Pandemic and budget strain: Will any schools drop hockey?

[Ol’ Bill Diehl]

With additional strain on school budgets caused by the pandemic, are any hockey programs in danger of being cut?

What do you see happening? What will the sport look like when it’s up and running again?

 

[J.D.]

Re: Pandemic and budget strain: Will any schools drop hockey?

Probably the three programs already in some trouble...

 

[Split-N]

Re: Pandemic and budget strain: Will any schools drop hockey?

Copied from the "Will There be Hockey in the Fall...?" thread:

...Institutions, both public and private, are taking deep financial hits and (of course) the trial lawyers are lined up to file the predictable lawsuits. Clearly, cuts are going to have to be made to help stanch the financial bleeding and intercollegiate sports may well be among them. Non-revenue programs could bear the brunt but I wouldn't be surprised to see football--especially at the FCS level--on the chopping block. Football is insanely expensive and has been a loss leader for years, except for the usual suspects. Hockey won't be immune either. Just impossible to project what might happen at this point.

 

[Russell Jaslow]

Re: Pandemic and budget strain: Will any schools drop hockey?

Copied from the "Will There be Hockey in the Fall...?" thread:

...Institutions, both public and private, are taking deep financial hits and (of course) the trial lawyers are lined up to file the predictable lawsuits. Clearly, cuts are going to have to be made to help stanch the financial bleeding and intercollegiate sports may well be among them. Non-revenue programs could bear the brunt but I wouldn't be surprised to see football--especially at the FCS level--on the chopping block. Football is insanely expensive and has been a loss leader for years, except for the usual suspects. Hockey won't be immune either. Just impossible to project what might happen at this point.

One thing schools have to be careful of — to maintain your NCAA standing, you have to field a minimum number of sports (number dependent on what division you are in), with a minimum spread for each season (fall, winter, spring). So, only so much can be cut if you want to stay in the NCAA.

 

[pdt1081]

One thing schools have to be careful of — to maintain your NCAA standing, you have to field a minimum number of sports (number dependent on what division you are in), with a minimum spread for each season (fall, winter, spring). So, only so much can be cut if you want to stay in the NCAA.

A letter has already been filed (weeks ago) asking for an exemption on minimum number of sports and minimum football attendance.

 

[The Zlax45]

Re: Pandemic and budget strain: Will any schools drop hockey?

One thing schools have to be careful of — to maintain your NCAA standing, you have to field a minimum number of sports (number dependent on what division you are in), with a minimum spread for each season (fall, winter, spring). So, only so much can be cut if you want to stay in the NCAA.

FIU cut Indoor Track and Field but kept their Outdoor team for this EXACT reason.

 

[Sol Diablo]

Re: Pandemic and budget strain: Will any schools drop hockey?

Maybe drop to D2 or D3, lower cost?

 

[MTUHuskies]

Re: Pandemic and budget strain: Will any schools drop hockey?

Maybe drop to D2 or D3, lower cost?

I don't think any of the D1 teams are interested in dropping to D3 just to save money and that's not what I was suggesting. They would have to drop all their sports from D1/D2 to D3. That would include finding new conferences to play in for all their sports. I just questioned why a team would want to pay more, and have more difficult travel, just to play non conference games in a barn most high schools would not play in.

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[Sol Diablo]

Re: Pandemic and budget strain: Will any schools drop hockey?

I don't think any of the D1 teams are interested in dropping to D3 just to save money and that's not what I was suggesting. They would have to drop all their sports from D1/D2 to D3. That would include finding new conferences to play in for all their sports. I just questioned why a team would want to pay more, and have more difficult travel, just to play non conference games in a barn most high schools would not play in.

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I would hope they wouldn't consider dropping to a lower division. But if they can't afford being D1, they don't have much option being its not the National Communistic Athletic Association where other schools pay for the poorer schools or mismanaged schools budgets. If they want to be a big dog then get off the porch.
And if the student-athletes can't handle school & travel, maybe they should consider easier majors. We make decisions in life that generate outcomes we have to live with...... otherwise make different decisions.

 

[MTUHuskies]

Re: Pandemic and budget strain: Will any schools drop hockey?

I would hope they wouldn't consider dropping to a lower division. But if they can't afford being D1, they don't have much option being its not the National Communistic Athletic Association where other schools pay for the poorer schools or mismanaged schools budgets. If they want to be a big dog then get off the porch.
And if the student-athletes can't handle school & travel, maybe they should consider easier majors. We make decisions in life that generate outcomes we have to live with...... otherwise make different decisions.

I didn't say the student athletes couldn't handle it. I just asked, and was never answered, why a school would want to spend more time and money to play in a delapidated 700-seat rink when they have many other options to full their NC schedule.

I'll wait.

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[Sol Diablo]

Re: Pandemic and budget strain: Will any schools drop hockey?

I didn't say the student athletes couldn't handle it. I just asked, and was never answered, why a school would want to spend more time and money to play in a delapitated 700-seat rink when they have many other options to full their NC schedule.

I'll wait.

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You've asked a lot of things as have I and you have not answered some of mine.
The only reason to play anywhere is for the competition. If they wish to have plush surroundings, plush locker rooms, plush seating for the audience, lots of condiments served, then they are not there for hockey. If they don't have the money nor energy to travel, then stay home.

 

[MTUHuskies]

Re: Pandemic and budget strain: Will any schools drop hockey?

You've asked a lot of things as have I and you have not answered some of mine.
The only reason to play anywhere is for the competition. If they wish to have plush surroundings, plush locker rooms, plush seating for the audience, lots of condiments served, then they are not there for hockey. If they don't have the money nor energy to travel, then stay home.

So you support my point that competition can be found closer and cheaper. And again, if the rink is better and the competition is the same, why pay more and get less? You are still not answering that question. You aren't making a very good sales pitch to play there. All you do is claim that other teams have neither the money nor the energy to go there.

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[Sol Diablo]

Re: Pandemic and budget strain: Will any schools drop hockey?

Am just capitalizing so you can see my answers to individual questions better.

So you support my point that competition can be found closer and cheaper. YOU ARE CORRECT.
And again, if the rink is better and the competition is the same, why pay more and get less? WHY THE FOCUS ON THE RINK? WHAT IS THE "GET LESS" COMMENT? GOT NOTHING TO DO WITH THE GAME. BUT IF THE COMPETITION IS THE SAME THEN YOU ARE CORRECT ABOUT "WHY PAY MORE".
You are still not answering that question. ANSWERED.
You aren't making a very good sales pitch to play there. GUESS ASU NEEDS TO HAND OUT MONEY, NOT GONNA HAPPEN, BUT THOSE TEAMS THAT WANT IT NEED TO REASSESS D1 MEMBERSHIP RATHER THAN RESORT TO BORDERLINE EXTORTION.
All you do is claim that other teams have neither the money nor the energy to go there. WCHA PUBLICLY CLAIMED THEY DIDN'T HAVE THE MONEY AND NEEDED HANDOUTS, WELL KNOWN FACT. ITS NOT AS WELL KNOWN THAT NCHA ASKED FOR SIMILAR. ITS BEEN PUBLICLY REPORTED THAT ITS A LONG TRIP TO TEMPE FOR STUDENT-ATHLETES TO MAKE AND IT MAY BE AS LONG A TRIP TIME WISE TO BUS FROM HOUGHTON TO BG BUT MTU HAS DONE IT.
MTU APPEARS TO HAVE THE MONEY, ENERGY AND ENTHUSIASM TO GO THERE AND PLAY. CAN'T SAY THAT FOR ALL TEAMS BASED ON PUBLIC INFORMATION AND 2ND HAND COMMENTS I'VE HEARD AROUND OCEANSIDE.


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[MTUHuskies]

Re: Pandemic and budget strain: Will any schools drop hockey?

Am just capitalizing so you can see my answers to individual questions better.

Here's an idea. Maybe ASU should reassess their commitment to D1 hockey. Spend the money to build a suitable rink or go back to club hockey. Seems like your logic works in that situation.

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[Russell Jaslow]

Re: Pandemic and budget strain: Will any schools drop hockey?

A letter has already been filed (weeks ago) asking for an exemption on minimum number of sports and minimum football attendance.

I know. But it doesn’t mean it’s going to pass.

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

Re: Pandemic and budget strain: Will any schools drop hockey?

I guess if I’m worried about anyone, it’s the schools that are either (a) at risk anyway, or (b) schools that are likely to be both dependent on football but also probably don’t have a <ton> of revenue.

The Alaska schools and UAH sure fall into the first category. But I’m not too sure many would be in the second. I’m probably not worried about the BTHC schools. And I would imagine the other D-I football schools have more to lose from football than the D-II/III playups with football so maybe that reduces the risk for most of the rest. It’s hard to imagine the GLIAC and Northern Sun or non-Ivy ECAC schools being in more danger than the MAC schools or UConn.

BGSU had those budget scares a few years back. If I’m picking one, they’re the ones with a current conference alignment that I’m worried about.

Of course, that said: none of us really know anything and this is all nonsense and at best educated guesses in the dark.

 

[pdt1081]

I guess if I’m worried about anyone, it’s the schools that are either (a) at risk anyway, or (b) schools that are likely to be both dependent on football but also probably don’t have a <ton> of revenue.

The Alaska schools and UAH sure fall into the first category. But I’m not too sure many would be in the second. I’m probably not worried about the BTHC schools. And I would imagine the other D-I football schools have more to lose from football than the D-II/III playups with football so maybe that reduces the risk for most of the rest. It’s hard to imagine the GLIAC and Northern Sun or non-Ivy ECAC schools being in more danger than the MAC schools or UConn.

BGSU had those budget scares a few years back. If I’m picking one, they’re the ones with a current conference alignment that I’m worried about.

Of course, that said: none of us really know anything and this is all nonsense and at best educated guesses in the dark.

BGSU has said athletics is facing a 10% reduction in funding. There has not been any information released about any sports being cut. Only other announcement has been they signed onto the letter, along with every other G5 school. That may simply be supporting their conference mates, wanting to reduce the number of sports, or they are worried about maintaining the minimum attendance for football. The football attendance is probably the biggest issue they are facing. The 10% reduction in funding can be made without much being seen outside the department.

 

[Sol Diablo]

Re: Pandemic and budget strain: Will any schools drop hockey?

Here's an idea. Maybe ASU should reassess their commitment to D1 hockey. Spend the money to build a suitable rink or go back to club hockey. Seems like your logic works in that situation.

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Your timing is off concerning your idea. ASU has the $120 million in hand, FEL & FEED is 90% complete. Existing infrastructure is being verified as part of fine tuning (those dang pipes & conduit that didn't make it onto the blueprints........) The University has announced COVID-19 will have no bearing on groundbreaking this November. The arena timing got pushed back roughly 2 years from the earlier plans to meet the Innovation Corridor mega project master plan. Hopefully MTU will make it back down even before the new arena is up and running. Would be great to have the game at Gila River Arena - Coyotes arena - which is done for several games each year.

Now concerning schools that can't afford D1 hockey, they can go to D2, D3, club without all sports having to do the same. I recall MTU is like D2 in football but D1 in hockey. UND is D1 hockey but FCS - formerly known as D2 in football, lots of other examples. However I am hoping no schools will have to go that route and more schools will enter D1.

 

[MTUHuskies]

Re: Pandemic and budget strain: Will any schools drop hockey?

Your timing is off concerning your idea. ASU has the $120 million in hand, FEL & FEED is 90% complete. Existing infrastructure is being verified as part of fine tuning (those dang pipes & conduit that didn't make it onto the blueprints........) The University has announced COVID-19 will have no bearing on groundbreaking this November. The arena timing got pushed back roughly 2 years from the earlier plans to meet the Innovation Corridor mega project master plan. Hopefully MTU will make it back down even before the new arena is up and running. Would be great to have the game at Gila River Arena - Coyotes arena - which is done for several games each year.

Now concerning schools that can't afford D1 hockey, they can go to D2, D3, club without all sports having to do the same. I recall MTU is like D2 in football but D1 in hockey. UND is D1 hockey but FCS - formerly known as D2 in football, lots of other examples. However I am hoping no schools will have to go that route and more schools will enter D1.

Good news on the rink. Last rumours I had heard were that they didn't have any tangible progress.

As for not playing D1, your other choice in the NCAA is D3. To play D3 hockey all teams at the school must play D3. It would shock me if any current D1 schools went that route.

Tech played at Gila River a few years back. In my mind that's kind of a Catch 22. NHL rinks are nice but 8000 fans in an 18,000 seat rink kills the atmosphere. I'd much rather see a game in a full 4000 seat arena - but that's s whole different topic. Playing in Phoenix is a great opportunity for alumni in the southwest to see them play. This season with the games at Oceanside, many were not able to get tickets. From those who did attend, I've only heard negative comments about the rink.

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[davyd83]

Your timing is off concerning your idea. ASU has the $120 million in hand, FEL & FEED is 90% complete. Existing infrastructure is being verified as part of fine tuning (those dang pipes & conduit that didn't make it onto the blueprints........) The University has announced COVID-19 will have no bearing on groundbreaking this November. The arena timing got pushed back roughly 2 years from the earlier plans to meet the Innovation Corridor mega project master plan. Hopefully MTU will make it back down even before the new arena is up and running. Would be great to have the game at Gila River Arena - Coyotes arena - which is done for several games each year.

Now concerning schools that can't afford D1 hockey, they can go to D2, D3, club without all sports having to do the same. I recall MTU is like D2 in football but D1 in hockey. UND is D1 hockey but FCS - formerly known as D2 in football, lots of other examples. However I am hoping no schools will have to go that route and more schools will enter D1.

FCS was not D-2. FCS was D-1AA. D-2 remains as it was.