The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

[WeWantMore]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

Throwing more money at the education system- that's clearly the solution.

We spent over $151,000 per student sending the graduating class of 2009 through public schools. That is nearly three times as much as we spent on the graduating class of 1970, adjusting for inflation. Despite that massive real spending increase, overall achievement has stagnated or declined, depending on the subject.

But what of the federal government's other educational goal: narrowing the achievement gaps by income and minority status? Test score breakdowns by family income are not available, but we do have something close: a breakdown by parents' level of education. This allows us to compare the children of high school dropouts to those of college graduates. In Reading and Science, the gap between these students has not narrowed in 40 years. In Math it has narrowed by barely one percent of the test score scale. So, here again, federal appropriations and the programs they have funded have failed to achieve their goals.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

I'm fairly certain that the unemployment rate declined every year right up until the crash. Bottomed out around 4.5%. Are you blaming the high (9%) unemployment on the tax cuts?


the Dem's have convinced the electorate of two things.

1. Profits are stealing.
2. Public Workers don't make enough.

Too funny. Hilarious in fact. Again, cut the public sector out completely. I'm willing to try it. Color me amazed that people are actually more afraid of what teachers are getting paid, while at the same time were afraid to cut bankers bonus checks.

 

[walrus]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

Too funny. Hilarious in fact. Again, cut the public sector out completely. I'm willing to try it. Color me amazed that people are actually more afraid of what teachers are getting paid, while at the same time were afraid to cut bankers bonus checks.

How do we control bankers checks?

 

[Wol4ine]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

I think it was called TARP. You remember, that overwhemingly popular program that the TEA Party people wanted more of?

 

[Wol4ine]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

Too funny. Hilarious in fact. Again, cut the public sector out completely. I'm willing to try it. Color me amazed that people are actually more afraid of what teachers are getting paid, while at the same time were afraid to cut bankers bonus checks.

When have I ever advocated for the complete elimination of the public sector? I thought you guys always say the right wingers were the extremists. Here you go and take our disdain for public sector waste to the extreme and imply it to mean complete elimination.

85% of our K-12 teachers are public school teachers. The private schools have equal if not better results with no government funding . Why isn't the middle class outraged that the richest 15% get private school educations for their kids while the rest of us settle for less?

 

[Foxton]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

85% of our K-12 teachers are public school teachers. The private schools have equal if not better results with no government funding . Why isn't the middle class outraged that the richest 15% get private school educations for their kids while the rest of us settle for less?

Those same schools can pick and chose their students. So better results is about as useful a statistic as calling water wet.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

85% of our K-12 teachers are public school teachers. The private schools have equal if not better results with no government funding . Why isn't the middle class outraged that the richest 15% get private school educations for their kids while the rest of us settle for less?

You honestly don't know? Foxton does, why don't you????

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

How do we control bankers checks?

We owned the banks, didn't we?

 

[Wol4ine]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

Those same schools can pick and chose their students. So better results is about as useful a statistic as calling water wet.

You honestly don't know? Foxton does, why don't you????

You guys are right. It seems so obvious now. All this time I thought private schools chose their students based on ability to pay tuition, what church they went to or the students ability to hit a jumper. When in reality the private schools are poaching all the smarter kids from public school to go to private schools. And at the same time expelling the dumber kids in Private schools, forcing them back in to public ones.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

You guys are right. It seems so obvious now. All this time I thought private schools chose their students based on ability to pay tuition, what church they went to or the students ability to hit a jumper. When in reality the private schools are poaching all the smarter kids from public school to go to private schools. And at the same time expelling the dumber kids in Private schools, forcing them back in to public ones.

Wow. You're lack of understanding is incredible. You obviously think that kids that CAN afford to pay the tuition come from broken homes, etc.

 

[walrus]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

We owned the banks, didn't we?

We own GM, did we get 50% of the Banks stocks also? We all know its only paper anyway, Obama and Congress are like Marionettes and you and I are never getting close to the strings

 

[Wol4ine]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

Wow. You're lack of understanding is incredible. You obviously think that kids that CAN afford to pay the tuition come from broken homes, etc.

It's worse than that Scooby. I have no idea what you mean by this.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

It's worse than that Scooby. I have no idea what you mean by this.

Wow. I've always dreamed of living in a vacuum but I never knew it was possible.

 

[Wol4ine]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

I'm still waiting for you to 'explain away' the meaning of that post. The nuance went way over my head. Use simple words, maybe a few of us neanderthals will learn something.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

I'm still waiting for you to 'explain away' the meaning of that post. The nuance went way over my head. Use simple words, maybe a few of us neanderthals will learn something.

How many kids from broken homes can afford private school? How many poor kids can? Do you disagree that the majority of broken homes also tend to be poorer? Do they deserve an education? Seems to me we can easily balance the books if we just start weeding kids out using a combination of demographics and I.Q. scores. Is that what you want to do? We may be throwing money at the problem and it may not be working but at least we took a swing. The greatest injustice, however, is to compare private and public.

 

[Wol4ine]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

Scooby, I think you're making my point for me. I never said anything about poorer kids not deserving an education. Quite the opposite in fact. Go back to my post #205, second paragraph. We spend in Michigan over $10,000 a year to educate a child in public schools. You weren't under the impression that a public school education was free, were you? How does that compare to private schools? I don't know. Knowing that private school teachers make less, and that salaries are a major (if not biggest) expense, I imagine that $10,000 is comparable to a private school tuition. That may be wrong, I really don't know. If you gave broken homes or poor kids vouchers for $10K couldn't some of them get that private school education?

edit: I just found one private school here in Michigan with tuition and fees for k-8 at $13,000 per year. Considering that Public schools have a virtual monopoly (85% of the market) giving vouchers would spur private school growth and drive the price down eventually.

2nd edit: I just found another 2 private schools, catholic, that came in under $10K. They offer tuition assistance as well, 27% of the students already get that.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

Scooby, I think you're making my point for me. I never said anything about poorer kids not deserving an education. Quite the opposite in fact. Go back to my post #205, second paragraph. We spend in Michigan over $10,000 a year to educate a child in public schools. You weren't under the impression that a public school education was free, were you? How does that compare to private schools? I don't know. Knowing that private school teachers make less, and that salaries are a major (if not biggest) expense, I imagine that $10,000 is comparable to a private school tuition. That may be wrong, I really don't know. If you gave broken homes or poor kids vouchers for $10K couldn't some of them get that private school education?

How are those kids going to get to the private schools? I assume it is safe to say that they won't have easy transportation. How far away is the school? Aren't we just going to have two different kinds of private schools then? If kids from the inner city who have no parental involvement and are disruptive in the class is suzy q. from the rich burbs going to continue to go to school there?

You can't solve the problem with vouchers. All you do is move the nut to a different shell.

 

[WeWantMore]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

How many kids from broken homes can afford private school? How many poor kids can? Do you disagree that the majority of broken homes also tend to be poorer?

But there are programs like vouchers that enable poorer kids to afford private schools. In fact, in Milwaukee, 24% of students now get vouchers.

Guess who the shrillest opponent of vouchers are? That's right, the teachers unions.

All about the kids of course.

Such a voucher program also worked wonders in DC, yet in 2009 the program was killed by Obama and Congress. That was all about the kids too, I'm sure.

 

[Wol4ine]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

How are those kids going to get to the private schools? I assume it is safe to say that they won't have easy transportation. How far away is the school? Aren't we just going to have two different kinds of private schools then? If kids from the inner city who have no parental involvement and are disruptive in the class is suzy q. from the rich burbs going to continue to go to school there?

You can't solve the problem with vouchers. All you do is move the nut to a different shell.

If kids from the inner city who have no parental involvement and are disruptive in the class is suzy q, also from the inner city but wants to learn, going to get an education? The answer to both our questions is probably NO.
One private school in Detroit, Cornerstone Academy requires parental involvment. Tuition is under $5,000 and they have the best rating of Detroit schools. My point isn't to get all kids to one private school. If we gave vouchers to all the parents then these 'Cornerstone Academies' would pop up all over the city.

I think one reason for disruptive students is the lack of consequences. Public schools don't like to expel students because it cuts into thier bottom line. A private school wouldn't hesitate to drop a student if it was preventing others from learning. Otherwise the other students parents would pull them out and go somewhere else. No one pulls a kid out of public school just to go to another public school.

 

[Foxton]

Re: The 112th Congress - The first Orange-American to be elected Speaker

Scooby, don't be stupid. Don't you get it yet? We give vouchers to the good students to go to private schools leaving only the bad ones in the public union run schools. After this happens then we can show just how bad non private schools are so the funding can be cut even more, the unions will be broken, and eventually they will be forced to shut down so it will just be privately run schools. Once more proving how the free market is superior.