The B1G's proposal and their defense of it

[UMICH]

Re: The B1G's proposal and their defense of it

MCLA lacrosse, the body that governs club lax, has 200+ schools in 2 divisions, including Minny and Wisco. At the NCAA D1 level, it's cheaper than hockey, they only allow 12.6 scholarships per team (despite rosters that are often 40ish), and they can play on pre-existing fields, but it can also be a revenue sport, which might make it attractive. I'm sure the B1G schools that don't have it are at least studying it, much like hockey.

r

But it is a CLUB team...

Full varsity teams destroy club teams. Michigan went from Club to Varsity in 2011. Michigan was absolutely dominating the Club ranks but since they went varsity they have finished 1-13, 1-13, 4-13, 5-8, and 3-10.

Club teams do not count.

 

[pgb-ohio]

Re: The B1G's proposal and their defense of it

But it is a CLUB team...

Full varsity teams destroy club teams. Michigan went from Club to Varsity in 2011. Michigan was absolutely dominating the Club ranks but since they went varsity they have finished 1-13, 1-13, 4-13, 5-8, and 3-10.

Club teams do not count.

Don't know if you're missing his point or simply choosing to ignore it. But your comment isn't responsive.

Of course throwing a Club roster out against Varsity competition is going to go poorly 99% of the time. Transitional periods will also be tough from a competitive standpoint. But cetihcra's argument is that if a school has facilities already in place for a particular sport, launching a Varsity program is less costly and less problematic than starting from scratch. That's clearly correct. I'll add that if a sport already has a place in the budget, another obstacle is partially removed. Having a constituency of players, staff and supporters already on campus is also a plus in the political process.

I'm not under illusions; adding ANY varsity sport in the current budget environment is going to be a very difficult uphill climb. But not for the reason you suggest.

 

[UMICH]

Re: The B1G's proposal and their defense of it

Don't know if you're missing his point or simply choosing to ignore it. But your comment isn't responsive.

Of course throwing a Club roster out against Varsity competition is going to go poorly 99% of the time. Transitional periods will also be tough from a competitive standpoint. But cetihcra's argument is that if a school has facilities already in place for a particular sport, launching a Varsity program is less costly and less problematic than starting from scratch. That's clearly correct. I'll add that if a sport already has a place in the budget, another obstacle is partially removed. Having a constituency of players, staff and supporters already on campus is also a plus in the political process.

I'm not under illusions; adding ANY varsity sport in the current budget environment is going to be a very difficult uphill climb. But not for the reason you suggest.

I beg the question has ANY varsity sport started at the varsity level? No, they were all club sports at one time before becoming varsity.

I didn't think that Club teams could offer scholarships? ceticra said they did but that was not my understanding. Oh well, I never claimed to be an expert in that area.

 

[cetihcra]

I beg the question has ANY varsity sport started at the varsity level? No, they were all club sports at one time before becoming varsity.

I didn't think that Club teams could offer scholarships? ceticra said they did but that was not my understanding. Oh well, I never claimed to be an expert in that area.

I stated that D1 MLax could offer only 12.6 scholarships...meaning, varsity. That's a tiny number compared to the rosters of most teams...sometimes 40-50 members. Rich white-kid sports FTW.

r

 

[pgb-ohio]

Re: The B1G's proposal and their defense of it

I beg the question has ANY varsity sport started at the varsity level? No, they were all club sports at one time before becoming varsity...

I don't think that's true, but it's admittedly hard to think of contrary examples. If for no other reason, most of the varsity sports I follow have been around longer than I have.

What about Crew? (rowing) Quite a few schools have added Women's Crew teams for Title IX reasons, meaning it was a way to create a large number of opportunities on a cost effective basis. Is it really the case that all of those schools had pre-existing clubs before going varsity? I've never followed that sport closely, but I was under the impression that many of those schools started from scratch -- needing to build boathouses, buy all the gear, and so on.

I would also guess that there are schools out there that have built a natatorium and launched a Varsity Swim team from scratch. But again, I don't have an example I'm 100% sure of. So it's at least a good question.

 

[gfmorris]

Re: The B1G's proposal and their defense of it

I don't think that's true, but it's admittedly hard to think of contrary examples. If for no other reason, most of the varsity sports I follow have been around longer than I have.

What about Crew? (rowing) Quite a few schools have added Women's Crew teams for Title IX reasons, meaning it was a way to create a large number of opportunities on a cost effective basis. Is it really the case that all of those schools had pre-existing clubs before going varsity? I've never followed that sport closely, but I was under the impression that many of those schools started from scratch -- needing to build boathouses, buy all the gear, and so on.

I would also guess that there are schools out there that have built a natatorium and launched a Varsity Swim team from scratch. But again, I don't have an example I'm 100% sure of. So it's at least a good question.

My lens on collegiate rowing is that schools compete at varsity and club (e.g., we raced Yale once), but that the sport isn't terribly expensive unless you're trying to compete at the Olympic level. UAH had varsity crew through either 1994 or 1995 — I had a friend who had come here from Oregon on a crew scholarship. UAH helped start a lot of the crew programs in Alabama, went varsity, and then had to drop back.

GFM