The end of leagues as we know?

[beaverhockey]

This confirms what I had heard a week ago...

http://www.grandforksherald.com/event/article/id/208516

MIGHT get UAH a league...but MIGHT destroy the WCHA and CCHA. Not sure I like a league filled with the "leftovers".

 

[MavsFan]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

This has been my biggest fear. The "leftover league" would most likely be the death of hockey at some of the leftover schools. Shane Fredrick of the Mankato Free Press is reporting the same thing. http://mankatofreepresshockey.blogspot.com/2011/07/is-it-end-of-wcha-as-we-know-it.html

 

[Red Cloud]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

Not sure I like this in terms of what it means for the rest of the college hockey world. Might make sense for UND and some of the schools that get invited, but it would be fairly ruinous for a whole slew of schools that have no chance of being a part of such a league. It would almost certainly send the rest of the power teams scrambling to join up, leaving smaller schools in the lurch. The line of distinction between the haves and the have nots becomes a lot wider.

To some extent, we were already at risk of this with the Big Ten alone, but sometimes you've got to take that risk in order to grow the sport (i.e. Penn State's new team). That's going to make life difficult for the CCHA anyway, but there are steps they could take to make the CCHA solvent. Something like this would blow up both the WCHA and the CCHA. Why? UND ought to consider some of the greater ramifications of such a move before they pull the trigger on this.

 

[joecct]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

This is just following the trend of the rest of D-I sports. Most have clear cut dividing lines among the majors, mid-majors and participants.

We've had this for a bit in hockey and within the conferences themselves. But what it looks like is that all the majors (haves) want to gather themselves in one conference. That will REALLY further the class lines and the media money will further skew the differences.

Funny, though, how nobody is talking about realignment in the East. There are only 2 BCS schools here and at UConn football is probably #3 behind the hoops teams.

Also the BTHC will have immense power over college hockey being the only multisport conference in hockey land. Does the Ivy Group split off from the ECAC to provide a balance? Does the Liberty League (albeit a D-III conference) try to do the same?

The next 12 months are going to be very interesting.

 

[MTUHatTrick84]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

The thing is, I don't blame a school like North Dakota for going out and looking for its best option. It has to. Even in an agreement to be a part of an association (The NCAA), each entity has to go out and make sure that it is in the best (i.e. most profitable, most competitive) situation it can find. Some schools have more power at the table, and that is something that has been earned with time and investment into the program and facilities. It seems to me that they have no obligation to "the betterment of college hockey as a whole" if other schools are already jostling to make the most out of an opportunity (the Big Ten).

It does sadden me, though, to think about the ramifications for some of the smaller schools. I grew up on Northern Michigan hockey, and I bleed black and gold from my many years studying at Michigan Tech. I can honestly see this being a death blow for a school like Lake State.

I don't have the answers for the schools that might be on the outside looking in, other than to make powerful friends and work overtime. There should be little sleep in the athletic offices at schools like MTU in the next few months. Find a way to sell yourself as a program that can compete (yes, I said that with a straight face), prepare for every contingency. It isn't up to college hockey and the NCAA to save everybody that participates, it is up to each individual school to find situations in which they can remain viable.

 

[jnacc]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

I wonder if the day has come to form a bonafide NCAA D-2 league? Of course the smaller and have not schools would currently not be in favor of such an idea but you can only run from reality for so long.

 

[ChiefWahoo]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

I wonder if the day has come to form a bonafide NCAA D-2 league? Of course the smaller and have not schools would currently not be in favor of such an idea but you can only run from reality for so long.

For that to happen the NCAA would have to make allot of changes. Basically unwinding the last 25 years of regulations.

 

[mmf]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

I am confused and not sure who to believe...

1. "I'm leaving politics to spend more time with my family" says the Congressman, who is currently embroiled in a sex scandal.

2. "I crashed because I swerved to miss a dog", and I have never seen that hooker and blow before. "Isn't that right Trixie?"

3. "We have to be careful. We want to try to do things the right way. We don’t want to be part of breaking up the CCHA”, says the Commissioner who was given the OK by WCHA member schools to seek out potential new members at their annual hockey meetings in April, and keeps in touch with Notre Dame weekly. But is treading lightly...

4. None of the above.

Things are changing and you can't blame any School, Conference, or Hooker for looking out for their best interest. But give us a break. At least with Trixie, you have asked to have smoke blown up you’re a**.

 

[Patman]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

I wonder if the day has come to form a bonafide NCAA D-2 league?

No. You can go fail on your own.

edit: I find the people wanting to resurrect D-2 hockey... not so much interesting but infuriating. No, it doesn't do much of any of us any good. How much attention are your other D-2 sports getting?

 

[komey1]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

Follow the money. If teams think they can make more money joining the Super League they will. I think it would be more diffucult for a Miami or any Hockey East team to make money by joining up with some of the WCHA powers due to travel costs. Not to mention

The thing with "Super Leagues" is that there will be a change in how those teams are percieved after a few years. Even in a Super League there will be haves and have-nots. By joining that league, you risk being one of the have nots. If no deliniation is created, then the balance will make it more difficult for a Super League team to get the great records to make things easier in the NCAA.

If you are NOT in the Super League - now you have a better chance to have wining seasons and make the NCAA tournament. If you are NMU, LSSU, FSU, or BGSU - losing the B10, Miami, and Notre Dame from your conference makes it that much easier to have winning records. Winning records will draw more people, which helps offset your losses of those teams from the schedule. I'm not saying this is ideal, but it is one of the benefits.

 

[4four4]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

This is great for Minnesota and Wisconsin now they don't have to waste their time playing non conference games against the new proposed super league. ie. football and basketball non-conference money making schedule.

 

[Osorojo]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

Making revenue (money) the primary consideration for establishing college hockey leagues will accelerate Darwinian selection of the haves and have nots and will increase competition with major junior hockey, unless an alliance is formed. Leagues determined by revenue will also result in more and more lavish scholarships, and perhaps lower academic guidelines.

 

[4four4]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

Making revenue (money) the primary consideration for establishing college hockey leagues will accelerate Darwinian selection of the haves and have nots and will increase competition with major junior hockey, unless an alliance is formed. Leagues determined by revenue will also result in more and more lavish scholarships, and perhaps lower academic guidelines.

Not in the Big Ten.

 

[bronconick]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

Farmington Hills, Michigan-

"Mr. Platsch, there's a reporter on the line wanting to know what you think about your league imploding?"

"Take a message. I'm just an empty suit until I'm the Big Ten Communications Director for hockey in 2014."

 

[giwan]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

Making revenue (money) the primary consideration for establishing college hockey leagues will accelerate Darwinian selection of the haves and have nots and will increase competition with major junior hockey, unless an alliance is formed. Leagues determined by revenue will also result in more and more lavish scholarships, and perhaps lower academic guidelines.

So less teams means more revenue? NCAA B-ball more and more teams. Football more and more teams even though it is the costliest of sports to compete in. A tide that raises all the boats is what wins. Darwin was only partially correct.

The B1G formed so big deal they still have to play others and there is no reason to let them dictate.

 

[Osorojo]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

So less teams means more revenue? NCAA B-ball more and more teams. Football more and more teams even though it is the costliest of sports to compete in. A tide that raises all the boats is what wins. Darwin was only partially correct.

The B1G formed so big deal they still have to play others and there is no reason to let them dictate.

Fewer teams with bigger arenas and more attendance means more revenue and fewer schools to split it up. Fewer teams with big T.V. contracts means more revenue and fewer schools to split it up. Still, smaller and less wealthy colleges are free to devote a major share of their resources to support a DI hockey team capable of producing revenue on a par with big schools.

 

[MavsFan]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

Being in a "have-not" league will kill attendance, I don't care if you win or not. Otherwise, CHA would have been a success for BSU and UAH. If Mankato's schedule looks just like their Northern Sun Conference schedule, you'll be able to fire a cannon through the stands without hitting anybody.

 

[komey1]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

So Mankato's "fans" come only when there is a big name opponent? Someone needs to market the team better at that end then. I don't really consider people that come for the big names "fans". In a hockey crazed state like Minnesota, that is not good.

I get that you sometimes need opponents fans in attendance - RIT pretty much can guarantee that Canisius and Niagara games will sell out. But RIT has also shown that they can sell 2100 for UConn and Bentley - not exactly the cream of the crop home games. They probably could sell more with a bigger arena? That is is no small part that RIT has won big in conference play.

 

[uaafanblog]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

Butt Hurt Hockey Conference = ftl
Butt Hurt Hockey Conference 'end of the world' uscho threads = ftw

And oh yeah ... um nothing Faison said was really anything that anyone paying attention didn't pretty much already know.

 

[moose97]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

So Mankato's "fans" come only when there is a big name opponent? Someone needs to market the team better at that end then. I don't really consider people that come for the big names "fans". In a hockey crazed state like Minnesota, that is not good.

I get that you sometimes need opponents fans in attendance - RIT pretty much can guarantee that Canisius and Niagara games will sell out. But RIT has also shown that they can sell 2100 for UConn and Bentley - not exactly the cream of the crop home games. They probably could sell more with a bigger arena? That is is no small part that RIT has won big in conference play.

Nice comparison - a 2000 seat barn in a metro area of over 600,000 selling out for UConn (a name if not a good hockey team) and Bemidji State in a 2500 seat barn in a metro area of 30,000 against Robert Morris or Niagara (schools that have zero name, regional or hockey recognition in northern Minnesota). And Mankato is under 100,000. In a rink that holds 5,000 (who cares about Alaska-Anchorage?). Look at it this way:

2100 is .35% of the population of Rochester
2500 is 8.3% of the population of Bemidji *
4373 is 14.6% of the population of Bemidji **
5000 is 5.3% of the population of Mankato

Yeah - if RIT struggles to sell out, the marketing guy should be fired. If BSU or MSUM struggles to sell out, there's likely a good reason (bad team, tickets are too expensive, bad economy, etc.). Just so you know, you are bragging about RIT selling the equivalent of 105 tickets a game in Bemidji and 333 tickets a game in Mankato (.35% of those metro areas). Might I suggest you go back and look at attendance for BSU and MSUM and look at games with that info in your head.

* John Glas Fieldhouse
** Sanford Center