What's new
By:
USCHO Fan Forum

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

  • The USCHO Fan Forum has migrated to a new plaform, xenForo. Most of the function of the forum should work in familiar ways. Please note that you can switch between light and dark modes by clicking on the gear icon in the upper right of the main menu bar. We are hoping that this new platform will prove to be faster and more reliable. Please feel free to explore its features.

The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

Status
Not open for further replies.
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

Logic and religion don't mix. Redemption and eternity is about going beyond what makes "common" sense. God exists on another plane of reality that doesn't exist from the human, physical frame of reference.
In the example of what we perceive as being "evil" in this world, I picture a guy sitting there whacking himself in the shins with a hockey stick going "OW this sucks! Why doesn't God stop it?" and God is shaking his head and just waiting for the lightbulb moment.*
Or you could think about someone running out onto thin ice, then God causes them to trip to save their life, and they lay there whining about the "evil" of falling down. Never seeing the big picture.
My theory is that if your frame of reference was wide enough, time itself wouldn't even exist. It's just a way set up for us idiots to keep track of things in our tiny little corner of reality. But how much do we rely on it (time-keeping) in life?
It's completely illogical.

*If humanity ever DID learn the lessons being offered, the result would be: everyone living in perfect unconditional love for everyone. (shortest Bible summary ever)
 
Last edited:
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

geezer said:
Logic and religion don't mix. Redemption and eternity is about going beyond what makes "common" sense. God exists on another plane of reality that doesn't exist from the human, physical frame of reference.
In the example of what we perceive as being "evil" in this world, I picture a guy sitting there whacking himself in the shins with a hockey stick going "OW this sucks! Why doesn't God stop it?" and God is shaking his head and just waiting for the lightbulb moment.*
Or you could think about someone running out onto thin ice, then God causes them to trip to save their life, and they lay there whining about the "evil" of falling down. Never seeing the big picture.
My theory is that if your frame of reference was wide enough, time itself wouldn't even exist. It's just a way set up for us idiots to keep track of things in our tiny little corner of reality. But how much do we rely on it (time-keeping) in life?
It's completely illogical.

*If humanity ever DID learn the lessons being offered, the result would be: everyone living in perfect unconditional love for everyone. (shortest Bible summary ever)
Click to expand...

You are right. I will probably never appreciate the big picture of the necessity of a children's hospital.
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

geezer said:
Meaningless and insulting drivel truncated for space

*If humanity ever DID learn the lessons being offered, the result would be: everyone living in perfect unconditional love for everyone. (shortest Bible summary ever)
Click to expand...
Because the bible is a lot like an EULA that it's adherents can't even be bothered to scroll to the end to, they just hit accept.
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

geezer said:
Logic and religion don't mix.
Click to expand...

This part of your post was correct, if only because science/logic typically has physical evidence on its side (though some things remain unexplained at this time). Religion's standard answer to all questioning of its allegories and dogma is, "You gotta have faith!" Two totally separate worldviews.
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

geezer said:
That's the point. We're all extremely narrow-minded.
Click to expand...
Would you kindly stop projecting your own faults on all others? Bob might start thinking you're trying to steal his act.

Or at least realize that you're apologetics make every action and your view of a deity completely meaningless. Afterall, you couldn't possible know anything, could you? So why would it matter in the least?
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

FadeToBlack&Gold said:
This part of your post was correct, if only because science/logic typically has physical evidence on its side (though some things remain unexplained at this time). Religion's standard answer to all questioning of its allegories and dogma is, "You gotta have faith!" Two totally separate worldviews.
Click to expand...

Precisely. But as always it doesn't stop people from trying to use one to explain/refute the other...
 
Last edited:
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

FadeToBlack&Gold said:
This part of your post was correct, if only because science/logic typically has physical evidence on its side (though some things remain unexplained at this time). Religion's standard answer to all questioning of its allegories and dogma is, "You gotta have faith!" Two totally separate worldviews.
Click to expand...
Great. Let's make a deal: we people who like to use science, logic, and math to explain the workings of the world will agree to stop using them to point out contradictions and errors in religion the moment that pastors and theologians stop using pseudo-science, logical fallacies, and anecdotes as proof of anything.
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

Kepler said:
Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
-- Epicurus
Click to expand...

God is able and willing, but the actions in the Garden of Eden destroyed the perfect relationship between God and Man, and sin was born. Fortunately God promised and delivered us a Savior from sin.
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

LynahFan said:
Great. Let's make a deal: we people who like to use science, logic, and math to explain the workings of the world will agree to stop using them to point out contradictions and errors in religion the moment that pastors and theologians stop using pseudo-science, logical fallacies, and anecdotes as proof of anything.
Click to expand...

I propose a different deal. Religion has now held office for roughly 3000 years. Let's let reason hold it for the next 3000, and see where we stand.
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

I have long since learned that there are extremely obtuse folks on either side of the spectrum (we'll call them extremists)...trying to paint everything as black or white. To many its obvious when you run into an extremist Christian who tells everyone how to behave. I don't see very much of that on this board. Extremist atheists (non believers, whatever) have a need to position everything as black or white and set hurdles on it. They have this burning need to justify that God can't exist for some biblical reason that doesn't jive with 'reality'. The average Christian (or any other person) doesn't really care about this as a waste of time...and doesn't put some mystical bar up there in order to justify their views. They just walk the walk because its the cool and right thing to do.

Moderates don't see faith and science as competing but complementary just as with any other teammate situation. Science has been incredible in the advancement of the human condition. Likewise, I have brought out the long, long list of major societal advancements driven by a faith in Jesus that have also greatly advanced the human condition.

Just like any other 'war', its not about which side comes out on top (science or Jesus)...its about getting them to work together to take us forward.
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

Timothy A said:
God is able and willing, but the actions in the Garden of Eden destroyed the perfect relationship between God and Man, and sin was born. Fortunately God promised and delivered us a Savior from sin.
Click to expand...

Timothy, since you take a literal interpretation of the Bible, what actions in the Garden destroyed the perfect relationship between God and Man?

And once that question is out of the way, what really caused the water bottle fight?

Two equally important and vexing questions.
 
Re: The Bible: Real, Fiction, or somewhere in between?

Kepler said:
I propose a different deal. Religion has now held office for roughly 3000 years. Let's let reason hold it for the next 3000, and see where we stand.
Click to expand...
Religion holds office exactly where in the United States government? This one made me guffaw!
 
Bob Gray said:
Religion holds office exactly where in the United States government? This one made me guffaw!
Click to expand...

As recently as 5 years ago, 2/3rds of the country said they would never vote for an atheist for president. While that had gone down lately, are you really trying to say there's no religious test for public office?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top