POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

[Rover]

Re: POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

Yeah, but they won't go to prison. And that inherently is the problem with Government right now. There is zero accountability. Everything now is decided by elections and the power structure is as follows.

1. President.
2. Senate Majority Leader
3. Speaker of the House

It used to be Speaker two but that has changed since Obama's first midterm.

If 1 and 2 don't care then 3 doesn't matter.

If only there was some way to change who's in 1 and 2 next year....

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

If only there was some way to change who's in 1 and 2 next year....

Depends on what they do with it. If they just duck and cry every time Mitch cock blocks something then it won't matter. You have too many of them thinking they can work with terrorists.

 

[rufus]

I already knew that. That wasn't new news.

Yay, because you're so brilliant and informed.

What if someone hadn't known that before yesterday, and that was their first time hearing it? You know, those centrist, middle ground voters who voted for Trump the last time, that the Dems need to win back. Rube's people?

You know, like that old lady who watched Fox, and after the Mueller Report was finally released to the public, saying that was the first she'd heard that Trump wasn't " totally exonerated"?

 

[rufus]

No, they're going to fight. They're going to court today to fight. They're not going to stop. Nancy, Schiff, and Nadler all said so yesterday.

So why are you still whining?

 

[Rover]

Re: POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

Depends on what they do with it. If they just duck and cry every time Mitch cock blocks something then it won't matter. You have too many of them thinking they can work with terrorists.

Of course Scoobs, but again keep your eyes on the prize. Step 1 is kicking the cult the fuk out of office. Don't start fighting over what you'll do when in power until you're actually in power!

 

[burd]

Re: POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

Ds usually want to be righteous. That's why some are so loudly insisting they have to impeach, even though it has always been a road to nowhere. Rs, meanwhile, are perfectly willing to follow whichever path will get them there, usually the fear path. They just want to win the knife fight. They know impeachment is a noisy, name-calling argument, not a knife fight.

If Ds think that way, they will carefully assess whether impeachment will help them win the knife fight in 2020. Forget about whether Mueller gave us what we expected. We don't need Mueller to win where it counts. And if we can't win that fight, we don't deserve to have the WH, because we've shown we don't have the will or the wits to have it. We can just go on being the best who lack all conviction.

 

[aparch]

Re: POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr"><a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Russia?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Russia</a>'s state TV laughs at Trump appearing in front of a presidential seal doctored to include a two-headed eagle, which closely resembles the bird on the Russian coat of arms. Its left talons clutch a set of golf clubs, the banner reads in Spanish: “45 is a puppet.” <a href="https://t.co/quKkpUprBN">pic.twitter.com/quKkpUprBN</a></p>— Julia Davis (@JuliaDavisNews) <a href="https://twitter.com/JuliaDavisNews/status/1154389061815164933?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">July 25, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/jul/24/trump-presidential-seal-doctored-russia-golf-turning-point

As Donald Trump addressed a rightwing crowd in Washington on Tuesday, the audience roared in support – but it was a doctored onscreen display that ultimately took center stage.

At a student summit hosted by the conservative group Turning Point USA, the president stood before what looks, to the casual observer, very much like the US presidential seal. A thorough examination by the Washington Post, however, reveals some odd tweaks to the image.

First, the eagle has not one but two heads – making it look a lot like Russia’s coat of arms. And instead of holding arrows, as the bird does in the US seal, it’s holding golf clubs.

So Presidential.

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

Don't start fighting over what you'll do when in power until you're actually in power!

This should be the Zeroth Commandment.

The First should be: "Do not fight about the past. It is over."

The Second: "Do not criticize a fellow Democrat in front of the voters."

The Third: "Open negotiations with the most extreme conceivable demands."

The Fourth: "Support the worst D over the best R."

The Fifth: "Look to upgrade at every position."

The Sixth: "Treat a landslide win as a missed opportunity to move farther Left."

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

Of course Scoobs, but again keep your eyes on the prize. Step 1 is kicking the cult the fuk out of office. Don't start fighting over what you'll do when in power until you're actually in power!

Well, that's fine. But I'm a student of history. And I heard once that if you don't learn from it you're doomed to repeat it.

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

Well, that's fine. But I'm a student of history. And I heard once that if you don't learn from it you're doomed to repeat it.

The full quote is complex and interesting:

Progress, far from consisting in change, depends on retentiveness. When change is absolute there remains no being to improve and no direction is set for possible improvement: and when experience is not retained, as among savages, infancy is perpetual. Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.

 

[Rover]

Re: POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

Well, that's fine. But I'm a student of history. And I heard once that if you don't learn from it you're doomed to repeat it.

Sure, and my take is this. The kind of fundamental changes to society and governance that some of the more progressive people are pushing will take multiple and sustained electoral victories over time. I'm 100% on board with that happening. In the near term however, even if a good year and with a say Bernie Presidency the Senate would only be a narrow Dem majority given the seats that are up in 2020 (some combo of victories in ME, AZ, CO, IA, NC, etc). That means a majority resting on people like Manchin, Jones (if he's re-elected, a big IF), and Tester. Not sure Medicare for All or Green New Deal is getting by those guys.

That's why I'm supporting Warren and can live with Biden (as well as the others). Keep moving leftwards as your #'s in Congress allow you to. 2022 rolls around and redistrict the fuk out of all places where you have control, and then go after Senate seats in WI, PA, FL, NC, etc etc. Run progressives for those seats if you'd like. THAT's how you start getting to critical mass. The expectation can't just be "we elected Sanders so where's UBI and Single Payer????"

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

Maher has always been negative on Mueller and impeachment, lol. And he's right, Dems need a coach - they have to focus on beating Dump. Best way to do that is keep passing bills, let Yertle shoot them down, and then keep bleating, "See, here's what you could be getting if we controlled the White House and both houses again. Itch and Dump are obstructing it."

At this point, everyone's mind on Dump's criminality and corruption is made up. You aren't gonna move that needle much.

<img src="http://giphygifs.s3.amazonaws.com/media/8VrtCswiLDNnO/200.gif" />

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

<img src="http://giphygifs.s3.amazonaws.com/media/8VrtCswiLDNnO/200.gif" />

Cornell shout out!

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

So, it wasn't news that Manafort, and by extension the Trump campaign, supplied polling data to the Russians, hence, conspiring and colluding with them, because they were seeking personal enrichment?

Manaofort for cash, and Trump seeking out and willingly accepting Russian help in exchange for his Moscow hotel project getting done?

Selling out your country for your own personal enrichment. Nope, nothing to see here.

Well no, we already knew that as did the people. That didnt make people want impeachment then and it really doesnt now. That is Scooby's point.

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

Well no, we already knew that as did the people. That didnt make people want impeachment then and it really doesnt now. That is Scooby's point.

I doubt The People knew or know now. The People aren't very bright to begin with and SQUIRREL!

But, to be fair, The People may not have known Nixon was a crook, either. I'm sure 95% of them never understood the intricacies of Nixon's criminality, and it's not like IQ's have dramatically shot up in the interim.

I think what I'm saying here is the decision to impeach or not should turn on the merits, not on The People. The People will make their feelings on the matter quite clear in 2020.

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

Because they, like Handy, saw Mueller as a White Knight gonna rush in and eliminate all their problems with a single word.

Well, anyone who was expecting that, from either the release of his report, or his testimony, is an idiot.

Those are just the beginning. Now the hard work has to begin. Now, if the Dems continue to drag their feet and be cowed from doing that work, then yes, then they deserve every bit of criticism that can be heaped upon them. They can start by compelling testimony from those admin officials who are refusing to appear before them. If they're just gonna sit around and accept a lawless administration thumbing their nose at them, then nothing else is gonna matter.

I never saw him as a White Knight. Once again proving you never actually read or think about what other people post. It was obvious he wasnt a White Knight pretty early in the investigation. Maybe for a week did I ever think this was actually going to lead somewhere big and that quickly died when nothing was leaking because the Little Fish werent squealing. He is what he is...

My issues with him arent that he isnt a White Knight, it is that he is a coward. Stand on integrity all you want that is fine by me. He did his job to the least of his abilities by following the rules and that is cool. I have and will defend him on that. What soured me on him was that he wouldnt even defend the work he and his people did when people lied about it publicly setting the narrative. (and by people of course I mean the DOJ and the AG specifically) That isnt integrity (or doing your job btw) that is just cowardice. Then two weeks later he decided to set the record straight when it didnt matter anymore. Then he doubled down on it in front of Congress when his own Party accused him of being a part of a conspiracy to destroy the President. I mean come on man no one is saying you have to go all "Network" on the bit but it is still within the bounds of your charter to say "yeah we never did that. No one in my office was out to destroy anyone we were out to find the facts and we did in this report. Dont slander us in such a manner". Hell even add "if we were out to destroy the President, dont you think our report would have looked a little different?" He didnt do that, so I will call him what he is, a coward.

Many on the Left thought he was a White Knight that is to be true but not me man. He did what many prosecutors do, they nail enough of the bad guys to make their record look good.

On another note, it boggles my mind that people buy into the conspiracy theories. I mean the GOP wins an election but they have people convinced the Dems rigged it against them. The Special Prosecutor writes a report that doesnt ask for the President to be removed (not a complaint) and they have people convinced that the Special Prosecutor and his underlings were out to destroy the President. If everything is so ****ed rigged how does it keep working out so well for them...that flies in the face of the whole idea.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

On another note, it boggles my mind that people buy into the conspiracy theories. I mean the GOP wins an election but they have people convinced the Dems rigged it against them. The Special Prosecutor writes a report that doesnt ask for the President to be removed (not a complaint) and they have people convinced that the Special Prosecutor and his underlings were out to destroy the President. If everything is so ****ed rigged how does it keep working out so well for them...that flies in the face of the whole idea.

1. They believe the report was written by 14 angry Democrats.
2. They believe the dossier was Democrat inspired.
3. They believe the FISA warrants were issued illegally by a Republican appointed judge.
4. They believe the Mueller report is over and the true crime was that the investigation started in the first place. They believe it was an illegal investigation.

Meanwhile Russia just keeps doing.

And that narrative has more traction today then anything the Democrats wanted out of yesterdays hearing.

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

I doubt The People knew or know now. The People aren't very bright to begin with and SQUIRREL!

But, to be fair, The People may not have known Nixon was a crook, either. I'm sure 95% of them never understood the intricacies of Nixon's criminality, and it's not like IQ's have dramatically shot up in the interim.

I think what I'm saying here is the decision to impeach or not should turn on the merits, not on The People. The People will make their feelings on the matter quite clear in 2020.

Easy for you to say, you dont have to be elected next year. Everyone in the House does. If the people putting forth those votes think the idea has no merit you risk a lot if you support it. that is why the hearings needed to be public and that is why the Dems needed it to go well or Impeachment was going to die on the vine. (until more evidence appears)

Note: that isnt me disagreeing with you, I 100% agree with your whole post. But that isnt the reality of the situation. It doesnt much matter if you fought the good fight if you are sitting home unable to do good work in the future cause you lost.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

Easy for you to say, you dont have to be elected next year. Everyone in the House does. If the people putting forth those votes think the idea has no merit you risk a lot if you support it. that is why the hearings needed to be public and that is why the Dems needed it to go well or Impeachment was going to die on the vine. (until more evidence appears)

Note: that isnt me disagreeing with you, I 100% agree with your whole post. But that isnt the reality of the situation. It doesnt much matter if you fought the good fight if you are sitting home unable to do good work in the future cause you lost.

I 100% agree with all of this post.

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45:55: Wow, @CNN RATINGS HAVE CRASHED. LOST ALL CREDIBILITY!

Ds usually want to be righteous. That's why some are so loudly insisting they have to impeach, even though it has always been a road to nowhere. Rs, meanwhile, are perfectly willing to follow whichever path will get them there, usually the fear path. They just want to win the knife fight. They know impeachment is a noisy, name-calling argument, not a knife fight.

If Ds think that way, they will carefully assess whether impeachment will help them win the knife fight in 2020. Forget about whether Mueller gave us what we expected. We don't need Mueller to win where it counts. And if we can't win that fight, we don't deserve to have the WH, because we've shown we don't have the will or the wits to have it. We can just go on being the best who lack all conviction.

There is the belief that an Impeachment, even if unpopular, would be an achor around his neck come 2020 if it is timed right. I go back and forth on it. On the one hand I think it might make him a sympathetic figure to some (and tick off some of the voters the Dems need in key states) but on the other hand he will kill all sympathy with his anger tweeting and attacking. I mean it would be the troll move of all troll moves. If he has the reaction he had yesterday to Mueller testifying can you imagine his reaction to Impeachment? He literally might go full Hitler on the bit...

What sucks is Impeachment is the right thing to do. But if it loses you the WH in 2020 is it worth it? That is a question I cant answer no matter how much I think about it.