Strands in the Tapestry: the Business, Economics, and Tax Policy Thread

[unofan]

Actually, considering the deficit by year amounts, remember in 2007 was lower than 2002, and by the logic offered here, still under GOP tutelage. Once the left took over, which by your logic happened in 2008 given Congress is the ones who finalize the budget, the deficits started to skyrocket. Don't let those facts keep you from blaming someone who hasn't been President in over 4 years, though...

That's rich coming from someone who is already laying the ground work to blame the current President for anything that happens in 2017 and beyond.

 

[jerphisch]

Re: Strands in the Tapestry: the Business, Economics, and Tax Policy Thread

Actually, considering the deficit by year amounts, remember in 2007 was lower than 2002, and by the logic offered here, still under GOP tutelage. Once the left took over, which by your logic happened in 2008 given Congress is the ones who finalize the budget, the deficits started to skyrocket. Don't let those facts keep you from blaming someone who hasn't been President in over 4 years, though...

I suggest you read the original post and my response again. No blame was placed on anyone, nor credit given to anyone. A simple fact that Obama hasn't overseen 5 deficits was all I said. Hypersensitive much?

 

[pirate]

Re: Strands in the Tapestry: the Business, Economics, and Tax Policy Thread

I believe Canada is very up and coming. Perhaps Australia?

Were qualified dividends eliminated at certain income levels? If so, cap gains I think could even get the full rate because, with pee-pot interest rates at a bank, the stock market's the only place to make money, and so that would say to me more volume of trades leading to short term cap gains. Remember that gains from the appreciation of assets held less than a year go for the full blown rate. I don't think we'll see a rising market, even though I'm sure the Dow 20K folk from 2007 are coming out of the woodwork again. If not, I see our typical yearly cycle for stocks, so you're not going to see too much of a difference in real generated gains.

I'd pay the same or more in taxes but would like to know that A) what is taken in is spent with a modicum of effectiveness B) future increases in taxes will be tied to something other than the 3 "p's" poor management, pork and the popular vote.

As I've said on here before...I'd be ok with paying more taxes if they'd spend them like they cared. Just give me XX number of families and I'll pay their healthcare and their housing expense directly. Better that than giving the government the same amount of money and a fraction of it getting to the people who need it. Everybody freaked out when the Red Cross or Heart Association didn't get ~100% of all donations given to needy people but we think it is fine if the govenment takes in gazillions and spends it on staffers, benefits, giant buildings, duplication of effort and other waste.

 

[FreshFish]

Re: Strands in the Tapestry: the Business, Economics, and Tax Policy Thread

No. There haven't even been 5 full fiscal years completed during his presidency (even if you include FY 2009 which is Bush's final budget.)

I'm just a year early. Sorry. It will happen, can't do anything to stop it in just a year. The national debt did nearly double since Inauguration Day 2009, that's a fact.



PS I'm a bit surprised at how many people have trouble distinguishing between the annual deficit and the cumulative deficit, i.e., debt. If interest rates go up then the deficit skyrockets and the debt begins to compound. That will be really ugly. Like signing up for a balance transfer at the teaser rate of 2.99% and then seeing it revert to 12.99%. Or doing one of those "no interest for 3 years" deals and then having all the interest from day 1 hit you at 12% after 3 years and one day.

 

[FreshFish]

Re: Strands in the Tapestry: the Business, Economics, and Tax Policy Thread

I'd pay the same or more in taxes but would like to know that A) what is taken in is spent with a modicum of effectiveness B) future increases in taxes will be tied to something other than the 3 "p's" poor management, pork and the popular vote.

As I've said on here before...I'd be ok with paying more taxes if they'd spend them like they cared. Just give me XX number of families and I'll pay their healthcare and their housing expense directly. Better that than giving the government the same amount of money and a fraction of it getting to the people who need it. Everybody freaked out when the Red Cross or Heart Association didn't get ~100% of all donations given to needy people but we think it is fine if the govenment takes in gazillions and spends it on staffers, benefits, giant buildings, duplication of effort and other waste.

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to pirate again. Great post.

 

[FreshFish]

Re: Strands in the Tapestry: the Business, Economics, and Tax Policy Thread

I am very disappointed that no one on the left seems able to think clearly these days. the paucity of thought is quite sad.

When it comes to natural science, the left likes to ridicule "intelligent design" and tout the clarity of evolution through natural selection. Yet when it comes to economics they do the opposite, and somehow think that "intelligent design" (otherwise known as central planning) is a panacea and they have no use for natural selection (free will, market forces). What is worse, they are totally oblivious to this glaring inconsistency!

I'm trying to remember the last time the left had a clear thinker of note. I'd like to say Daniel Patrick Moynihan, except he wouldn't be considered on the "left" these days, even though he was during his time. Nowadays, he'd be more to the center.

One of the most brilliant thinkers on the left in history, Karl Marx, today would probably be aligned with the TEA Party! Most people don't realize that, when you look at his work in the context of his time, central government was a tool of the rich used to oppress the "common man." (even Marx was a sexist, sadly....women didn't even have enough status at that time so that their oppression bothered him.) Today the central government is the tool of the career politician / public sector union used to oppress everyone else. His version of "communism" involved the "withering away of the state" so that there was almost no government at all. People forget that Marx was one of the foremost scholars of capitalism and he appreciated its economic viability; he merely noticed that capitalism had no soul and so would not be a basis from which to organize a society that valued each of its members.

 

[Rover]

Re: Strands in the Tapestry: the Business, Economics, and Tax Policy Thread

Ignoring Fishy's nonsensical post, this is a good writeup in Politico (surprisingly)...

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/02/sequester-some-in-gop-want-out-87295.html

All the things this anonymous GOP source is proposing sound reasonable (federal pension changes, tort reform, chained CPI) with a couple of exceptions (I don't see savings of 20Bn in IRS costs from changing the tax code). All they need do now is agree to equal revenues thru canning oil and AG tax breaks, carried interest, etc, etc. I would craft a package that eases some of the sequester cuts but in total goes beyond the 1T in savings when you add the revised sequester + new package.

With continued ecomomic growth and these changes you can drive the deficit below 500Bn. At that point you start looking at savings in Medicare/Medicaid that don't affect the level of service (cutting down on fraud, bargaining for prescription drugs) to whittle it down even further.

 

[FreshFish]

Re: Strands in the Tapestry: the Business, Economics, and Tax Policy Thread

Data can be so helpful to those who actually pay attention to it before coming to a conclusion...

a study of second-generation Americans released Thursday found that the adult children of immigrants are substantially better off than the immigrant generation. By many key measures—including education, home ownership and income—they are at least as successful as the general U.S. population.

The independent Pew Research Center based its assessment of the 20 million second-generation adults on analysis of census data and national surveys

The unspoken "elephant in the room" when it comes to immigration policy is the need to replenish our labor force with more young people (we need a big increase in payroll taxes for a long time to support the government-run pyramid scheme known as Social Security). Sensible immigration reform can do that.

 

[pirate]

Re: Strands in the Tapestry: the Business, Economics, and Tax Policy Thread

Ignoring Fishy's nonsensical post, this is a good writeup in Politico (surprisingly)...

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/02/sequester-some-in-gop-want-out-87295.html

All the things this anonymous GOP source is proposing sound reasonable (federal pension changes, tort reform, chained CPI) with a couple of exceptions (I don't see savings of 20Bn in IRS costs from changing the tax code). All they need do now is agree to equal revenues thru canning oil and AG tax breaks, carried interest, etc, etc. I would craft a package that eases some of the sequester cuts but in total goes beyond the 1T in savings when you add the revised sequester + new package.

With continued ecomomic growth and these changes you can drive the deficit below 500Bn. At that point you start looking at savings in Medicare/Medicaid that don't affect the level of service (cutting down on fraud, bargaining for prescription drugs) to whittle it down even further.

Since there isn't, and never will be, one "right way" to solve everything, we need to embark on a path that has some middle of the road efforts at the start to get some buy ina nd momentum for the harder decisions that would be left to come. If we wait for perfect, or wait for one party to completely disappear so a grand plan can be implemented our grand-children will be living in some kind of big brother or escape from LA world. The plan above, (even if the impact of tax code is smaller) is better than a never-ending game of whack a mole in which everybody holds out for their way or no way.

If this country cant agree on things like simplifying tax codes and reducing fraud in government programs then we might as well quit now and start stockpiling gold, guns, gas and potable water along with watching Mad Max 5 times a day until the power grid is disabled.

The solutions are there, the delays aren't because nobody can fathom a solution, the delays are there because a few hundred people, supported by billions of dollars of party money would rather ruin a generation than admit even the smallest weakenss and compromise.

 

[joecct]

Re: Strands in the Tapestry: the Business, Economics, and Tax Policy Thread

Since there isn't, and never will be, one "right way" to solve everything, we need to embark on a path that has some middle of the road efforts at the start to get some buy ina nd momentum for the harder decisions that would be left to come. If we wait for perfect, or wait for one party to completely disappear so a grand plan can be implemented our grand-children will be living in some kind of big brother or escape from LA world. The plan above, (even if the impact of tax code is smaller) is better than a never-ending game of whack a mole in which everybody holds out for their way or no way.

If this country cant agree on things like simplifying tax codes and reducing fraud in government programs then we might as well quit now and start stockpiling gold, guns, gas and potable water along with watching Mad Max 5 times a day until the power grid is disabled.

The solutions are there, the delays aren't because nobody can fathom a solution, the delays are there because a few hundred people, supported by billions of dollars of party money would rather ruin a generation than admit even the smallest weakenss and compromise.

Hear! Hear!!
+1

 

[Craig P.]

Re: Strands in the Tapestry: the Business, Economics, and Tax Policy Thread

The solutions are there, the delays aren't because nobody can fathom a solution, the delays are there because a few hundred people, supported by billions of dollars of party money would rather ruin a generation than admit even the smallest weakenss and compromise.

A-****ing-men.

 

[dxmnkd316]

The Congressional Budget Office analysis said the government will run a $845 billion deficit this year, a modest improvement compared with last year's $1.1 trillion shortfall

http://www.cnbc.com/id/100436065

Asked and answered.

That's only if the sequester cuts (or whatever the hell they're called) go into effect.

 

[LynahFan]

Re: Strands in the Tapestry: the Business, Economics, and Tax Policy Thread

When it comes to natural science, the left likes to ridicule "intelligent design" and tout the clarity of evolution through natural selection. Yet when it comes to economics they do the opposite, and somehow think that "intelligent design" (otherwise known as central planning) is a panacea and they have no use for natural selection (free will, market forces). What is worse, they are totally oblivious to this glaring inconsistency!

Don't be ridiculous. People who "believe in" evolution (a.k.a. the left, apparently) aren't arguing that it's a *better* method for achieving a wide diversity of species than I.D. would be. They just believe that evolution is, in fact, how it has worked here on earth, for better or worse.

If there were a being both intelligent enough to have designed us and powerful enough to have "poofed" us into existence, I'm sure that this being could have made something a heck of a lot better than us humans! And any being capable of that would certainly be intelligent enough to optimize something as relatively simple as the global economy.

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Strands in the Tapestry: the Business, Economics, and Tax Policy Thread

Don't be ridiculous. People who "believe in" evolution (a.k.a. the left, apparently) aren't arguing that it's a *better* method for achieving a wide diversity of species than I.D. would be. They just believe that evolution is, in fact, how it has worked here on earth, for better or worse.

If there were a being both intelligent enough to have designed us and powerful enough to have "poofed" us into existence, I'm sure that this being could have made something a heck of a lot better than us humans! And any being capable of that would certainly be intelligent enough to optimize something as relatively simple as the global economy.

Convenience and rivalry will trump any logical thinking.

 

[Rover]

Don't be ridiculous. People who "believe in" evolution (a.k.a. the left, apparently) aren't arguing that it's a *better* method for achieving a wide diversity of species than I.D. would be. They just believe that evolution is, in fact, how it has worked here on earth, for better or worse.

If there were a being both intelligent enough to have designed us and powerful enough to have "poofed" us into existence, I'm sure that this being could have made something a heck of a lot better than us humans! And any being capable of that would certainly be intelligent enough to optimize something as relatively simple as the global economy.

You're wasting your time but I appreciate the effort. Natural selection is a scientific theory that you can test and observe. You can't do that with a higher power, as nobody has actually seen HIM nor asked HIM if HE created the Earth and mankind.

Some my believe (as I do somewhat, although I couldn't nail down the particulars) that perhaps a higher power could have been present while all this was going on, and therefore religion and science are not incompatable. However, if you want to learn about a higher power, go to church. If you want to learn about a testable hypothesis, go to science class. We need not have churces subject their teachings to scientific analysis, nor should science be forced to include religion in its pursuit of explanations for how the universe works.

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Strands in the Tapestry: the Business, Economics, and Tax Policy Thread

Anyone out there invest in personal loans through sites like LendingClub, Prosper, or other P2P lending sites? I just started doing this, through the reference of my uncle.

 

[Almington]

Re: Strands in the Tapestry: the Business, Economics, and Tax Policy Thread

Anyone out there invest in personal loans through sites like LendingClub, Prosper, or other P2P lending sites? I just started doing this, through the reference of my uncle.

I have looked into it, with a little work you can get a nice return in the 7-13+% range (even accounting for defaults) depending on your risk tolerance but I wouldn't want to put much more than a few thousand into it.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Strands in the Tapestry: the Business, Economics, and Tax Policy Thread

For whatever reason, I became unsubscribed from this thread. Weird.

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Strands in the Tapestry: the Business, Economics, and Tax Policy Thread

For whatever reason, I became unsubscribed from this thread. Weird.

You're not missing much.

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Strands in the Tapestry: the Business, Economics, and Tax Policy Thread

Looks like the Cypriot government is looking to join the thievery business: http://www.foxnews.com/world/2013/0...om-banks-as-eu-takes-aim-at-russian-deposits/