NCAA Frozen Four

[bronconick]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

Think it has a lot more to do with ESPN getting rights to air parts of the Masters then anything else.

 

[Wreckincrew]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

Enough with the butcher analogy.

This is like a butcher telling me he won't sell me meat anymore.

 

[RENCEB]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

.....2016: All games carries on ESPN8....

The "OCHO"!!!! Pre-empted by the ADAA Dodge Ball championships!

 

[TigerFan86-87]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

+1

Why do you think they dropped the NHL a few years ago?

Because they got rights to the NBA

 

[The Rube]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

Think it has a lot more to do with ESPN getting rights to air parts of the Masters then anything else.

College hockey is all tied into other major sport contracts. If ESPN had a choice, they wouldn't bother showing it at all.

 

[Caustic Undertow]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

The question that <b>needs</b> to be asked, that has been answered for years, is "will I get to watch the games?" Years ago the answer was usually no, unless it was the Frozen four or your local Sports Network broadcasting Minnesota/Michigan/BU. Today with a plethora of niche sports networks, Fox College Sports, Satellite Television, and tv-quality internet video, the answer has increasingly become "yes."

I happen to enjoy several "niche" sports that are harder to watch than college hockey. I enjoy professional cycling for much of the year, and while OLN/Vs/NBC Sports has supported it for years, many of the best races can still only be found in small foreign video feeds. Or, for a moderate fee, on Universal Sports. But it can be hard to find and one is often reduced to watching a Belgian television network broadcast grainy internet footage.

I'm also a fan of alpine skiing, which makes cycling and college hockey look like the NFL in breadth of coverage. The only live footage available is provided by Universal Sports, for 6.99 a day or a larger fee for a season pass. This footage comes direct from the local source video and has no commentary. And most of it happens early in the day in Europe. In order to watch stars like Bode Miller or Lindsay Vonn compete live, one must wake up extremely early (the first races begin at 3:30 am Central), pay money, and provide one's own commentary. And yes, I have done this several times this year.

You might say, "Cycling? Skiing? Who cares about that?"

That's what roughly 98 or 99% of the population thinks about college hockey. Unfortunate, but true. Broadcasting the final on ESPN won't change that--it's been on ESPN for years, and the sport has not gained significant ratings increases.

The question being asked by this thread is, "Is college hockey getting proper respect?" Er, probably is. The question that needs to be asked is, "Can I see the games?" More than ever, the answer is yes. Up to 7 games go against each other on Friday nights, and ESPN's coverage of hockey has significantly <b>increased</b> in breadth. Tape delays on ESPN U are waaaaay better than the old syndication system where it was impossible, even with internet and satellite tv, to watch every game. ESPN 3 also shows every tournament game, and I loved the flexibility it offered me. Everything is live and replays are offered on demand. None of this was remotely conceivable ten years ago; indeed, we have just about the best-case television scenario we could ever have dreamed about years ago.

Except that the final is on ESPN 2 now. Oh well. I'll still watch it.

 

[Biddco]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

The question that <b>needs</b> to be asked, that has been answered for years, is "will I get to watch the games?" Years ago the answer was usually no, unless it was the Frozen four or your local Sports Network broadcasting Minnesota/Michigan/BU. Today with a plethora of niche sports networks, Fox College Sports, Satellite Television, and tv-quality internet video, the answer has increasingly become "yes."

The question being asked by this thread is, "Is college hockey getting proper respect?" Er, probably is. The question that needs to be asked is, "Can I see the games?" More than ever, the answer is yes. Up to 7 games go against each other on Friday nights, and ESPN's coverage of hockey has significantly <b>increased</b> in breadth. Tape delays on ESPN U are waaaaay better than the old syndication system where it was impossible, even with internet and satellite tv, to watch every game. ESPN 3 also shows every tournament game, and I loved the flexibility it offered me. Everything is live and replays are offered on demand. None of this was remotely conceivable ten years ago; indeed, we have just about the best-case television scenario we could ever have dreamed about years ago.

Except that the final is on ESPN 2 now. Oh well. I'll still watch it.

It stinks that this happened, but I'm not worried because I know I'll see it someway. What irks me the most, is that the Hobey Baker Ceremony is no longer on tv. Hopefully the Hobey Committee figures a way for people to watch it. Saw on Twitter they were working on it.

 

[bigmrg74]

It stinks that this happened, but I'm not worried because I know I'll see it someway. What irks me the most, is that the Hobey Baker Ceremony is no longer on tv. Hopefully the Hobey Committee figures a way for people to watch it. Saw on Twitter they were working on it.

I still think the answer would be to shift the Frozen Four Weekend to a weekend where it's not so jammed packed on the sports dial. Going up against the Masters and the Final Four doesn't do us any favors. Personally if the NCAA shifted the regionals to the weekend of the Final Four, that would at least put those games where the network only has the coverage of the 3 womans Final Four games instead of a weekend like the Sweet Sixteen, where ESPN has 12 womens games to get in, along with the coverage of all the Mens Sweet Sixteen games as well.

 

[bronconick]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

College hockey is all tied into other major sport contracts. If ESPN had a choice, they wouldn't bother showing it at all.

Of course not, but it's the fact that they can show the Masters that weekend that bumps everything else down a notch. MLB opening day being on Thursday doesn't help this year, as it's the one day before September where America pretends to still like baseball.

 

[chickod]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

The question that <b>needs</b> to be asked, that has been answered for years, is "will I get to watch the games?"

I absolutely agree 100% with everything you have said (except for the "including Gary Thorne, long the best hockey voice in America" - apparently they don't have very good announcers in the Midwest).

Many people just cannot accept that the sport will never have widespread popularity (and everybody's favorite new catchword, "growth"). This is primarily because most people CAN'T PLAY IT!!!! If you don't live where you can skate outdoors, you have to pay for ice time at a rink (not to mention that, equipment-wise, it's one of the most expensive sports out there). If you're a kid growing up in Argentina or Spain (just to pick two random places), where are you going to play hockey? In fact, WHY would you even care? If you're poor, you can borrow a ball and play soccer or basketball.

Why do I like hockey? Because my Dad flooded our back patio when I was a kid and my grandmother lived on a pond (we walked out the back door and skated in the winter). I know I'm older than most people on these forums, but everyone has to understand that until recently, you wouldn't even know something EXISTED unless you could play it yourself, because you weren't going to see "regional" sports on TV in those days. Hockey scores aren't even in the paper in most parts of the country. There was no internet, so if it wasn't on TV or in the newspaper, it didn't exist...

 

[TigerFan86-87]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

I still think the answer would be to shift the Frozen Four Weekend to a weekend where it's not so jammed packed on the sports dial. Going up against the Masters and the Final Four doesn't do us any favors. Personally if the NCAA shifted the regionals to the weekend of the Final Four, that would at least put those games where the network only has the coverage of the 3 womans Final Four games instead of a weekend like the Sweet Sixteen, where ESPN has 12 womens games to get in, along with the coverage of all the Mens Sweet Sixteen games as well.

The Final Four is the weekend before the Frozen Four during hockey's week off. That was fixed a few years ago creating the new conflict with the Masters (that isn't nearly as much of a conflict when Tiger isn't playing in it).

 

[Caustic Undertow]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

(except for the "including Gary Thorne, long the best hockey voice in America" - apparently they don't have very good announcers in the Midwest)

Ten years ago threads about television griped about Thorne's absence from NCAA hockey coverage, due to his NHL obligations. He was the national voice of hockey and he was good at it. We're talking "national broadcast coverage," here.

Personally, I rarely watched Thorne; in Ann Arbor I got the CBC and I always preferred to watch Bob Cole or Chris Cuthbert, with the CBC's peerless studio coverage framing the games.

You raise an excellent point about a major issue that hockey has. It's hard to really appreciate if you don't play, and even harder if you've never even ice skated. Hockey doesn't feel quite the same without cold weather, either, and the years I spent in LA were very bizarre from a hockey standpoint. Following Michigan in the NCAA tournament amidst 90 degree temperatures felt strange. Basketball, on the other hand, feels natural in all weather (we've all played summer pick-up, and of course the actual season is in the winter inside warm gymnasiums). Everyone has tried to dunk and failed, so we can all appreciate how amazing it is when college and pro players do it.

That's not to say that college hockey can't grow; There are lots of areas that have reasonably hockey-friendly weather with no college hockey presence. In fact, the Pacific Northwest is an area that college hockey has missed on, with several successful WHL franchises. There is space for hockey to grow, but its growth is not primarily dependent on whether the championship is broadcast on ESPN or ESPN 2. Regardless of growth, though, it will always be a regional, niche sport. Its niche can be larger and it can be great, but it's a niche.

 

[HockeyMan2000]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

Wow, bad news. This didn't happen because of the Masters and the timing IMO. Even the selection show was kicked off ESPN2 and relegated to ESPNU. The Frozen Four semis, which have been on ESPN2 since the '90s, have also been relegated to ESPNU. The amount of homes ESPNU is in doesn't compare to ESPN2, it's not even close.

I agree fully college hockey is a niche sport, but this is still a major demotion on ESPN's part and frankly, their entire coverage of hockey itself has become a joke since they have no vested interest in the NHL (unlike the NBA, which isn't nearly as popular as the NFL but is covered as if it is by ESPN). ESPNU dropped their college hockey games of the week this past year on top of it, so it's hard not to look at this as a slap in the face to college hockey on the part of the network. The championship with one or two exceptions has basically aired on ESPN since the late '70s and now that's coming to an end as well.

The main concern for us fans will be how many sat channels will pick up those syndicated games. Sadly, since ESPN has the rights for another decade to these championships, I'd almost expect the final to start airing on ESPNU sometime in the next 10 years.

 

[Priceless]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

I also think any interest ESPN had in college hockey died with Tom Mees. He had the influence around Bristol to make the sport more important to the network. Had he been around for these last 17 years coverage of the Frozen Four, and college hockey in general, would be dramatically better. After his death there was no one at the Mothership to advocate for us. Now that I've thought about it, I'm surprised this change didn't happen earlier.

 

[Veritas]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

In addition to scheduling the series the same weekend as the Masters, it is also the weekend of both Easter and Passover when many people travel to be with family. I have a place in Florida about 30 minutes from the arena and would have gone but for Easter. My son and I will be in Connecticut having Easter dinner with my 87 year old uncle and family as one never knows when it is the last opportunity to see him. The Tampa arena is a nice facility too, decent transit and parking. Been to a few NHL games there.

 

[Patman]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

The quality of coverage has improved? Really?

If they don't want to broadcast the games, then they can sell the broadcast rights to NBC and let them carry the Frozen Four and the regionals.

It's not a matter of being threatened that college hockey will catch on in popularity, it's that on a Friday night in January a few people might decide to watch college hockey instead of Fairfield at Iona on one of the ESPN networks. And if they tune in to watch college hockey, they might notice that NBC has other sports shows (including college basketball and football) and has some pretty good NFL shows with Peter King, Mike Florio and persona non grata, Dan Patrick. That's how you start losing viewers and your ratings start to get eroded. Sure, it's not a threat now, why take a chance that it might happen?

I will guarantee you that this is what it is. You have to realize that ESPN sees itself as an alpha-male predatory organization. The reason they're burying college hockey is because it doesn't fit into the way they see the world. Even worse now that a major competitor is seeing that college hockey may serve their larger purposes as part of their own branding.

ESPN would certainly submarine a sport to fight off a competitor. Its who they are, culturally.

 

[Blackheart]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

ESPN is a frickin' nightmare for college hockey...

 

[bronconick]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

I will guarantee you that this is what it is. You have to realize that ESPN sees itself as an alpha-male predatory organization. The reason they're burying college hockey is because it doesn't fit into the way they see the world. Even worse now that a major competitor is seeing that college hockey may serve their larger purposes as part of their own branding.

ESPN would certainly submarine a sport to fight off a competitor. Its who they are, culturally.

Yeah, it's clearly a conspiracy theory instead of the fact that hockey's TV ratings are something a network scrapes off their shoe. Last year the NHL finally passed the WNBA in households per game. You could put everyone who watches the NCAA regionals into a football stadium and the Frozen Four into a city.

The idea that ESPN is "scared" of hockey becoming the key to threatening their essential monopoly is laughable. If it was, they'd over pay to keep it, like they just agreed to with the Big XII conference, paying $12 million per school for ~20 football games of which Texas-OU is the only really good one just to keep FOX and NBC away.

 

[CLS]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

...You could put everyone who watches the NCAA regionals into a football stadium and the Frozen Four into a city.

Please don't give them any ideas. The next thing you know, they'll put the Frozen Four in a football stadium. Oh, wait ...

 

[Nick Papagiorgio]

Re: NCAA Frozen Four

Yeah, it's clearly a conspiracy theory instead of the fact that hockey's TV ratings are something a network scrapes off their shoe. Last year the NHL finally passed the WNBA in households per game. You could put everyone who watches the NCAA regionals into a football stadium and the Frozen Four into a city.

The idea that ESPN is "scared" of hockey becoming the key to threatening their essential monopoly is laughable. If it was, they'd over pay to keep it, like they just agreed to with the Big XII conference, paying $12 million per school for ~20 football games of which Texas-OU is the only really good one just to keep FOX and NBC away.

Well said. Worth noting Patman's affiliation with Uconn. They have an unhealthy obsession over there with the worldwide leader (ESPN = the devil, ESPN is trying to destroy the Big East, ESPN picked the ACC invitations because the BC AD said so, etc etc etc).