re: Women's Team, Challenge for a Spot!!!

WIrinkrat said:
There are no answers because there aren't any questions to answer for except the ones created by the hallucinations in your brain where you've somehow managed to actually convince yourself that the USA is trying not to ice it's best team so that we can continue to have international women's ice hockey.
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WIrinkrat - The first time you refused to entertain any critique of the 'authorities' was disturbing, the above was just wrong. Not saying yaba is spot on, but there are reasons she is asking the questions she is.

You, WIRR, as an older, experienced hockey person could easily tease out the valid concerns of the OP or a view from the other side with some answers (if you have any - you sure talk like you do) instead of twisting words, insulting and slamming the door.
 
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