UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

So, was that a self-inflicted wound, or a reminder of how thin the talent is on this team? It felt like a bit of both. Without Wyse it felt pretty scary on D most of the time. And yet, Gildon/Marks were on the ice for both goals. Hmmmm. Without Eiserman, it looked like Vela was playing by himself. He was all over the place doing everything to generate some O, but the other two couldn’t seem to get on the same page or provide support.
Given that the first two changes were uncontrollable, was it smart to mess with Blackburn’s line, even though it was Grasso returning? Should he have been thrown into Eiserman’s slot to leave Blackburn’s line intact until the sophs could have a week of practice? Note that I am assuming the lines we saw last night are the ones that practiced all week. Continuing on this Monday morning tack, was it wise to mess with the chemistry of the fourth line on the same night the other changes were also occurring? Sato was great fun to watch, but the fourth line had none of the effectiveness tonight that we saw in the first five games.
With all the fiddling, only the first line was intact, and they looked pretty ineffective all night, at least in the offensive end.
They had to address a D pairing and one line, but with a Grasso for Eiserman sub, it could have been limited to that. Why mess with three out of four lines?
OK, that’s enough whining.
Let’s get back to winning.

Interestingly most of the commentary after the game I heard was 'we played better tonight'. Personally and FWIW I wasn't overly thrilled with the weekend play despite putting up the 5 goals on Friday (loved the Gildon hattie) and I agree with you with the play last night. Seemed like lots of disconnect here and there and we did have chances that just didn't go our way. Not for a lack of effort. Not scoring on 2/ 5 on 3 opps props to CC's PK. Puck possession was often torturous at times; hard to get, hard to keep. Lots of shots coming from nowhere it seemed in desperation (and that wasn't toward the end when we needed to get the tie). I think you are going to see that when you shake stuff up. D wise...missed Wyse terribly. Reading the papers this morning my comments mean squat but that's just a fans view. Still...what a start and you can't argue with that.

I guess we'll need to be ready for UVM and settle some things down. Season is still young and I suspect they are figuring some things out. What you described is what happens when things get mixed with players out, and players in. BUT having Grasso back is a good thing, no doubt about that. Here's hoping the Eiserman knee issue is able to resolve; hard to say he was limping but he's a gamer. I'm looking for cohesive lines for Vermont.

Not sure I agree with the 'thin on talent' comment although you could see what happens when a couple of vital players are out. The pieces will have to fit better in my early view. I'm keeping in mind the season is young and the start has been fantastic! We've got two new Dmen (Maas and Gildon) who are looking to hit their NCAA stride. Gildon is a coachable kid and he's only going to get better in his D. As the competition gets stiffer, then we know what we got in a broader scope. Just my .02 on that. It was good to see you guys btw. And on a final note? Thought DT had a great weekend.

Ps...too many whistles last night. Just sayin'. Zip flow.

 

[Snively65]

Hey Chuck...Mike....Greg.....just getting back into Wildcats season.....very impressed with espn3 doing the games(YouTube for women)....but unfortunately I am writing because I am stunned, like blown away, with the fact that Lake Whitt is 2/3 EMPTY! It's a weekend with a team not often seen, non-league, a good start for the boys.....and it's empty! ***! I'm aware of the Scarano effect, since he's became AD both teams have tanked, but this is the Whitt.....this was a hockey school....lines out the door past the old NE Center! Unbelievable........truly a disgrace! Thoughts...

USCHO listed attendance at 4130, which would be about 2/3 seats full. I was not there, so cannot say how many empty seats in the student section. But, if only 1/3 full overall (1000 students(?) and 1000 others), seems to me that a couple thousand STHs are no shows?

Unrelated, but who was the other regular besides Eiserman and Wyss who sat to make room for Grasso, Sato, and James Miller? Was Wyss also hurt?

Knowing the PWR is meaningless until January or so, still interesting that three Colorado schools are 2nd (Air Force), 3rd (CC), and 6th (DU), and that recent doormats CC, UNH, and Wisco are in the top six.

Say what you want, but teams that rack up 40 SOG should win.

 

[Aerman]

USCHO listed attendance at 4130, which would be about 2/3 seats full. I was not there, so cannot say how many empty seats in the student section. But, if only 1/3 full overall (1000 students(?) and 1000 others), seems to me that a couple thousand STHs are no shows?

Unrelated, but who was the other regular besides Eiserman and Wyss who sat to make room for Grasso, Sato, and James Miller? Was Wyss also hurt?

Knowing the PWR is meaningless until January or so, still interesting that three Colorado schools are 2nd (Air Force), 3rd (CC), and 6th (DU), and that recent doormats CC, UNH, and Wisco are in the top six.

Say what you want, but teams that rack up 40 SOG should win.

Fregona. I’m under the impression he’s fine, just a chance for Sato to play.

 

[HockeyRef]

USCHO listed attendance at 4130, which would be about 2/3 seats full. I was not there, so cannot say how many empty seats in the student section. But, if only 1/3 full overall (1000 students(?) and 1000 others), seems to me that a couple thousand STHs are no shows?

Unrelated, but who was the other regular besides Eiserman and Wyss who sat to make room for Grasso, Sato, and James Miller? Was Wyss also hurt?

Knowing the PWR is meaningless until January or so, still interesting that three Colorado schools are 2nd (Air Force), 3rd (CC), and 6th (DU), and that recent doormats CC, UNH, and Wisco are in the top six.

Say what you want, but teams that rack up 40 SOG should win.

Fregona sat last night and he had been a regular. Was expecting to see Dawson play instead of Miller but was glad he (Miller) got a shot. Totally agree on the we should've won thing with the SOG's but didn't seem like a ton of them were quality opps. Seemed like we played way too long in our defensive end so that has to change against the better teams.

There were a few scrums for Leclerc and the one clanger when DT lost his stick and was sprawled on the ice.... And so many whistles led to disjointed play but hey I'm not a real hockeyref lol. I have an opinion about the officiating tho but it's irrelevant and not the reason we lost.

Attendance looked about what it has been since the start; main student section seemed full (not packed and some slight spill over to our section which had more in it than normal). Empty across the ice from stu section lots of seats available in 117,118, and 119. Place isn't a morgue tho...and I wouldn't say it was 2/3rds empty but those are my estimations being there as opposed to seeing it in the tube. Bet the return of the River Hawks might bring in more peeps.

 

[catsfan]

Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

I'll take a shot at this as an "outsider." All I can say is you're not alone. My theory is that, first of all, the season is too long. Early October is ridiculous to start hockey. Now I know at BU, the school is COMPLETELY different in terms of student demographics than it was even twenty years ago. There is a giant international population. You can't just say, "Well, we'll market to them and they will show up." Hockey is a regional, niche sport. Most of us who follow hockey grew up with it either because we grew up in a climate where it was played frequently or had fathers who exposed us to it. It's a sport that requires more of the "hard core" fan, as opposed to some other sports, which attract more casual fans simply because of the increased coverage on "wide-reaching" (read: national) networks. I don't know the demographics at UNH, but clearly "other" activities and interests exist now that weren't available when we were students. Just the prevalence of the internet, computers and technological advancements seems to attract students and appeal to them more than watching sporting events.

Also, I know I didn't have a car when I was a student. It seems today that students have more money and resources to go "off campus" for entertainment. Of course, this is even more prevalent in the city, so it's very difficult for hockey to compete against that. When I was in school, we also played during the week - not just on weekends. Students would be less inclined to go home, or out of town, or whatever, during a school night.

Now obviously the "isolated" schools have a more captive audience. In the East, there are more urban schools that simply offer more, especially when one has the means (money, transportation) to partake of these things.

So to me, it's a combination of availability, resources and lifestyle that have all contributed to the decline in attendance. I wish there was a magic bullet, but the reality is I don't see how you can go back to the days when it was the "only game in town." Those days are gone. It's a big world and being a student on campus isn't as "isolating" as it once was. That's probably not the answer you were hoping for, but I don't think there is one. I don't like it either. And, in fact, the effect cascades. As the arenas become emptier, I am less inclined to go because, as several have mentioned, the atmosphere is dead. So this just begets even less excitement and smaller attendance and a domino effect occurs. I also think students today will show up for the "big events." There doesn't appear to be the "dedicated" following, even if someone LOVES hockey. They tend to not confine themselves to one or two things. So there isn't a feeling that one has to attend "consistently," as long as they can show up for the "big game." It's a media-driven world. I remember a few years ago when BU was playing the Patriot League Championship tournament final at Agganis. It was live on ESPN and the place was packed - a complete madhouse. But they never got more than 300-400 fans for ANY other game all year.

Even the attendance at the Hockey East tournament at TD Garden last year was down. Attendance for the Beanpot is down. The availability of games on your computer has made it easier to stay away. And, as previously mentioned, money is no object. These students will pay to watch on their computers as much as they will pay to go. And speaking of money, ticket prices are becoming insane (which may very well be a larger factor than anyone seems to realize). There are tickets on the "BU Ticket Exchange" for the BC game in December priced at NINETY-TWO DOLLARS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! People had better wake up fast...

Yes, I think you are right on all counts. I have been to all of the UNH football and hockey home games this year and the size (not necessarily the volume, which has been pretty strong at times given the limited number of fans at the games) of the student crowd has been abysmal. We have a new football stadium and have a consistently good football team, but the students just do not show, and of those who do, many tend to leave at the half. There was only a pretty good turnout on homecoming but many of the students did not attend the game, choosing to remain at what looked to be a pretty happening tailgate that lasted through the afternoon. The school has tried scheduling later afternoon games and night games, to no effect. At this point the new stadium and scoreboard have had a disappointing impact on attendance.

In terms of hockey, I would add a few factors. First, the much noted decline of the team over the last few years (two years ago the team won only five home games all season!; last year only 7). Second, the fans were, at best, taken for granted over the last several years, and only now the season ticker holders are being offered special privileges that may have kept them more involved during the down times had they been offered earlier. Third, the ESPN3 contract that I believe shows all the home games not only makes it easier to watch without coming to the arena, but also detracts from the live fan experience with excessive time-outs. More minor factors, but still irritating, are 1) the fact that the announcer does not always seem to understand how to state the score and the assists, thereby ruining the old tradition of "one, two, three....we want more!", 2) the ridiculously loud canned music that for whatever reason they often play over the band and the cheers, 3) the fact that they do not post the out-of-town scores on the new scoreboard (they announce them but the sound system is too loud and distorted to understand), and 4) an earlier over-abundance of political correctness, with the school banning certain traditional songs and chants (which are off color and R rated, but pretty much all in good fun; this is college hockey after all); thankfully they have relented on this effort.

As to student body, UNH definitely has a larger international composition, and a larger out-of-state population.

Btw, it was nice to see the more boisterous students attending the games this weekend, bringing a great deal of spirit with them. And the band has been very impressive this year. And better late than never on the season ticket inducements, and nice to have beer this year!

Hopefully a stronger team and new coaching will serve to rekindle the old spirit; time will tell.

 

[Greg Ambrose]

Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

Hey Chuck...Mike....Greg.....just getting back into Wildcats season.....very impressed with espn3 doing the games(YouTube for women)....but unfortunately I am writing because I am stunned, like blown away, with the fact that Lake Whitt is 2/3 EMPTY! It's a weekend with a team not often seen, non-league, a good start for the boys.....and it's empty! ***! I'm aware of the Scarano effect, since he's became AD both teams have tanked, but this is the Whitt.....this was a hockey school....lines out the door past the old NE Center! Unbelievable........truly a disgrace! Thoughts...

It might have been 2/3, or 3/4, empty, but two in attendance tonight were Gordie Clark and Bill Beaney.

 

[Greg Ambrose]

Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

Only saw the 3rd. Ugh. The end of the third informed me as to why people complain about Tirone's "wandering". Bad, bad turnover to end it.

Boy, that one play by Tirone! Up to then he had been the "good Danny" but you knew the "bad Danny" had to rear its ugly head at some point. Thank goodness for replay because it did confirm what my eyes saw, the goalie face down on the ice with his back to the play, with his stick lying three feet to his left. But somehow the puck did not go in to the net. Ugh is right.

 

[Greg Ambrose]

Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

Some observations:

Gildon is going to be a marvelous player but we have to remember that he is an 18 year old freshman. It's okay for him to take the initiative and carry the puck up ice. It's what he does best. But, if he is going to be a defenseman, he is going to have to learn to defend. I didn't think he played all that great in his own end Friday night. There was one CC goal when he just stood in front of the net and let a guy go right by him for a goal. And, of course, last night he coughed up the puck for the game winner. He's only played three weeks. Already he knows his offense is more than capable of competing. But he should also know that his defense is not quite up to snuff. Hopefully the coaches will impart this message forcefully.

Overall, I liked the compete level of the forwards this weekend. I liked Salvaggio and McNicholas last year, and the return of Grasso will help as well. Surprised in a way that Vela and Eiserman have been as forceful as they have been. I thought as freshman that they both had more talent than they have shown the last couple of years. Here's hoping that their performance to date is just not an aberration.

I know it's not going to happen, but I do wish that Umile would give some other goalie playing time.

As for the Whit, new and improved in a way. New lighting, beer stand, what revelations. But the attendance was abysmal both games. Last night there is no way there were 4100 in the arena. The student section, even the main two sections, were not full. By the end of the game, half of the kids have left. As for the rest of the arena, there were but a handful of people in the GA sections and in all the others, none was close to be filled. Mostly just saw the old folks like me. If UNH is going to rejuvenate interest in the program, it has to start with youth hockey groups and their families. I have said this a number of times over the years, but BC does a great job filling Conte with kids. UNH should follow their lead.

As for Chikod's point, and it's related to what I said above, college hockey has failed to retain the interest of the casual fan. Attendance figures are down throughout college hockey, east and west. I posted last week on the Frozen Four ticket thread about the fact that advanced purchase of tickets to the FF is way down, even compared to a year ago. Here in Boston, the Beanpot doesn't sell out anymore, nor does Hockey East finals. Can't totally put my finger on the reason why, but perhaps there are just too many options for a person's entertainment dollar, even compared to a few years ago.

 

[e.cat]

It might have been 2/3, or 3/4, empty, but two in attendance tonight were Gordie Clark and Bill Beaney.

Saw Clark and Beaney at Libby's and apparently Keith Foulke was at the game also! Not sure what Foulke's connection to UNH is but he also attends football games.

 

[Dan]

Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

Last night was a dip into the last couple seasons for UNH, who struggled immensely to move or possess the puck. They fumbled pucks all night, put passes in skates, received poorly and squandered scoring chances off the ends of their blades. Gildon losing the puck uncontested was a microcosm for the whole night.

That turnover was a bad one, no question, but I don't think it's fair to put the first goal on him. First of all it was at the end of a PP so UNH was outnumbered down low. Secondly, Marks finally got a stick on the puck and instead of swatting it in the corner tried to go directly across the crease and put it on Gates' tape for a tap-in. Marks being the playmaker is exactly why Gildon and Tirone reacted so slowly. Even still he was right in front of Gates. Unfortunately he's a left-shot and the puck was on his right and on the stick of Gates (a righty). Interestingly enough it's the exact type of play that was reviewed last week to remove assists. But not last night...

Gildon has work to do to defend consistently - so does the entire team. But let's not forget he is a +6 (best on the team). And that is an even strength measure, so his dominance on the PP does not skew numbers in his favor.

Despite shot totals CC was hardly dangerous this weekend - and in particular Saturday. Two long shots got through Friday and two tape to tape TOs led to goals last night. It could have easily been a shutdown weekend with a similar D effort - though im sure the coaches will use the mistakes to harp on continued Defensive focus.

Pass to sticks, catch and control pucks, get full steam on some more shots and it's a 6-0 start...

 

[HockeyRef]

Last night was a dip into the last couple seasons for UNH, who struggled immensely to move or possess the puck. They fumbled pucks all night, put passes in skates, received poorly and squandered scoring chances off the ends of their blades. Gildon losing the puck uncontested was a microcosm for the whole night.

That turnover was a bad one, no question, but I don't think it's fair to put the first goal on him. First of all it was at the end of a PP so UNH was outnumbered down low. Secondly, Marks finally won possession of the puck and instead of swatting it in the corner tried to go directly across the crease and put it on Gates' tape for a tap-in. Marks being the playmaker is exactly why Gildon and Tirone reacted so slowly. Interestingly enough it's the exact type of play that was reviewed last week to remove assists. But not last night...

Gildon has work to do to defend consistently - so does the entire team. But let's not forget he is a +6 (best in the entire team). And that is an even strength measure, so his dominance on the PP does not skew numbers in his favor.

Despite shot totals CC was hardly dangerous this weekend - and in particular last night. Two long shots got through last night and two tape to tape TOs led to goals tonight. It could have easily been a shutdown weekend with a similar D effort - though in sure the coaches will use the mistakes to harp on continued Defensice focus.

Pass to sticks, catch and control pucks, get full steam on some more shots and it's a 6-0 start...

Spot on Dan....

 

[Darius]

Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

So, was that a self-inflicted wound, or a reminder of how thin the talent is on this team? It felt like a bit of both. Without Wyse it felt pretty scary on D most of the time. And yet, Gildon/Marks were on the ice for both goals. Hmmmm. Without Eiserman, it looked like Vela was playing by himself. He was all over the place doing everything to generate some O, but the other two couldn’t seem to get on the same page or provide support.
Given that the first two changes were uncontrollable, was it smart to mess with Blackburn’s line, even though it was Grasso returning? Should he have been thrown into Eiserman’s slot to leave Blackburn’s line intact until the sophs could have a week of practice? Note that I am assuming the lines we saw last night are the ones that practiced all week. Continuing on this Monday morning tack, was it wise to mess with the chemistry of the fourth line on the same night the other changes were also occurring? Sato was great fun to watch, but the fourth line had none of the effectiveness tonight that we saw in the first five games.
With all the fiddling, only the first line was intact, and they looked pretty ineffective all night, at least in the offensive end.
They had to address a D pairing and one line, but with a Grasso for Eiserman sub, it could have been limited to that. Why mess with three out of four lines?
OK, that’s enough whining.
Let’s get back to winning.

To win last night's game? I vote no. Long term for player development? I suppose I vote yes. Errgh.

 

[Darius]

Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

Not overlooking the next 2 games, but the UML rematch will be telling.

 

[HockeyRef]

Not overlooking the next 2 games, but the UML rematch will be telling.

Yup.

 

[Drew S.]

Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

As for the Whit, new and improved in a way. New lighting, beer stand, what revelations. But the attendance was abysmal both games. Last night there is no way there were 4100 in the arena. The student section, even the main two sections, were not full. By the end of the game, half of the kids have left. As for the rest of the arena, there were but a handful of people in the GA sections and in all the others, none was close to be filled. Mostly just saw the old folks like me. If UNH is going to rejuvenate interest in the program, it has to start with youth hockey groups and their families. I have said this a number of times over the years, but BC does a great job filling Conte with kids. UNH should follow their lead.

As for Chikod's point, and it's related to what I said above, college hockey has failed to retain the interest of the casual fan. Attendance figures are down throughout college hockey, east and west. I posted last week on the Frozen Four ticket thread about the fact that advanced purchase of tickets to the FF is way down, even compared to a year ago. Here in Boston, the Beanpot doesn't sell out anymore, nor does Hockey East finals. Can't totally put my finger on the reason why, but perhaps there are just too many options for a person's entertainment dollar, even compared to a few years ago.

I think household economics have changed a lot in the last 20 years too. I would assume the average family spends somewhere around $500 a month between cable, internet, and phones which is money they aren't going to spend elsewhere. With that you get so many more entertainment options than you used to. On top of that food and housing have increased a lot and income has gone down for a lot of people.

Schools would do well to look at the all-in ticket price as opposed to what face value is. I know i've paid $40 for one ticket to some UNH games in the last five years. As a diehard Maine fan I don't mind paying it even though I think its completely ridiculous, but more casual fans aren't going to do that, especially if its for a family of say four. For people who do spend the money and see a half full arena and no atmosphere they probably aren't going to come back. The schools need be realistic about what the average person will be willing to pay.

I think Chikod's observation on less people showing up because of there being less people at the games is a good one. It seemed like at Maine the rink went from about 80% full to 50% full almost overnight. It's not very much fun when you see empty seats all over the place.

 

[zoofer]

Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

Thanks all for the analysis....I hope someone at UNH sees what is here! I think Chickod is right on the money with all points given! Obviously we are not as "metropolitan" as
BU but the many options, the cost of cable with the options given (Drew S), time of the season vs winter and no travel then, vs foliage.....I guess they all play into it......Appreciate the HE stats Greg, as it helps normalize our issue but UNH has to wake up to these issues, especially if it's affecting even their new jewel, over at football! Personally, I wish they would market every sport, and gender! Have Ellen Purrier visit w Umile or Seano at a coach's corner......make sure all sports are included in the espn3 deal.....our only NC is from the women's side!
Anyway, we'll see what the season brings and how some of our theories play out......thanks guys....Go Cats!

 

[Dan]

Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

Getting wins the next two weekends is extremely important with the toughest portion of the year's schedule on the docket after UMass...

@UVM
@UM

----

UML
@BU
BC
@Yale
@PC
PC

 

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

Nice to get some Bucci Love....keep it up 'Cats!

NEW BucciMane Top 11
1 Denver
2 StCloud
3 Wisconsin
4 Providence
5 NDakota
6 MinnSt
7 BU
8 AirForce
9 Clarkson
10 NewHampshire
11 Quinnipiac

 

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

Union leader story: Most likely no Wyse for the weekend...

http://www.unionleader.com/article/20171022/SPORTS22/171029781/1003/sports

 

[After the Whistle]

Re: UNH Wildcats-The Back Nine and Beyond!

Union leader story: Most likely no Wyse for the weekend...

http://www.unionleader.com/article/20171022/SPORTS22/171029781/1003/sports

Wow, out another week. As others have noted, it didn't have the classic -ouch to the hit.

I did think that Miller had a very strong first game and think he will join the other 2 freshmen in making this a most memorable class of D-men. 8 and 28 as very comfortable looking out there. Yes sometimes you can get to comfortable but i saw lots of very nice moves, takeaways and we all love the shot.

A few thoughts on Saturday vs Friday. I think we all knew we would probably not be as lucky Saturday if we didn't play better team defense. On Friday we not only didn't have the defense but we also went into the "play not to lose mode." The entire 3rd period we just skated it up to center ice and dumped it in.

That drives me crazy. That was the biggest contributor to the shot differential of that period. We got 3 shots because we never ventured into the offensive zone. We dump and they come charging back into our zone and pepper DT. Another problem with this approach is that you essentially add about 5 minute to the other teams time of possession. Also, their goalie was so much better Saturday night. No we didn't severely test him but he make some stops that he was letting in on Friday. Not MG's, they were going in all weekend.