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Wisconsin Hockey Vol. XXVI: How I Learned To Stop Worrying And Tolerate The BTHC

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Re: Wisconsin Hockey Vol. XXVI: How I Learned To Stop Worrying And Tolerate The BTHC

Here's the article about bidding for the Frozen Four, also for a regional.
 
Re: Wisconsin Hockey Vol. XXVI: How I Learned To Stop Worrying And Tolerate The BTHC

markwojo said:
I feel odd quoting myself but here's the summary of the first couple Eaves teams:

Just look at his early classes and their draft position....Earl (6th round), Joudrey (8th), Dowell (5th), Burish (8th), Pavelski (7th)....all guys that have skated in the NHL and some with a great deal of success. Now realize that guys drafted outside the top couple of rounds have extremely long odds of ever playing in the NHL, and that is a pretty good track record. That was just the forwards, now if you want to talk D...undrafted guys like Drewiske, Piskula, and Wozniewski from Eaves first teams skated shifts in the NHL. Or for giggles, we can talk about John Mitchell who washed out of no less then 3 USHL teams in 2 years before ending up in Madison as a mid-term greyshirt that turned into a pretty good college player and has actually managed to earn AHL paychecks.

It's way more then just Burish and Mitchell. There is 8 names off just the first couple Eaves teams that stastically had no business playing in the NHL. I think the success rate of guys drafted outside the first 2 rounds is around 12% of ever playing in the NHL. And its not just those first couple teams....Eaves has gotten guys to the next level at an unparralleled rate. Eaves has also had a better then it should be success rate with guys drafted in the first and second rounds. The proof is in the results of guys making it to the next level on Eaves development track record. He has put the most guys into the NHL during his time at UW then anyone else in college. That, while not regularly being one of the top recruiters. UW recruiting has been solid, but during Eaves tenure....I think it would be awefully hard to argue he has not generally been behind Minnesota, North Dakota, Michigan, BC, and probably even Denver in terms of recruiting class rankings.

My complaints with Eaves is not player development...it's that he has not seemingly managed to leverage an impressive trackrecord of development into a better slot in the recruiting battles (again we've been good....but rarely in the top 5) nor has he balanced out his classes.
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In this discussion, I'm not caring about post UW play, I'm looking at their developement at UW only, and I think we're not quite on the same page there. I don't think draft position is a good indicator of Eave's development skills of college period players. Look at where these guys came from.....Earl and Dowell were with the USDP (Dowell was underdeveloped), Paves put up 69 and 52 pts in the USHL as a late bloomer, Joudrey put up 78 pts his yr before UW (I think Eaves underdeveloped him as 29 pts was his best and last year), and Burish put up 57 in the ushl. These guys should have been upper end guys in college, and a couple didn't reach that level, along with others. The fact they turned out great in the nhl is awesome, but IMO there's a lot of underdeveloped guys that didn't get better in the lean years.
 
Re: Wisconsin Hockey Vol. XXVI: How I Learned To Stop Worrying And Tolerate The BTHC

Badger Booster said:
Why even have the illusion of a host school in a city with no college program nearby? As a Badger women's hockey fan, it really bothers me they are putting in a bid for a Tampa Frozen Four, but UW has never hosted a NCAA Women's Frozen Four (or even WCHA tournament).
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If I were the NCAA, I'd consider giving it to UW...but that's it. If you really want to submit to host in other markets, you should not also get to host locally for another decade+.
 
Re: Wisconsin Hockey Vol. XXVI: How I Learned To Stop Worrying And Tolerate The BTHC

Timothy A said:
In this discussion, I'm not caring about post UW play, I'm looking at their developement at UW only, and I think we're not quite on the same page there. I don't think draft position is a good indicator of Eave's development skills of college period players. Look at where these guys came from.....Earl and Dowell were with the USDP (Dowell was underdeveloped), Paves put up 69 and 52 pts in the USHL as a late bloomer, Joudrey put up 78 pts his yr before UW (I think Eaves underdeveloped him as 29 pts was his best and last year), and Burish put up 57 in the ushl. These guys should have been upper end guys in college, and a couple didn't reach that level, along with others. The fact they turned out great in the nhl is awesome, but IMO there's a lot of underdeveloped guys that didn't get better in the lean years.
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So you don't want to use players moving on to the next level and being successful post Eaves as a criteria to judge development success....umm...okay. Sorry, but at every level of hockey from Mite up, the developmental capabilities of a coach is judge by whether their players move on to the next level and have success.

I've heard the argument about this guy scored this many goals in high school, or this many in junior and that logic is flawed. Was a guy like Kessel not developed because he can't score 3 or 4 goals a game and he's never had a 10 goal game in the NHL like he was able to in youth hockey? Burish is not the first guy (in fact almost EVERY player has production drop off at each step up the hockey pyramid) to drop off from high school or junior production to the next level.
 
markwojo said:
So you don't want to use players moving on to the next level and being successful post Eaves as a criteria to judge development success....umm...okay. Sorry, but at every level of hockey from Mite up, the developmental capabilities of a coach is judge by whether their players move on to the next level and have success.

I've heard the argument about this guy scored this many goals in high school, or this many in junior and that logic is flawed. Was a guy like Kessel not developed because he can't score 3 or 4 goals a game and he's never had a 10 goal game in the NHL like he was able to in youth hockey? Burish is not the first guy (in fact almost EVERY player has production drop off at each step up the hockey pyramid) to drop off from high school or junior production to the next level.
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As usual we agree, When the player pool thins at the next level and only the higher level are left that is what happens in all sports. A lot of Great players in high school become good players in the ushl and role players in college. The truly super star players cannot be defined by their stats because as the competition tightens they still produce at a level equal to that level of competition.
 
Re: Wisconsin Hockey Vol. XXVI: How I Learned To Stop Worrying And Tolerate The BTHC

I wonder how much the staff looks at the kids' forebears and when they matured. Dustin Penner, for example, couldn't get on a junior team in Canada and decided at the last minute to go to Jucco in the US. Then he physically matured and performed better at higher levels than he did in HS.

As early as they start looking at kids these days, the DNA and growth timing has to be part of the assessment, other than just observing that the kid's mother is big boned. Or, as with most Minnesota kids, boneheaded.
 
ExileOnDaytonStreet said:
Interesting cameo by the 1997-98 Badgers in last night's Breaking Bad episode (some thinly veiled spoilers in the article):

http://extramustard.si.com/2013/09/...ured-a-classic-college-hockey-game-from-1998/
Click to expand...

Very cool. Pretty neat how they figured out which game it was. I believe it is the Badgers who are playing the Gophers in the movies Fargo and Grumpy Old Men too. Love seeing college hockey references in movies and TV. Anyone know of any others?
 
Re: Wisconsin Hockey Vol. XXVI: How I Learned To Stop Worrying And Tolerate The BTHC

mnstate0fhockey said:
Very cool. Pretty neat how they figured out which game it was. I believe it is the Badgers who are playing the Gophers in the movies Fargo and Grumpy Old Men too. Love seeing college hockey references in movies and TV. Anyone know of any others?
Click to expand...

I haven't seen the movie, but the trailer for Trouble With the Curve has some visible Badger hockey in the background. At 2:17, you can see a distinct motion W on the rink on the TV on the wall.
 
Re: Wisconsin Hockey Vol. XXVI: How I Learned To Stop Worrying And Tolerate The BTHC

ExileOnDaytonStreet said:
Interesting cameo by the 1997-98 Badgers in last night's Breaking Bad episode (some thinly veiled spoilers in the article):

http://extramustard.si.com/2013/09/...ured-a-classic-college-hockey-game-from-1998/
Click to expand...

Nice find. Of course, I think the Denver Pioneers are the star of the cameo. :)
BTW Mark Rycroft is the color analyst for DU Hockey radio broadcasts and PioneerVision.
 
Re: Wisconsin Hockey Vol. XXVI: How I Learned To Stop Worrying And Tolerate The BTHC

mnstate0fhockey said:
Very cool. Pretty neat how they figured out which game it was. I believe it is the Badgers who are playing the Gophers in the movies Fargo and Grumpy Old Men too. Love seeing college hockey references in movies and TV. Anyone know of any others?
Click to expand...

don't know about Grumpy Old Men but in Fargo yes, the game was Wisconsin vs. Minnesota, Paul Ranheim (iirc) either scores or is mentioned during that clip...cool stuff!
 
Re: Wisconsin Hockey Vol. XXVI: How I Learned To Stop Worrying And Tolerate The BTHC

solovsfett said:
don't know about Grumpy Old Men but in Fargo yes, the game was Wisconsin vs. Minnesota, Paul Ranheim (iirc) either scores or is mentioned during that clip...cool stuff!
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IMDB credits Ranheim for scoring a goal vs Minnesota in "Fargo"
 
Re: Wisconsin Hockey Vol. XXVI: How I Learned To Stop Worrying And Tolerate The BTHC

Chuck Schwartz said:
IMDB credits Ranheim for scoring a goal vs Minnesota in "Fargo"
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I don't remember the context of the scene. Curious that the Minnesota native directors show the Badgers scoring?

Is the goal followed by someone commenting in disgust?

Haven't seen the (full) movie in years. The teenager hasn't seen it yet, so maybe we'll check it out this weekend...


EDIT: Maybe a connection to Ranheim himself?
 
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Re: Wisconsin Hockey Vol. XXVI: How I Learned To Stop Worrying And Tolerate The BTHC

If you're not aware, former Badger and current Minnesota Wild center Jake Dowell's father, John, and older brother, Luke, are suffering from Huntington's disease. There is a 50-50 shot that Jake also caries that gene. Jake and his family will be featured on ESPN's show E:60 on Tuesday at 6 p.m. CT.

In advance of the shows airing, I interviewed ESPN reporter Chris Connelly, who has been working on this story for two years.

Here is the link to the interview. I don't care if you read it or not, but I've seen a rough cut of what will air Tuesday (it was on our website for a short time last Thursday). It's very emotional, very powerful. It's a must watch for not only every Badger fan, but any sports fan.
 
solovsfett said:
don't know about Grumpy Old Men but in Fargo yes, the game was Wisconsin vs. Minnesota, Paul Ranheim (iirc) either scores or is mentioned during that clip...cool stuff!
Click to expand...

In Grumpy Old Men one of the guys has a Gopher Hockey game on a tiny black and white TV in his ice house. I believe they were playing the Badgers, but admit it has been a while since I've seen that movie.
 
Re: Wisconsin Hockey Vol. XXVI: How I Learned To Stop Worrying And Tolerate The BTHC

Gurtholfin said:
Is the goal followed by someone commenting in disgust?
Click to expand...

Fargo - Wade Gustafson (father of the wife of the main character) is watching the game on TV and when the Badgers score he just kind of grunts and makes an angry face.
 
Re: Wisconsin Hockey Vol. XXVI: How I Learned To Stop Worrying And Tolerate The BTHC

GoBucky! said:
Fargo - Wade Gustafson (father of the wife of the main character) is watching the game on TV and when the Badgers score he just kind of grunts and makes an angry face.
Click to expand...


Now that you mention this, I remember it...
 
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