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Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition
Math is for elitists...math only helps to hurt the Job Creators!
Math is for elitists...math only helps to hurt the Job Creators!
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ScoobyDoo
NPC
I've concluded that Boner is a moron (or moran, depending upon which part of the country you happen to live).
P
Priceless
Guest
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition
8 years. 8 VERY long years. And he took office in 2001 with a debt of 5,727,776,738,304.64 and when he left office it was 10,628,881,485,510.23 so the debt grew by 4,901,104,747,205.59 which is an average of $612,638,093,400.70.
The debt each year of his presidency:
So he was above that $500B 6 of the 8 years.
8 years. 8 VERY long years. And he took office in 2001 with a debt of 5,727,776,738,304.64 and when he left office it was 10,628,881,485,510.23 so the debt grew by 4,901,104,747,205.59 which is an average of $612,638,093,400.70.
The debt each year of his presidency:
Code:
2001 $5,727,776,738,304.64
2002 $5,924,540,106,802.70 $196,763,368,498.06
2003 $6,387,841,175,651.97 $463,301,068,849.27
2004 $7,006,834,072,435.49 $618,992,896,783.52
2005 $7,613,215,612,328.37 $606,381,539,892.88
2006 $8,175,743,292,992.87 $562,527,680,664.50
2007 $8,676,668,422,505.86 $500,925,129,512.99
2008 $9,191,074,962,157.16 $514,406,539,651.30
2009 $10,626,877,048,913.10 $1,435,802,086,755.92So he was above that $500B 6 of the 8 years.
leswp1
Well-known member
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition
Wow. I am listening to Boner and wondering did he just listen to the prez before he spoke. He might not like what has been proposed but if he wants to convince people he should probably not expect them to forget the prez just said let's cut stuff as he tries to tell them there is nothing said abut cuts.
Not convinced by the prez or what he proposes but Boner really sounded like a spoiled teenager who was having a revisionist moment.
Very depressing that we can't have leaders that are statesmen/women.
Wow. I am listening to Boner and wondering did he just listen to the prez before he spoke. He might not like what has been proposed but if he wants to convince people he should probably not expect them to forget the prez just said let's cut stuff as he tries to tell them there is nothing said abut cuts.
Not convinced by the prez or what he proposes but Boner really sounded like a spoiled teenager who was having a revisionist moment.
Very depressing that we can't have leaders that are statesmen/women.
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition
I thought The Boner was drunk. Either that or he was about to burst into tears.
Anyway, Obama gave the best speech of his career. Its about time he spells it out in plain English for people and takes a stand.
Wow. I am listening to Boner and wondering did he just listen to the prez before he spoke. He might not like what has been proposed but if he wants to convince people he should probably not expect them to forget the prez just said let's cut stuff as he tries to tell them there is nothing said abut cuts.
Not convinced by the prez or what he proposes but Boner really sounded like a spoiled teenager who was having a revisionist moment.
Very depressing that we can't have leaders that are statesmen/women.
I thought The Boner was drunk. Either that or he was about to burst into tears.
Anyway, Obama gave the best speech of his career. Its about time he spells it out in plain English for people and takes a stand.
leswp1
Well-known member
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition
Silly me. I really hoped to have a clear explanation regarding why they were rejecting the cuts they wanted months ago. There wan't anything in there other than the prezident is the bad guy. He is bad. His plan is bad. The stuff calling up the spending from last yr wasn't helpful. Regardless of who is to blame for the debt we own it. Name calling at this point isn't constructive. Telling me why we can't do the prez plan would have been helpful but I didn't really hear anything about that. THe whole thing was like listening to Lil believe some warped logic when he is arguing for something he really wants.
Silly me. I really hoped to have a clear explanation regarding why they were rejecting the cuts they wanted months ago. There wan't anything in there other than the prezident is the bad guy. He is bad. His plan is bad. The stuff calling up the spending from last yr wasn't helpful. Regardless of who is to blame for the debt we own it. Name calling at this point isn't constructive. Telling me why we can't do the prez plan would have been helpful but I didn't really hear anything about that. THe whole thing was like listening to Lil believe some warped logic when he is arguing for something he really wants.
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition
Most of our national debt is owed to ourselves.
China doesn't own the majority of our debt - in fact, they own a very small portion of it.
Most of our national debt is owed to ourselves.
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition
I'm not talking about the debt. I'm talking about when they become the #1 economic power in the world and finish the economic burial that we are imposing on ourselves.
bronconick
Yep, still here
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition
Boehner, Cantor, McConnell and Kyl in their younger days.
Boehner, Cantor, McConnell and Kyl in their younger days.
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition
Ask yourself the following question: is it better to have $14T of economic output from 300 million people, or is it better to have $15T of economic output from 1.2 billion people?
I've got news for you: whether or not their economy passes ours in size is meaningless, because it does not change the fact that many people in that country have a rather low standard of living.
Overall size of the economy is not the same thing as standard of living. That is more closely matched with per capita GDP.
Ask yourself the following question: is it better to have $14T of economic output from 300 million people, or is it better to have $15T of economic output from 1.2 billion people?
I've got news for you: whether or not their economy passes ours in size is meaningless, because it does not change the fact that many people in that country have a rather low standard of living.
Almington
Blood Boiling with Rage and Hate
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition
Correct, China owns about 1.2 trillion of out debt (8% of total) and is the 3rd largest holder behind the US treasury at 1.7 trillion (11%) and the Social security trust fund at 2.7 Trillion (19%). Overall, the US (combined between private debt, retirement and pension funds, investment funds, state and local governments, and the debt held by the federal government) owes to Americans about 9.8 trillion (~2/3 of total) and foreigners hold the other 1/3 (~$4.5T).
Correct, China owns about 1.2 trillion of out debt (8% of total) and is the 3rd largest holder behind the US treasury at 1.7 trillion (11%) and the Social security trust fund at 2.7 Trillion (19%). Overall, the US (combined between private debt, retirement and pension funds, investment funds, state and local governments, and the debt held by the federal government) owes to Americans about 9.8 trillion (~2/3 of total) and foreigners hold the other 1/3 (~$4.5T).
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition
Let's just hope those who needed to hear it listened for once.
Let's just hope those who needed to hear it listened for once.
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition
And you think it will stay that way? You must. Only 2% of Americans really have any power in this economic climate. That's not a formula for success.
And you think it will stay that way? You must. Only 2% of Americans really have any power in this economic climate. That's not a formula for success.
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition
And who do you think has economic power over there? It starts and ends with those who have the political connections to secure government backing (and thus funds from the state-owned banks).
China may be growing at a torrid pace, but they also have many problems (and my guess is their growth is going to slow down for awhile as they transition away from an agricultural/industrial economy to more of a service-oriented one).
My off the cuff guess is that it will take them a generation.
And who do you think has economic power over there? It starts and ends with those who have the political connections to secure government backing (and thus funds from the state-owned banks).
China may be growing at a torrid pace, but they also have many problems (and my guess is their growth is going to slow down for awhile as they transition away from an agricultural/industrial economy to more of a service-oriented one).
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Almington
Blood Boiling with Rage and Hate
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition
But as long as more than enough of the other 98% vote based on fear, that 2% will continue to amass more and more of the real power that exists in todays society. But that's what the Republicans have done so well, they tell people what to fear and who to blame for it and that their solution is the only one that will truly protect them or solve the problem. Then in return people vote against their own self-interest because it's the only way they can assure their safety from all the mythical monsters that are out to get them as they get absolutely fleeced of any and all opportunity for a better life in the future.
But as long as more than enough of the other 98% vote based on fear, that 2% will continue to amass more and more of the real power that exists in todays society. But that's what the Republicans have done so well, they tell people what to fear and who to blame for it and that their solution is the only one that will truly protect them or solve the problem. Then in return people vote against their own self-interest because it's the only way they can assure their safety from all the mythical monsters that are out to get them as they get absolutely fleeced of any and all opportunity for a better life in the future.
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Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition
I turned him off at the very beginning when he said the Bush Tax cuts hurt the economy, but when he passed the Bush tax cuts it help create jobs.
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition
The economic side is far too complicated to determine how many are actually voting against their own interests (assuming economic issues are at the top of their list of priorities in the first place). Clearly, the unemployed/poor should vote Democrat because that's the party that pushes for extensions of unemployment benefits and other social spending. The wealthy should vote Republican because that's the party that ushered in lower income and capital gains tax rates. For those of us in between those extremes, things get more complicated and depend on some combination of our tax situation and personal philosophy regarding who should pay for what and just how much government should provide - because neither party is really offering much in terms of direct benefits.
Or maybe the GOP simply does a better job of aligning its message with whatever it is their constituency wants to abolish/pass. I strongly disagree with your claim that so many people are voting against their own self interest - because it ignores the fact that we all have different priorities. No matter what the economic climate is, there's always going to be millions of socially-conscious voters that will primarily vote for/against candidates based on things like abortion and gay marriage. We may think it's idiotic to do that, but those people are clearly voting on what they care about, and you can't tell me they aren't voting their self interest.
The economic side is far too complicated to determine how many are actually voting against their own interests (assuming economic issues are at the top of their list of priorities in the first place). Clearly, the unemployed/poor should vote Democrat because that's the party that pushes for extensions of unemployment benefits and other social spending. The wealthy should vote Republican because that's the party that ushered in lower income and capital gains tax rates. For those of us in between those extremes, things get more complicated and depend on some combination of our tax situation and personal philosophy regarding who should pay for what and just how much government should provide - because neither party is really offering much in terms of direct benefits.
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