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WIAC schools to pull out a year earlier than originally planned

Re: WIAC schools to pull out a year earlier than originally planned

Would the NCAA allow the WIAC to take the NCHA's Pool A status if SNC and CSS sign on as associate members or since it is a new administrative structure would the WIAC be forced to swim in Pool B for a couple of years? This could also impact SNC's decision. Would SNC be willing to sacrifice two years of auto bids in order to keep the NCHA cast of schools intact?
 
Re: WIAC schools to pull out a year earlier than originally planned

I read somewhere that if the current 7 teams remain in tact the WIAC could apply for an exemption of the waiting period. If the exemption was granted, the league would have an AQ in it's first season of play (2013-14.)
 
norm1909 said:
The NCAA could waiver anything - but it isn't to likely....
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The MASAC didn't have 7 teams that had been playing together in a conference for the required 2 years. Not the best example. (Nor did it have 4 teams which have won National titles, 3 of which have won multiple.)

If the 7 NCHA teams remain, the NCAA could very well consider the WIAC to simply be a rebranded NCHA.
 
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Re: WIAC schools to pull out a year earlier than originally planned

altazo said:
The MASAC didn't have 7 teams that had been playing together in a conference for the required 2 years. Not the best example. (Nor did it have 4 teams which have won National titles, 3 of which have won multiple.)

If the 7 NCHA teams remain, the NCAA could very well consider the WIAC to simply be a rebranded NCHA.
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All except upstart Westfield were members of the ECAC umbrella, as for National titles, if this were big $$ Division I, the NCAA might care, but in DIII hockey, the titles, IMO, would have NO impact on saying it was fair for the MASCAC to meet the mandatory two-year waiting period and not the WAIC.
 
Re: WIAC schools to pull out a year earlier than originally planned

I knew the mention of the titles would give you ammo.

The fact remains that the important part of obtaining an AQ is a league must have 7 d3 schools that have been playing in a conference together for at least 2 seasons. The MASAC didn't have that. The WIAC may...
 
Re: WIAC schools to pull out a year earlier than originally planned

altazo said:
I knew the mention of the titles would give you ammo.

The fact remains that the important part of obtaining an AQ is a league must have 7 d3 schools that have been playing in a conference together for at least 2 seasons. The MASAC didn't have that. The WIAC may...
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No need for Ammo, note that IMO, any sanctioned conference, who exhibits sincere "good faith efforts" to reach and maintain compliance with the baseline requirements deserves an AQ. My post during Adrian's non-AQ years would more than prove this.

That said, I don't think they would get a waiver, while they have some things going for them, I don't think the NCAA is thrilled or impressed by the WIAC's actions. The actions of the WIAC schools might provide cost savings/synergies/advantages, et al for THEM, but for the NCAA, it yields mostly a PITA.
 
Re: WIAC schools to pull out a year earlier than originally planned

I guess we'll see.

If SNC and CSS go a different route, this debate will be moot.
 
Re: WIAC schools to pull out a year earlier than originally planned

altazo said:
I guess we'll see.

If SNC and CSS go a different route, this debate will be moot.
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Thank you, you used the right word (moot) instead of the word that too many people think is the right word (mute).
 
Re: WIAC schools to pull out a year earlier than originally planned

altazo said:
That's the thing - the NCHA currently has no truly weak teams. Any team can beat any team on any given night. That kind of competition week in week out has been a major contributor in SNC 's recent NCAAs success. The MCHA isn't quite there yet, but it sure is improving.

I really believe SNC and CSS are going to stick together wherever they end up, and I think its gonna be the WIAC. However, if CSS ends up in the MIAC (unlikely, but I'm not sure why) I believe SNC will take a long hard look at the MCHA.
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Here is why it is unlikely:

the Saints’ road to the MIAC must climb over a pair of obstacles, according that league’s executive director Dan McKane.

“At this point, it is too early to tell what is going to happen with St. Scholastica’s hockey program,” McKane said. “What I can tell you is that (the MIAC has) a moratorium on new membership, which was put in place many years ago. We also don’t allow for any affiliate members.
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Read more: http://www.uscho.com/2012/02/21/wia...ertainty-for-remaining-schools/#ixzz1uKc7Ynev
 
Re: WIAC schools to pull out a year earlier than originally planned

norm1909 said:
No need for Ammo, note that IMO, any sanctioned conference, who exhibits sincere "good faith efforts" to reach and maintain compliance with the baseline requirements deserves an AQ. My post during Adrian's non-AQ years would more than prove this.

That said, I don't think they would get a waiver, while they have some things going for them, I don't think the NCAA is thrilled or impressed by the WIAC's actions. The actions of the WIAC schools might provide cost savings/synergies/advantages, et al for THEM, but for the NCAA, it yields mostly a PITA.
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I defer to you on the AQ, possibility of a waiver, etc., but this last part does not sound true to me. I think the NCAA is probably quite pleased to see a stable, all-sport conference such as WIAC sponsor men's and women's hockey - and especially so if it reduces the number of hockey-only conferences. Single-sport conferences are what I believe the NCAA considers "mostly a PITA."
 
NUProf said:
Would the NCAA allow the WIAC to take the NCHA's Pool A status if SNC and CSS sign on as associate members or since it is a new administrative structure would the WIAC be forced to swim in Pool B for a couple of years? This could also impact SNC's decision. Would SNC be willing to sacrifice two years of auto bids in order to keep the NCHA cast of schools intact?
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The WIAC schools have been playing under two banners for a long time. That's why every year there are always NCHA awards and WIAC awards. That's why there are WIAC Conference Champ banners up in every arena except St. Norbert, St. Scholastica, and Eau Claire (we want our own conference!). The first year of the WIAC happened long ago, so as long as they have the number of teams needed for an AQ (7) IMO they won't have to wait for an AQ. Otherwise maybe it will be the pool B. As awesome as the Knights have been for a decade + and the Saints have had a few good years recently too, the NCHA is the best conference top to bottom. In other words the WIAC needs the Knights and the Saints and as much as the whole thing went down the wrong pipe it's vice versa too. Ask Norwich how well a weak conference prepared them for Nationals this year (insert Castleton 11-1 Conference Championship Game here).
 
Re: WIAC schools to pull out a year earlier than originally planned

Blugold Hockey said:
The WIAC schools have been playing under two banners for a long time. That's why every year there are always NCHA awards and WIAC awards. That's why there are WIAC Conference Champ banners up in every arena except St. Norbert, St. Scholastica, and Eau Claire (we want our own conference!). The first year of the WIAC happened long ago, so as long as they have the number of teams needed for an AQ (7) IMO they won't have to wait for an AQ. Otherwise maybe it will be the pool B. As awesome as the Knights have been for a decade + and the Saints have had a few good years recently too, the NCHA is the best conference top to bottom. In other words the WIAC needs the Knights and the Saints and as much as the whole thing went down the wrong pipe it's vice versa too. Ask Norwich how well a weak conference prepared them for Nationals this year (insert Castleton 11-1 Conference Championship Game here).
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You have to have a 7 team conference for at least two years before you can get a pool A bid. The MASCAC (a holy multi-sport conference, too) had a conference set up like the WIAC did, but it didn't have seven teams until they added Plymouth State and UMD. Once they did, the clock started ticking on the two year probation period. As for the "NCHA is best" nonsense, that is a purely subjective judgement on your part - statistical data suggests that that honor probably belongs to the ECAC West. As for Castleton, If you had seen the two regular season games between Norwich and Castleton, you would not be so quick to pull out the "weak" label on them.
 
NUProf said:
You have to have a 7 team conference for at least two years before you can get a pool A bid. The MASCAC (a holy multi-sport conference, too) had a conference set up like the WIAC did, but it didn't have seven teams until they added Plymouth State and UMD. Once they did, the clock started ticking on the two year probation period. As for the "NCHA is best" nonsense, that is a purely subjective judgement on your part - statistical data suggests that that honor probably belongs to the ECAC West. As for Castleton, If you had seen the two regular season games between Norwich and Castleton, you would not be so quick to pull out the "weak" label on them.
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You're right, I based my opinion on the Norwich team I saw at Nationals the year before and how much better I thought they would be after one more year of experience compared to how far the St. Norbert team came this year from start to Championship. The Knights probably would have probably done the same thing had they played in the MIAC or the MCHA against those teams. Completely agree I didn't get to see Norwich play them regular season. 11-1 Conference Championship game? Maybe Norwich should have tried as hard all season long and they would have been pushed / ready for the Knights. Then again everyone would have called them classless if they blew everyone out all season long. Conference problem I guess.. Either way I think the Knights and Saints realize that this is a good thing and let's not let higher ups mess this up. Otherwise if the Knights join the MCHA, how much better does that team get every year? Have they lost against the MCHA yet? The answer is no and good records in the MCHA don't = success in the NCAA's, ask Adrian. As far as the Saints, I don't see them wanting to add the travel involved in the MCHA and the MIAC isn't sharing their secret hand shake (yet).
 
Re: WIAC schools to pull out a year earlier than originally planned

Blugold Hockey said:
You're right, ...
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You do realize that the WIAC - like the MASCAC, also doesn't "have a 7 team conference for at least two years", until they add two more - presumably St Norbert and CSS, once they do, the clock will start ticking.
 
norm1909 said:
You do realize that the WIAC - like the MASCAC, also doesn't "have a 7 team conference for at least two years", until they add two more - presumably St Norbert and CSS, once they do, the clock will start ticking.
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And that might be why both the NCHA and WIAC moved it up a year too.
 
Re: WIAC schools to pull out a year earlier than originally planned

Maybe it will be a good thing if they have to wait 2 years for the AQ? Give some other conferences a shot at accumulating some National titles.



Disclaimer - I couldn't resist, this was just a joke and obviously doesn't apply to Norwich and Middlebury.
 
Re: WIAC schools to pull out a year earlier than originally planned

I love all the talk about how great the NCHA is, but take St. Norberts accomplishments and move them to the MCHA and you could say the same thing about that league. A top four of St. Norberts, Adrian, MSOE and Marian would stand up against the WIAC just fine. I think maybe the WIAC should be a little more worried about there standing in the DIv III hockey world should St. Norberts and CSS move to differnt leagues - I think quickly they would become the third best league in the west with limited access to the NCAA's.
 
Re: WIAC schools to pull out a year earlier than originally planned

Blugold Hockey said:
..................... and good records in the MCHA don't = success in the NCAA's, ask Adrian.
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I don't think the Adrian reference helps your argument.
Adrian have made it to the tournament twice in their 5 year history.
Record = W2-L2.......and played in a National Championship game.

= more success than NCHA/WIAC teams (not named SNC) in the NCAA's in the past 5 years ?
 
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