It's funny you should mention Iraq. That was obviously a huge disaster and huge waste of money. So what does Obama do? He helps bin a bunch of other leaders in the region and create more chaos over there. Those that don't learn from history...
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POTUS 45.13 - CNN is still Fake News
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It's funny you should mention Iraq. That was obviously a huge disaster and huge waste of money. So what does Obama do? He helps bin a bunch of other leaders in the region and create more chaos over there. Those that don't learn from history...
trixR4kids
Well-known member
Re: POTUS 45.13 - CNN is still Fake News
HAHAHAHAHAH the classic Obama deflection now. Seriously is there anything the right has other than shifting goal posts and false equivalencies? It's like arguing with young children good god...
HAHAHAHAHAH the classic Obama deflection now. Seriously is there anything the right has other than shifting goal posts and false equivalencies? It's like arguing with young children good god...
Re: POTUS 45.13 - CNN is still Fake News
Oh, I have no doubt Russia wanted to influence the election, and even tried to influence the election. But you wrote that Russia got Trump elected. I was just checking to see if that meant we midwesterners, Comey and HRC were now off the hook.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: POTUS 45.13 - CNN is still Fake News
Looks like The Family and their surrogates are going for "nothing to see here, move along."
I'm surprised they haven't come out with some sort of invented counter-punch just to muddy the waters. That's more Dump's style.
Smirconish noted this morning that Kasowitz was not included in the hours-long meeting on Air Force One that resulted in the original denial that was so incomplete it led to three more days of slow bleed out culminating in Uday being forced to release the email chain. Part of the issue is the WH does not think Kasowitz can get a security clearance, even with their sponsorship.
Looks like The Family and their surrogates are going for "nothing to see here, move along."
I'm surprised they haven't come out with some sort of invented counter-punch just to muddy the waters. That's more Dump's style.
Smirconish noted this morning that Kasowitz was not included in the hours-long meeting on Air Force One that resulted in the original denial that was so incomplete it led to three more days of slow bleed out culminating in Uday being forced to release the email chain. Part of the issue is the WH does not think Kasowitz can get a security clearance, even with their sponsorship.
Fighting Sioux 23
New member
Re: POTUS 45.13 - CNN is still Fake News
Nobody is saying what they did was okay (or at least, I'm not saying what they did was okay...indeed, I said in each of my posts what they did may very well may be (and likely is) criminal). But, it simply is not treason. As an attorney, who has some experience practicing in this area, no prosecutor would bring charges of treason for what occurred. It would almost be malpractice to do so.
Again, and I want to stress this because it doesn't seem that you are picking up on it, I'm not saying that what they did was okay, or even legal. However, treason is not an applicable charge to this situation.
Nobody is saying what they did was okay (or at least, I'm not saying what they did was okay...indeed, I said in each of my posts what they did may very well may be (and likely is) criminal). But, it simply is not treason. As an attorney, who has some experience practicing in this area, no prosecutor would bring charges of treason for what occurred. It would almost be malpractice to do so.
Again, and I want to stress this because it doesn't seem that you are picking up on it, I'm not saying that what they did was okay, or even legal. However, treason is not an applicable charge to this situation.
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: POTUS 45.13 - CNN is still Fake News
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Why aren't the same standards placed on the Democrats. Look what Hillary Clinton may have gotten away with. Disgraceful!</p>— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) <a href="https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/885128373441355777">July 12, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Why aren't the same standards placed on the Democrats. Look what Hillary Clinton may have gotten away with. Disgraceful!</p>— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) <a href="https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/885128373441355777">July 12, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: POTUS 45.13 - CNN is still Fake News
Well everyone who had any part in it should be embarrassed.
But the formula looks like a sum of all those things with weighted coefficients. My current estimate:
.65 rubes cutting off their nose to spite their face
.15 Hillary was a sh-tty candidate
.10 Comey's curious timing
.05 overconfident / overly choosy Dems
.03 Dump chumps run by Russian operators
.02 else
Given we only needed a few thousand votes in a couple states, the "decisive" margin is only about .02, so any of those things can claim it
Well everyone who had any part in it should be embarrassed.
But the formula looks like a sum of all those things with weighted coefficients. My current estimate:
.65 rubes cutting off their nose to spite their face
.15 Hillary was a sh-tty candidate
.10 Comey's curious timing
.05 overconfident / overly choosy Dems
.03 Dump chumps run by Russian operators
.02 else
Given we only needed a few thousand votes in a couple states, the "decisive" margin is only about .02, so any of those things can claim it
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Wisko McBadgerton
Teaching you how to Bucky.
Re: POTUS 45.13 - CNN is still Fake News
The purported information was to be on Hillary's campaign being illegally financed by factions within the Russian Government. (This was at a time when Trump/Russia did not really exist, but oddly, Hillary/Russia did exist through allegations about funding of the Clinton Foundation.) IF that is the nature of the info promised, (which is what has been stated by all parties) it would not be, at that time, info that was presumed to be illegally obtained as far as the US is concerned. It would presumably be info provided by some Russians about other Russian's activities.
The Gore comparison differs in that A) Gore actually obtained something tangible. B) It would be clear that the book they obtained was stolen property. Not returning it would open them up for legal consequences should it come to light later. Trump apparently obtained nothing tangible. Had they obtained the actual information that was proposed to them, I can't think of any reason they could possibly have for not turning it over to the authorities. It wouldn't preclude them from using it, and it would put additional investigative pressure on the Clinton campaign that surely could and would be leaked. And sitting on it would open them up to legal consequences that even they in their general incompetence would be aware of.
And lastly there are a lot of things I'm not ok with that are not illegal actions. I'm not ok with gopher hockey for example. Unless you are suggesting I can apply the death penalty to gopher hockey because I'm not ok with it?
...umm... well then perhaps you do have a good point. I will reconsider!
The purported information was to be on Hillary's campaign being illegally financed by factions within the Russian Government. (This was at a time when Trump/Russia did not really exist, but oddly, Hillary/Russia did exist through allegations about funding of the Clinton Foundation.) IF that is the nature of the info promised, (which is what has been stated by all parties) it would not be, at that time, info that was presumed to be illegally obtained as far as the US is concerned. It would presumably be info provided by some Russians about other Russian's activities.
The Gore comparison differs in that A) Gore actually obtained something tangible. B) It would be clear that the book they obtained was stolen property. Not returning it would open them up for legal consequences should it come to light later. Trump apparently obtained nothing tangible. Had they obtained the actual information that was proposed to them, I can't think of any reason they could possibly have for not turning it over to the authorities. It wouldn't preclude them from using it, and it would put additional investigative pressure on the Clinton campaign that surely could and would be leaked. And sitting on it would open them up to legal consequences that even they in their general incompetence would be aware of.
And lastly there are a lot of things I'm not ok with that are not illegal actions. I'm not ok with gopher hockey for example. Unless you are suggesting I can apply the death penalty to gopher hockey because I'm not ok with it?
...umm... well then perhaps you do have a good point. I will reconsider!
I think about 90% of people voted for whatever party they always go for and maybe 10% changed for a variety of reasons. The Bernie stuff probably made as big of difference as anything else(in the states that cost her the election.)
Wisko McBadgerton
Teaching you how to Bucky.
Re: POTUS 45.13 - CNN is still Fake News
Just to be clear, since 2013 it only takes a simple majority to pass cloture on these nominees.
Just to be clear, since 2013 it only takes a simple majority to pass cloture on these nominees.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: POTUS 45.13 - CNN is still Fake News
Well, then what the **** is the hold up? Mitch says it's the Democrats. I don't see how.
Well, then what the **** is the hold up? Mitch says it's the Democrats. I don't see how.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: POTUS 45.13 - CNN is still Fake News
It's not the Democrats, that's normal partisan nonsense.
Most of the problem is Dump himself. He has not nominated anyone for a ton of positions, partly because he's lazy and incompetent, and partly because he's not bothering to staff agencies and departments he wants to destroy.
It's not the Democrats, that's normal partisan nonsense.
Most of the problem is Dump himself. He has not nominated anyone for a ton of positions, partly because he's lazy and incompetent, and partly because he's not bothering to staff agencies and departments he wants to destroy.
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: POTUS 45.13 - CNN is still Fake News
I think if Hillary really got away with it that we need him and his entire campaign staff (from beginning to end) under oath in front of Congress for 10 hours each. Cause that's what Hillary had to do.
I think if Hillary really got away with it that we need him and his entire campaign staff (from beginning to end) under oath in front of Congress for 10 hours each. Cause that's what Hillary had to do.
Wisko McBadgerton
Teaching you how to Bucky.
Re: POTUS 45.13 - CNN is still Fake News
If they filibuster a nominee, a cloture motion cannot be voted on until the third session day after and the interceding time can all be used for debate on that nominee. The senate is in session 130-140 days a year. I think you can see that if you filibuster 50 nominees not much will get done. In fact Dems can prevent the administration from ever filling all openings during the entire four year term.
Blame who ever you want, I'm just saying that the idea that Mitch can just wave a magic wand and make it happen isn't accurate.
If they filibuster a nominee, a cloture motion cannot be voted on until the third session day after and the interceding time can all be used for debate on that nominee. The senate is in session 130-140 days a year. I think you can see that if you filibuster 50 nominees not much will get done. In fact Dems can prevent the administration from ever filling all openings during the entire four year term.
Blame who ever you want, I'm just saying that the idea that Mitch can just wave a magic wand and make it happen isn't accurate.
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: POTUS 45.13 - CNN is still Fake News
Didn't Mitch do that every single time under Obama? I think he did. Seems to me that because of that it's standard operating procedure for the Senate to operate that way. What you fail to acknowledge is the party in power can change the rules with a simple majority vote. So, change the ****ing rules then. They did for the Supreme Court. This is wimpy stuff.
Didn't Mitch do that every single time under Obama? I think he did. Seems to me that because of that it's standard operating procedure for the Senate to operate that way. What you fail to acknowledge is the party in power can change the rules with a simple majority vote. So, change the ****ing rules then. They did for the Supreme Court. This is wimpy stuff.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: POTUS 45.13 - CNN is still Fake News
The problem with this theory is most of the open nominations have not even gone to hearings yet. The Dems can't stop that procedurally. It is all on the majority.
The GOP is a complete CF right now.
The problem with this theory is most of the open nominations have not even gone to hearings yet. The Dems can't stop that procedurally. It is all on the majority.
The GOP is a complete CF right now.
leswp1
Well-known member
Re: POTUS 45.13 - CNN is still Fake News
All the psych research they do on people choosing info that reinforces their bias and being able to ignore conflicting info, choosing things that can be harmful to themselves and others in the face of evidence- this is like an audiovisual aide. I sort of understood how people could ignore the obvious logic and have seen it in patients but people thinking to make excuses for Russia meddling? Wow.
The last couple of days of posts have been very enlightening. Paranoia regarding the previous admin runs deeper than I understood and forward thinking regarding the possible effects of the breakdown of ethics and morals (not to mention ignoring all sorts of things that made our government fairly functional) is something that must be avoided at all costs. How else can you ignore that the Russians have been in our business, have found willing people to forward their interest in the name of forwarding their own? The dichotomy between the Senators who identify how important this is and the people who need to pretend this is unimportant is chilling. The best analogy I can come up with is the patient with alcoholic cirrhosis who clings to the belief they should be able to drink because everyone else can. The world should be fair so everyone gets to drink right? They will tell you they should be able to drink. Light beer is OK. Someone told them it is OK. It shouldn't matter if they drink, others do it. Right into a coma and their coffin.
Moral of the story? Obama/Hillary or whomever sucked. They are evil. So evil. Nothing happened to them. They got to govern so Trump should be able to do what ever he wants too! -obviously no one thought to listen to their Mum when they were told 2 wrongs don't make a right
You must spread reputation around again before giving reputation to this poster....
All the psych research they do on people choosing info that reinforces their bias and being able to ignore conflicting info, choosing things that can be harmful to themselves and others in the face of evidence- this is like an audiovisual aide. I sort of understood how people could ignore the obvious logic and have seen it in patients but people thinking to make excuses for Russia meddling? Wow.
The last couple of days of posts have been very enlightening. Paranoia regarding the previous admin runs deeper than I understood and forward thinking regarding the possible effects of the breakdown of ethics and morals (not to mention ignoring all sorts of things that made our government fairly functional) is something that must be avoided at all costs. How else can you ignore that the Russians have been in our business, have found willing people to forward their interest in the name of forwarding their own? The dichotomy between the Senators who identify how important this is and the people who need to pretend this is unimportant is chilling. The best analogy I can come up with is the patient with alcoholic cirrhosis who clings to the belief they should be able to drink because everyone else can. The world should be fair so everyone gets to drink right? They will tell you they should be able to drink. Light beer is OK. Someone told them it is OK. It shouldn't matter if they drink, others do it. Right into a coma and their coffin.
Moral of the story? Obama/Hillary or whomever sucked. They are evil. So evil. Nothing happened to them. They got to govern so Trump should be able to do what ever he wants too! -obviously no one thought to listen to their Mum when they were told 2 wrongs don't make a right
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There's some truth in this and it is one area where Trump deserves legitimate criticism. The media really is doing a disservice to the country by haranguing and mocking people in the administration though. Whether you like Trump or not you should still want to see the country be successful. I have read Trump's admin is vetting people more than normal, which is part of the delay, but I think they were also unprepared.
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