POTUS 45.08: Suckers

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

Orange boy wants to renegotiate trade with South Korea and have the pay for missile defense. Great idea.

 

[St. Clown]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

You'd think it would work that way, Handy, but I'm not so sure. The GOP narrative over the past 25 years with the Clintons gained purchase with voters who had to know that it was based almost entirely on exaggeration, misdirection, and outright lies.

There's no doubt that some people believe the things the GOP's media wing (Limbaugh, etc.) put out there regarding Hillary, but those people would have voted for the GOP even if she was brand new on scene.

Hillary is simply an unlikable person for a great many people. She comes off as cold, especially when compared to Bill. When Hillary made a stop in Minneapolis last summer, she met with a young woman, maybe 25 years old. When listening to the woman, Hillary interrupts her and said, "Well, maybe you should run for office." Added into that discussion was Hillary saying the woman should run instead of just standing there to complain. A more personable candidate, one who has what it takes to get elected today, would have replied to that woman that she should turn that passion into a political career, because the world needs her passion to make those changes.

A better candidate would instinctively see the correct route to take, but Hillary simply doesn't have the knack. She is not a good candidate. Yes, she had a laundry list of qualifications on her resume, but resumes alone don't make someone a good political candidate.

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

You understand that Trump's numbers are horrid right? If people were buying this crap his approval rating wouldnt be at 40%. (and that isnt just people in our echo chamber) If Blaming Obama played in the real world as much as you and Scooby believe it does then his attempts to blame Obama for his crappy Health Care plan would have worked. Guess what, they didnt.

Trump needs to learn you can only use it so much before people tune out of it. When his tax plan craps the bed it will work on that but it wont work when it comes to Flynn or with Russia. There is a reason these stories are sticking and it isnt our echo chamber.

The stories stick because despite all logic pointing away from the GOP, they still get their message across.

And the left can't trip over itself enough. Gift wrapped a White House and with only two plausible options (one of which isn't even a Democrat), they still manage to incite revolt in our own voting base and lose to a guy who had numbers on par with Romney (who lost poorly).

Approval ratings aren't votes. And all the handwringing in the world won't change that once Fall of 2019 rolls around, the right wing media will stir their unified base of Walmart customers once again with bull**** like Pizzagate or Death Panels AND IT WILL WORK.

Our only prayer is that the Democrats can figure out their own path by then. And hopefully give us better options than a non-Democrat and I-swear-she's-the-Worst-candidate-I'll-see-in-my-lifetime.

 

[alfablue]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

I just read on twitter that Spicer said the Trump transition team didnt do any of their own vetting of Flynn...that cant be right.

Nope! Totally True!



He also blamed Obama since Obama gave him his clearance...that isnt how it works Spicey! You vet everyone up for office...and just because they have clearance doesnt mean they havent done anything stupid. Ask General Petraeus...and it isnt like Flynn hadnt already been fired from a high level job or anything.

These guys are morons of the highest order.

The logic that follows the claim is really odd, and I'm sure the logical path of the logic won't be followed.

We've heard for 8 years from don that President Obama was incompetent. They kept telling us that he was the worst president ever.

But they actually trusted President Obama's judgement on Flynn.

So now he's competent?

And since Flynn is a loser, again, he's incompetent.

These guys are morons. And if their followers are ok with them taking things from President Obama at face value after all of that bashing on him, they are morons, too.

Which we have known for a while.

 

[burd]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

There's no doubt that some people believe the things the GOP's media wing (Limbaugh, etc.) put out there regarding Hillary, but those people would have voted for the GOP even if she was brand new on scene.

Hillary is simply an unlikable person for a great many people. She comes off as cold, especially when compared to Bill. When Hillary made a stop in Minneapolis last summer, she met with a young woman, maybe 25 years old. When listening to the woman, Hillary interrupts her and said, "Well, maybe you should run for office." Added into that discussion was Hillary saying the woman should run instead of just standing there to complain. A more personable candidate, one who has what it takes to get elected today, would have replied to that woman that she should turn that passion into a political career, because the world needs her passion to make those changes.

A better candidate would instinctively see the correct route to take, but Hillary simply doesn't have the knack. She is not a good candidate. Yes, she had a laundry list of qualifications on her resume, but resumes alone don't make someone a good political candidate.

I hope you are right.

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

You'd think it would work that way, Handy, but I'm not so sure. The GOP narrative over the past 25 years with the Clintons gained purchase with voters who had to know that it was based almost entirely on exaggeration, misdirection, and outright lies.

Trump's idiocy is different, no doubt, but we have seen too many times how voters can be willing to either accept as true things that clearly aren't or simply look the other way if doing those things will help them confirm their biases. That's the beast Trump is feeding, whether he is doing it intentionally or is just that spineless and immature. We just don't know how large an appetite it has.

We arent talking about Hillary. Hillary was someone half the Dems didnt like for various reasons. (myself included)

Again, if this stuff had traction why is Trump polling at historically low numbers?

BTW the Trumpers arent blaming Obama...they are blaming Paul Ryan.

 

[rufus]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

Hey What is $5.5 Trillion Anyways Right?

I assume our deficit hating Righties around here are angry about this? Best case is the tax reform only adds $3 trillion but more likely much higher since no amount of growth can offset the lost revenue. This is the GOP wet dream...man whatever happened to the Party of Fiscal Responsibility?

The "party of fiscal responsibility" haven't been that since Reagan's first tax cut. The sooner people realize and accept that, the sooner we might start getting somewhere fixing the problems in this country.

Also, read that in his tax plan, the only rate that's changing is the top one. All the tax cuts are going to people like trump himself. There's also a huge loophole where the wealthy can move their money around in ways that they are able to pay at the corporate rate of 15% instead of at the personal income rate. Also eliminates the Alternative Minimum Tax (which would have saved Trumpy $21 million on the only tax return we've seen for him) and the estate tax, which only effects individuals with a net worth of $5.5 million, or couples over $11 million.

Plunder the federal treasury for himself and his wealthy friends. That was all he ever intended to do. The rest was just a smokescreen. Suckers.

 

[burd]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

We arent talking about Hillary. Hillary was someone half the Dems didnt like for various reasons. (myself included)

Again, if this stuff had traction why is Trump polling at historically low numbers?

BTW the Trumpers arent blaming Obama...they are blaming Paul Ryan.

II agree it's not about Hillary--it's about narrative dynamics and how they enable confirmation bias. The numbers give us hope, but this guy is so unfit I think people who deny supporting or liking him can easily turn around and support him in the privacy of a voting booth.

I agree with you guys, but I'm afraid we are in danger of underestimating Trump and overestimating voters just as we did before the election.

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

The stories stick because despite all logic pointing away from the GOP, they still get their message across.

And the left can't trip over itself enough. Gift wrapped a White House and with only two plausible options (one of which isn't even a Democrat), they still manage to incite revolt in our own voting base and lose to a guy who had numbers on par with Romney (who lost poorly).

Approval ratings aren't votes. And all the handwringing in the world won't change that once Fall of 2019 rolls around, the right wing media will stir their unified base of Walmart customers once again with bull**** like Pizzagate or Death Panels AND IT WILL WORK.

Our only prayer is that the Democrats can figure out their own path by then. And hopefully give us better options than a non-Democrat and I-swear-she's-the-Worst-candidate-I'll-see-in-my-lifetime.

If the Dems dont nominate someone reviled they will win and it wont even be that hard. No amount of Obama blaming will change that. Remember he won not because of a bunch of stories, but because a bunch of people in a few key states stayed home. (mostly cause they hated her) Now, maybe they will stay home again but odds are they wont unless they nominate The Shrill again. Trump cant win with Romney numbers against a candidate people like.

But sure, you and Scooby and NDChickenLittle can just assume that Trump is unbeatable and the country is screwed. How very Dem of you...

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

II agree it's not about Hillary--it's about narrative dynamics and how they enable confirmation bias. The numbers give us hope, but this guy is so unfit I think people who deny supporting or liking him can easily turn around and support him in the privacy of a voting booth.

I agree with you guys, but I'm afraid we are in danger of underestimating Trump and overestimating voters just as we did before the election.

Oh I dont think the supporters are changing their mind for the most part outside of maybe some of the middle who voted for change which didnt happen. They have allowed themselves to be fleeced and even if they did think he was unfit they would never admit it by voting other party. But the numbers dont lie, if the Dems dont stay home his coalition isnt big enough to keep him in office. Romney numbers wont do it against a candidate people can actually stand. His only hope this time was people stayed home and they did. I just dont see that happening twice...especially not with a media that is covering him like a wet blanket now. That is why he is pushing for war...

 

[jerphisch]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

We arent talking about Hillary. Hillary was someone half the Dems didnt like for various reasons. (myself included)

Again, if this stuff had traction why is Trump polling at historically low numbers?

BTW the Trumpers arent blaming Obama...they are blaming Paul Ryan.

Trump is polling very well within his party. Yes he is overall at historically low numbers, but do you think he couldn't win re-election at this point? He still has the support of something like 96% of people voted for him. Getting Gorsuch on SCOTUS earned him huge points with conservatives even if they didn't like him, as evidenced here.

 

[rufus]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

You understand that Trump's numbers are horrid right? If people were buying this crap his approval rating wouldnt be at 40%. (and that isnt just people in our echo chamber) If Blaming Obama played in the real world as much as you and Scooby believe it does then his attempts to blame Obama for his crappy Health Care plan would have worked. Guess what, they didnt.

Trump needs to learn you can only use it so much before people tune out of it. When his tax plan craps the bed it will work on that but it wont work when it comes to Flynn or with Russia. There is a reason these stories are sticking and it isnt our echo chamber.

Doesn't matter Handy. Saw an article yesterday, about the residents of some poor desert Democratic district in California, I think, who gave the edge to Trump in the election. None of them have changed their minds. They think his ineffectiveness is due to him being hampered by the Washington machine. They see all the scrambling around, the pell mell jumping from issue to issue as just him shaking things up, which is what they elected him to do.

Ahh, here ya go. Was in Colorado.

http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-na-pol-trump-100-days-pueblo-20170427-story.html

They see a president besieged and beset not just by Democrats, a hostile media and haughty academics — all, they say, fashioned from the same cloth — but by his fellow Republicans in Congress, who seem more interested in clinging to office than helping bring about the change Trump promised.

Despite the resistance, they say, he has delivered on his promise to fight for American jobs, browbeating corporate executives and toughening the country’s trade policies through executive orders. He sent a don’t-mess-with-us message to the world by bombing Syria and Afghanistan. He installed Neil M. Gorsuch on the Supreme Court, cementing a conservative majority for possibly decades to come.

Trump is shaking things up, said Steve Carson, 61, a retired welder who approvingly assayed the president’s start from a stool at the Chug-A-Mug tavern in Pueblo’s worn Bessemer neighborhood.

“If we’re not going to follow what’s been in place forever, people’s lives are going to change,” said Carson, a self-described independent who cast his first-ever presidential ballot to vote for Trump. “And a lot of them don’t want things to change.”

In short, if all those people in Washington and places like Hollywood and New York are so riled up, Trump supporters suggest, that means he must be doing something right.

Historians and other experts point to a singular lack of achievement in Trump’s first 100 days. Among their lengthy critique: He has not passed one major piece of legislation. He’s antagonized foreign allies. His proposed travel restrictions on Muslim-majority countries has stalled in court.

Most spectacularly, his vow to repeal and replace President Obama’s signature healthcare law flopped in a Congress run by his own party.

But Trump supporters measure his accomplishments in other ways.

He’s boosted business confidence, surveys show, and the stock market has soared. “Anyone with a 401(k) has to be delighted,” said Marla Reichert, 52, head of the Pueblo County GOP.

He’s talked tough on terrorism and surrounded himself with military men who can turn those words into action. “It’s time to show the world we’re tired of being pushed around,” said Carson at the Chug-A-Mug.

He’s promoted a “buy American, hire American” policy, and just wait, Trump backers say. Maybe it’s unrealistic to bring 6,000 steel-making jobs back to Pueblo, says Reichert, whose father and grandfather both worked in the mill. “But why not 4,000?” she asked. “Why not 3,000?”

Critics point to Trump’s frequent golf outings and taxpayer-funded trips to Florida, but that’s nothing more than sore-loser talk, the president’s defenders say. Obama golfed too, they note, and as for Trump’s costly travels, give him a break. “If he’s doing his job,” said Republican Adam Huskin, 30, a roofing contractor in upscale Pueblo West, “I don’t really care where he’s doing it from.”

Some see a series of flip-flops: on NATO, on the Iranian disarmament deal, on support for the Federal Reserve chair, among many. Trump backers see something else entirely: the savvy of a deal-maker.

Take China, for instance. Trump vowed to slap a fat tariff on the world’s most populous country but has since backed off, which strikes Tom Ready, a Pueblo West dentist, as perfectly sound.

“We’re not going to go to war with our biggest trading partner,” said Ready, 73, a Republican who showed up at the Eagle club in a skull T-shirt promoting his motorcycle club, the Uglies. “He said, ‘OK, let’s work it out.’ What’s wrong with that? I don’t call it changing policies. I call it a better way of doing things.”

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

Who knows what would happen?

The only thing we do know is Trump hasn't lost any ground with his base. Zero. They still believe he walks on water. And that is a formidable number. A number that defeated Hillary Clinton despite the massive numbers that voted for her.

The question is are the Democrats adding districts? Adding votes is meaningless.

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

We dont need them to change their mind...we need the Dems who stayed home to vote. If the Dems focus on changing the mind of the Trumpers they will lose. Re-engage the party members and get them out and you win. It is basic math.

 

[Gurtholfin]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

I believe the term is "simple math."


Do you folks believe he will actually last 4 years?

I'll be more surprised if he does than if he doesn't.

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

Who knows what would happen?

The only thing we do know is Trump hasn't lost any ground with his base. Zero. They still believe he walks on water. And that is a formidable number. A number that defeated Hillary Clinton despite the massive numbers that voted for her.

The question is are the Democrats adding districts? Adding votes is meaningless.

We wont know until the Dems vote. The Dems control their destiny...if they are lazy again (or if they stand with their moronic principles) they lose. If they show up they win. They have no one to blame but themselves if this happens again.

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

I believe the term is "simple math."


Do you folks believe he will actually last 4 years?

I'll be more surprised if he does than if he doesn't.

Nah this aint the PWR

 

[BassAle]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

She is not a good candidate.

but Trump was a good candidate? Lets see... racist remarks, check. sexist remarks, check. inability to speak coherently, check. conflicts of interest up the ***, check.

Trump was a million times worse as a candidate, yet the moron rednecks still voted for him. It honestly has me question if I want to give up on America and move to Canada.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

Trump is polling very well within his party. Yes he is overall at historically low numbers, but do you think he couldn't win re-election at this point? He still has the support of something like 96% of people voted for him. Getting Gorsuch on SCOTUS earned him huge points with conservatives even if they didn't like him, as evidenced here.

Trump could lose even if something like 99.5% of his voters stuck with him. If those .5% were in PA, MI, and WI it could flip.

This was an incredibly close election.

 

[burd]

Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

but Trump was a good candidate? Lets see... racist remarks, check. sexist remarks, check. inability to speak coherently, check. conflicts of interest up the ***, check.

Trump was a million times worse as a candidate, yet the moron rednecks still voted for him. It honestly has me question if I want to give up on America and move to Canada.

That's one part of this whole shytshow that was very hard to handle: realizing who we (at least a great number of us) are.