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Regionals attendance
- Thread starter billmich88888
- Start date
Re: Regionals attendance
Sounds like the high school tournaments in Massachusetts. They announce eight billion times during each game "No horns, banners, noisemakers, bands." In other words, no FUN. And this thing the last couple of years with the NCAA bringing in their own BASKETBALL FLOORS at EACH venue is ludicrous. Sterility at its finest. It's the socialist way now...not to mention the insane cost increase to buy, transport and store the floors in addition to the labor costs of installing. When they played at TD Garden, they had to REMOVE the Celtics floor to put down the NCAA floor (of course, they're all IDENTICAL with the name of the city on the left and the venue on the right baselines). What a joke...so I don't want to hear anymore about money or financial considerations, because it's there if they CHOOSE to use it. As far as I'm concerned, when they cut back on the discretionary spending, then we can have a serious discussion. As someone said, this comes up every year and it's pointless. Hockey is just not a priority to the NCAA.
Sounds like the high school tournaments in Massachusetts. They announce eight billion times during each game "No horns, banners, noisemakers, bands." In other words, no FUN. And this thing the last couple of years with the NCAA bringing in their own BASKETBALL FLOORS at EACH venue is ludicrous. Sterility at its finest. It's the socialist way now...not to mention the insane cost increase to buy, transport and store the floors in addition to the labor costs of installing. When they played at TD Garden, they had to REMOVE the Celtics floor to put down the NCAA floor (of course, they're all IDENTICAL with the name of the city on the left and the venue on the right baselines). What a joke...so I don't want to hear anymore about money or financial considerations, because it's there if they CHOOSE to use it. As far as I'm concerned, when they cut back on the discretionary spending, then we can have a serious discussion. As someone said, this comes up every year and it's pointless. Hockey is just not a priority to the NCAA.
Re: Regionals attendance
Yes, but that's meaningless. The only way to buy a package was to fork over $85. The package was indivisible.
ZamboniDude
I used to have more posts...
Re: Regionals attendance
Child pricing seems to get mentioned every year to no avail when the regional attendance figures are released. If the regionals sites that are selected continue to be 10,000+ seat arenas, what exactly is the harm in having an "under-12" ticket that would help to drive the crowd more towards capacity? If I have 3 kids under 12 who like hockey, it's hard to stomach $200 for 2 hours of hockey to see one regional game at the DCU. But I'd probably pay 50 for me and 20 each for the 3 of them, plus we'd be buying concessions and whatever else. I can't imagine that child pricing would drive it to a sellout that would exclude full paying fans from finding a seat.
Child pricing seems to get mentioned every year to no avail when the regional attendance figures are released. If the regionals sites that are selected continue to be 10,000+ seat arenas, what exactly is the harm in having an "under-12" ticket that would help to drive the crowd more towards capacity? If I have 3 kids under 12 who like hockey, it's hard to stomach $200 for 2 hours of hockey to see one regional game at the DCU. But I'd probably pay 50 for me and 20 each for the 3 of them, plus we'd be buying concessions and whatever else. I can't imagine that child pricing would drive it to a sellout that would exclude full paying fans from finding a seat.
Re: Regionals attendance
Interesting, didn’t know that. I thought that the venue assumed the financial risk. I did some reading.
http://ncaabids.azurewebsites.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/DI-IH-Regional-Bid-Specs1.pdf
“LOC” stands for “local organizing committee”. So if the host institution has no local organizing committee support, it’s at risk financially. I would think that in the normal condition, there would be an LOC to assume some of the financial risk. Preferably, the venue should be part of the LOC, not just a vendor of the site and should assume most or all of the financial risk. They are commercial enterprises in the business of putting on events at their venue; college athletic departments are not.
Interestingly enough, I didn’t see anything about ticket prices. Either it’s buried somewhere I didn’t see, or it’s some sort of side agreement. If the NCAA is going to take their cut off the top, it’s none of their business.
We had aisle seats, and judging by the traffic in and out, the kids buy more than their share of concessions (and they don't complain about the lack of beer!). Had to think, been there, done that with my own kids
Interesting, didn’t know that. I thought that the venue assumed the financial risk. I did some reading.
http://ncaabids.azurewebsites.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/DI-IH-Regional-Bid-Specs1.pdf
“LOC” stands for “local organizing committee”. So if the host institution has no local organizing committee support, it’s at risk financially. I would think that in the normal condition, there would be an LOC to assume some of the financial risk. Preferably, the venue should be part of the LOC, not just a vendor of the site and should assume most or all of the financial risk. They are commercial enterprises in the business of putting on events at their venue; college athletic departments are not.
Interestingly enough, I didn’t see anything about ticket prices. Either it’s buried somewhere I didn’t see, or it’s some sort of side agreement. If the NCAA is going to take their cut off the top, it’s none of their business.
Yes, everybody knows what the rules are, but the reason I think it's unfair is that the 5000 seat minimum excludes many schools (8 out of this year's 16 tournament participants and my guess even a larger percentage of the D1 schools at large) from even trying. It used to be that appropriate sized venues didn't even exist in the midwest, and having a regional at Yost was a necessity. Now appropriate sized venues exist, but the NCAA sets requirements that prevent them from submitting a financially viable bid. That's not the fault of the Notre Dames, Michigans, and Minnesotas of the world; it's the NCAA's.WeAreNDHockeky said:
Great idea, and opens the idea of selling blocks of seats (probably seats that would otherwise go unsold) to youth hockey organizations.
We had aisle seats, and judging by the traffic in and out, the kids buy more than their share of concessions (and they don't complain about the lack of beer!). Had to think, been there, done that with my own kids
P
Priceless
Guest
Re: Regionals attendance
With liberty and justice for all.
If you were a scalper the package was very much divisible. Places like Ace Ticket ask you what face value is before they make an offer. Event organizers are very much aware of what happens on the secondary market and take the appropriate steps.
With liberty and justice for all.
If you were a scalper the package was very much divisible. Places like Ace Ticket ask you what face value is before they make an offer. Event organizers are very much aware of what happens on the secondary market and take the appropriate steps.
MarkEagleUSA
C'mon Q!
Re: Regionals attendance
I wanted to make sure I got tickets so was willing to pay the TM ransom. I could have bought through QU later in that week for the $65.00 but didn't want to wait.
I bought my tickets online Sunday about 2 hrs after the selection show. The Webster Bank Arena site redirected me to Ticketmaster. IIRC, the TM fee was $10.90 and there was a "facility charge" of $4.50 per ticket. On top of that there was an "order processing fee" on the entire order. Four tickets came to a total of 324.80.
I wanted to make sure I got tickets so was willing to pay the TM ransom. I could have bought through QU later in that week for the $65.00 but didn't want to wait.
It's really bad that online purchasing is so expensive. Not a single human was involved in my transaction as it was all done online... even used the print at home option.
PuckLuck81
New member
Re: Regionals attendance
I would have recommended just waiting and buying your tickets at the door, the cheapest option available. You will be able to move down into the lower bowl corner no problem, especially for the Thurs games. The NoDak fans and Minny fans, I mean parents and band members, will be at the bars and restaurants during the early game!
I have attended every FF the last five years and this strategy has worked for me every time!
I would have recommended just waiting and buying your tickets at the door, the cheapest option available. You will be able to move down into the lower bowl corner no problem, especially for the Thurs games. The NoDak fans and Minny fans, I mean parents and band members, will be at the bars and restaurants during the early game!
I have attended every FF the last five years and this strategy has worked for me every time!
BU charges a few dollars fee if you want to print at home! I always thought buying online should be free of fees since a human being wasn't helping you. Stop trying to trick us with all these fees and just add them into the ticket price!
Re: Regionals attendance
Read <i>"Who Owns the Future?"</i> by Jaron Lanier. You will be happy that's all you paid.
<b><i>"The future is upon us...and you may not like what you see..."</i></b> chickod
Read <i>"Who Owns the Future?"</i> by Jaron Lanier. You will be happy that's all you paid.
<b><i>"The future is upon us...and you may not like what you see..."</i></b> chickod
WeAreNDHockey
\../ \../
Re: Regionals attendance
Its amazing to me what we sports fans will pay for. They sit around and invent things to charge us for and we keep swallowing it like a bunch of suckers. The amazing thing is it is easy to stop them from doing it. If everyone refused to buy tickets from the ticketmasters of the world for about 1 month, they'd come around. It makes me want to buy my tickets from nothing but scalpers. But instead we're all (or most of us anyway) sheep. What's next? If we want the actual info on our tickets like time and venue we'll have to pay 5 dollars for the ink? Under these kinds of pricing models, the local grocery stores are going to continue to charge me $3.09 for a gallon of milk, but if I want a carton to take it home in, well that will be another $1.25. You want a grocery cart? $2.00. You want a printed receipt after your purchases are totaled? That's another $0.75. Where does it end?
Its amazing to me what we sports fans will pay for. They sit around and invent things to charge us for and we keep swallowing it like a bunch of suckers. The amazing thing is it is easy to stop them from doing it. If everyone refused to buy tickets from the ticketmasters of the world for about 1 month, they'd come around. It makes me want to buy my tickets from nothing but scalpers. But instead we're all (or most of us anyway) sheep. What's next? If we want the actual info on our tickets like time and venue we'll have to pay 5 dollars for the ink? Under these kinds of pricing models, the local grocery stores are going to continue to charge me $3.09 for a gallon of milk, but if I want a carton to take it home in, well that will be another $1.25. You want a grocery cart? $2.00. You want a printed receipt after your purchases are totaled? That's another $0.75. Where does it end?
Re: Regionals attendance
When I saw that the TicketBastard markup was $11.50 per ticket (a 13.5% markup) that's what I did. Funny thing. In my mind the gas I burned driving to Worcester was free and my time was free (maybe true, I'm retired, but there certainly are opportunity costs).
Theoretically, the face price should have been $47.50, the price of a one day ticket. But then the sum of the two would have added up to $95, which would have confused everyone except the scalpers. What occurred to me was that they could have made the tickets less divisible (or at least a pain in the azz to make divisible) by just printing a single ticket. They didn't physically take the tickets; they scanned them. Surely the scanning technology exists to identify the ticket as a two day pass.With liberty and justice for all.
If you were a scalper the package was very much divisible. Places like Ace Ticket ask you what face value is before they make an offer. Event organizers are very much aware of what happens on the secondary market and take the appropriate steps.
The Zlax45
Registered User
Re: Regionals attendance
When I was in Europe, the super markets charged for grocery carts.
When I was in Europe, the super markets charged for grocery carts.
ericredaxe
Veteran
Re: Regionals attendance
Here is the thing... we are starting out with college hockey being a VERY niche thing, so they are not pulling from a big pool of potential attendees to begin with.
Then within the small group of people who might go to a regional, most of us only have interest in going to that regional if the team we cheer for is participating, then out of that group there is a segment who will only go if there is no overnight stay / extended travel involved.
Then you add to that ticket prices of $40, $50, $60, when most of us are used to paying $20ish for a college hockey game.
The whole thing is a recipe for poor attendance.
Here is the thing... we are starting out with college hockey being a VERY niche thing, so they are not pulling from a big pool of potential attendees to begin with.
Then within the small group of people who might go to a regional, most of us only have interest in going to that regional if the team we cheer for is participating, then out of that group there is a segment who will only go if there is no overnight stay / extended travel involved.
Then you add to that ticket prices of $40, $50, $60, when most of us are used to paying $20ish for a college hockey game.
The whole thing is a recipe for poor attendance.
Re: Regionals attendance
And the ******** at the arena charged $20 to park in the official lot and garage. Drive two blocks away, and it was free. I do not think the local AHL affiliate charges to park on the surface lot, talk about gouging.
And the ******** at the arena charged $20 to park in the official lot and garage. Drive two blocks away, and it was free. I do not think the local AHL affiliate charges to park on the surface lot, talk about gouging.
Hux
Alfond to Ridder & rinks in between
Could have been worse. I went with a buddy to a LA Kings game at the old Forum. We were directed into a lot across the street from the arena lot. We pull in and my buddy forks over $20 and we park in one of the last spots. By the time we get out to the street the last spot has been taken and the guy who was directing traffic has yanked up his signs and is walking off.
I did a double take and noticed that his signs had covered up the sign for the building next to the lot...which was a branch of the public library. I pointed it out to my buddy but he was in a rush to get into the game and shrugged it off. When we came out we found that all the cars had been towed and it ended up costing my buddy over a $100 bucks for the ticket, towing and cab fare to get us to the tow lot.
Gotta love entrepreneurial spirit.
Re: Regionals attendance
Interesting article on the regional attendance problem (specifically, the West and Midwest regions).
http://www.uscho.com/2014/04/05/com...oves-but-its-still-time-to-try-something-new/
The only three regionals to draw more than 20,000 since 2003 included both North Dakota and Minnesota. They were in Grand Forks, Denver, and St. Paul (Grand Forks, an on campus site, being the highest drawing regional since 2003). Attendance in the West and Midwest regions has fallen off dramatically in recent years. Unless the NCAA clones Minnesota and North Dakota, moving back to a mix of on and off campus sites seems like the best solution to fix West and Midwest regional attendance problem (lowering ticket prices would help also). Or the NCAA could add another weekend of playoff hockey and have the higher seed host the first round of the tournament.
Interesting article on the regional attendance problem (specifically, the West and Midwest regions).
http://www.uscho.com/2014/04/05/com...oves-but-its-still-time-to-try-something-new/
The only three regionals to draw more than 20,000 since 2003 included both North Dakota and Minnesota. They were in Grand Forks, Denver, and St. Paul (Grand Forks, an on campus site, being the highest drawing regional since 2003). Attendance in the West and Midwest regions has fallen off dramatically in recent years. Unless the NCAA clones Minnesota and North Dakota, moving back to a mix of on and off campus sites seems like the best solution to fix West and Midwest regional attendance problem (lowering ticket prices would help also). Or the NCAA could add another weekend of playoff hockey and have the higher seed host the first round of the tournament.
WeAreNDHockey
\../ \../
Re: Regionals attendance
I think it is telling that the high point for attendance was 2006. Two factors drove the numbers down initially in the immediate couple of years after, and a couple more have continued to keep crowds down. In March 2006 gas prices were averaging just under $2.20 per gallon but in 2007 that shot up to nearly $3.00. Gas spikes always decrease driving, drastic spikes having a drastic effect. In time, old habits are returned to even if the price stabilizes at that higher level, barring some other factor that would hurt attendance. By the time the 2008 tourney rolled around, gas prices were still high, but much of the country, especially much of the midwest was in the throes of the worst economic downturn in nearly 80 years. One of the reasons gas prices had plunged to levels not seen since the 20th century by the time the 2009 tourney rolled around was that much of the country, and again much of the midwest where 99% of your potential audience is for the two western regionals, was still reeling econmically. Now the economy is stronger than it was 4, 5 or 6 years ago, but habits have changed. People did without because the didn't have the disposable income. Now that some do again have the means, they learned to live without it. More and more people have big screen TVs and we expect the tournament to basically be available live for every game. In addition, all over the place live sports are a much less popular choice for people's entertainment dollar, especially for consumers under 30. The game, literally, has change immensely over the last 7 or 8 years and I see no evidence that we'll return to the types of growth we saw in the early years of the 16 team tourney.
I think it is telling that the high point for attendance was 2006. Two factors drove the numbers down initially in the immediate couple of years after, and a couple more have continued to keep crowds down. In March 2006 gas prices were averaging just under $2.20 per gallon but in 2007 that shot up to nearly $3.00. Gas spikes always decrease driving, drastic spikes having a drastic effect. In time, old habits are returned to even if the price stabilizes at that higher level, barring some other factor that would hurt attendance. By the time the 2008 tourney rolled around, gas prices were still high, but much of the country, especially much of the midwest was in the throes of the worst economic downturn in nearly 80 years. One of the reasons gas prices had plunged to levels not seen since the 20th century by the time the 2009 tourney rolled around was that much of the country, and again much of the midwest where 99% of your potential audience is for the two western regionals, was still reeling econmically. Now the economy is stronger than it was 4, 5 or 6 years ago, but habits have changed. People did without because the didn't have the disposable income. Now that some do again have the means, they learned to live without it. More and more people have big screen TVs and we expect the tournament to basically be available live for every game. In addition, all over the place live sports are a much less popular choice for people's entertainment dollar, especially for consumers under 30. The game, literally, has change immensely over the last 7 or 8 years and I see no evidence that we'll return to the types of growth we saw in the early years of the 16 team tourney.
Re: Regionals attendance
Yes, but note that in all thee cases, the "home" team was there. In 2009, Mariucci hosted without UMTC present, and drew only 14k+, even with Minnesota-Duluth present. So the UMTC’s presence would appear to make a roughly 7k difference. You can’t guarantee that the home team will be there. Minnesota’s been a safe bet in recent years, but North Dakota, their subsequent success notwithstanding, barely made the tournament this year. I would suggest that without UND present at a Grand Forks regional, attendance would be significantly less.
I also have a question with Englestad. Isn’t it still unacceptable as a venue because of all the embedded logos? I’m not arguing whether the propriety or fairness of the ban, just whether it exists.
Also, one can look at data and interpret it many ways. For example, according to the numbers on the chart, 2014 was the fifth highest out of 12 years recorded, only 1222 (2.2%) short of being the fourth highest and 1443 (2.6%) of being the third highest. That’s actually pretty impressive, considering that the current third and fourth highest were pre-recession and pre-widespread HDTV broadcast days.
I was also curious about a statement in the article
Spot on.
Yes, but note that in all thee cases, the "home" team was there. In 2009, Mariucci hosted without UMTC present, and drew only 14k+, even with Minnesota-Duluth present. So the UMTC’s presence would appear to make a roughly 7k difference. You can’t guarantee that the home team will be there. Minnesota’s been a safe bet in recent years, but North Dakota, their subsequent success notwithstanding, barely made the tournament this year. I would suggest that without UND present at a Grand Forks regional, attendance would be significantly less.
I also have a question with Englestad. Isn’t it still unacceptable as a venue because of all the embedded logos? I’m not arguing whether the propriety or fairness of the ban, just whether it exists.
Also, one can look at data and interpret it many ways. For example, according to the numbers on the chart, 2014 was the fifth highest out of 12 years recorded, only 1222 (2.2%) short of being the fourth highest and 1443 (2.6%) of being the third highest. That’s actually pretty impressive, considering that the current third and fourth highest were pre-recession and pre-widespread HDTV broadcast days.
I was also curious about a statement in the article
Cincinnati is the most notable example of a cheap ticket strategy. Are the financial results known yet? Was Cincinnati profitable? I don’t know, and quite frankly, I doubt if the author knows either. And if it was successful, you wouldn't be "telling" the arenas to lower them. You'd be pointing out to them that lowering ticket prices is sound marketing strategy.