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Maine

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Re: Maine

Fishman'81 said:
"Be careful what you wish for"...

I was among the last to call for Tim's head, but I eventually did. Turns-out I was wrong.

Now we have a completely inept regime, and I'd be happy to have TW back, yesterday. I have no doubt whatsoever that he would have performed much better than Dead Red over the past 6-7 years, or whatever it is. (Feels like forever.)
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Bringing TW back would be accepting - celebrating, even - mediocrity. That is something I don't embrace.

walrus said:
I don't believe Tim would have done any better than Red. Once Grant left it was over.
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Listen to Wally. He's one of the brightest hockey fans around.
 
Re: Maine

Runsub5 said:
...Walsh struggled his first few years and he never really had success until he hired Grant away from Wisconsin.
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As much as I think Coach Standbrook was instrumental in Maine's success, Coach Walsh had already become successful at Maine before he arrived. After two sub-0.300 seasons Coach Walsh had 0.595 and 0.795 seasons before Coach Standbrook arrived in 1988:
1984-85 - 12-29-1 0.298
1985-86 - 11-28-1 0.288
1986-87 - 24-16-2 0.595
1987-88 - 34-8-2 0.795

By the way, I recall that 1986-87 season well. BU's soon to be all-time leading scorer John Cullen was captain and BU had been picked as the pre-season #1 team in the country. The Terriers opened the season hosting Maine for 2 games which were expected to be wins, but ended up as 3-2 and 7-5 losses. Those 2 losses set the tone for an underwhelming season for BU and were also the start of an 11-game losing streak to Maine.

Sean
 
Re: Maine

Sean Pickett said:
To different issues here, Coach Whitehead's record vs Coach Gendron's record and Coach Standbrook's time at Maine. First, I created a graph with Coach Whitehead's and Coach Gendron's season-by-season winning percentages (the black line is Coach Whitehead's last season). There was a drop off after the 2006-07 season, but Coach Whitehead had turned it around until a very poor 2012-13 season.

<img src="https://www.buhockeyarchives.com/Charts/MaineTWRG.png">

As for Coach Standbrook, I have advocated that the assistant coaches are a major reason for a program's success for some time and even showed that Coach Parker's most successful seasons were when he had top assistants. However, I will point out that 2 of Coach Whitehead's three losing seasons came in 2007-08 and 2008-09, Coach Standbrook's last season at Maine and the first season after he left. Coach Whitehead then had three winning seasons, each better than the previous one, until his poor last season.

In regards to the financials, in 2009-10 Maine was 21st in expenses for men's hockey, while in 2012-13 Maine had dropped to 26th in expenses, despite an increase of about $300 thousand (about 15%). So part of the problem was that Maine was not keeping pace with the increased spending of other programs.

Sean
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Nicely done Sean.
 
Re: Maine

NorthMike said:
Thank You Sean, I agree with you in regard to assist coaches. Reds assistants are probably OK but surely not top notch. I promote a change in assistants if Red for some reason hangs on. Their names never come up as being head coach prospects or "good"recruiters, I dont know maybe they aren't interested in becoming head coaches.

Based on your graph, Grants departure could be related to the downturn leading to the 07-09 period. Just conjecture, possible Grant clearly saw the program declining and didnt see where his role could help to change that. Possible his role was diminished or he saw the culture was just wrong.
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Runsub5 said:
Nicely done Sean.
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Thanks.

Coach Standbrook is an excellent example of an assistant not interested in becoming a head coach, although he already had been one, so he is likely a special case as well. But I agree that most top assistants are at least mentioned as potential head coaches when opening come up. I also agree that changing assistant coaches can make a difference, even if it is a hard choice to make.

Sean
 
Re: Maine

Sean Pickett said:
I don't consider a 250-171-54 0.583 record over 12 season as mediocre.

Sean
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Look at the numbers he generated on his own, not those with Shawn's recruits. That .583 is very much the high end of what he was capable of on his own. Mediocre.
 
Re: Maine

Runsub5 said:
Tim never pushed Grant out. That's the position of people who did not like Tim and assume that he was responsible. If Grant had wanted to continue his hockey career he would have coached or recruited for another team. Tim did have difficulty in recruiting enough quality players. He had good goal tenders and a good first line. He also developed players (Abbott and Flynn) and Gendron's best team were players he inherited from Tim in his first year. Tim was placed in a difficult position by following a legend. Walsh struggled his first few years and he never really had success until he hired Grant away from Wisconsin. The answer as to how Tim would have done had he stayed is pure conjecture because Tim will never return to Orono. In fact, I suspect he is pleased that he is no longer there.
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Grant may have quit but he wasn't wanted anymore. Tim never should have gotten the job without a Natl Search after his first season ended.
 
Recruiting impact lags seasonal success. Most of these recruits have a couple/few years of lead time. Therefore, a recruiter that is great at his job can leave and his impact of leaving will more than likely not fully be felt for a couple seasons(assuming no mass exits). So I think Sean’s graph tells only a portion of the story. The lull in recruiting was felt after Whitehead graph started trending down.

Having said this, I do not see Red coaching his team in a fashion trending very much better than five hundred. When the goalie was pulled and a play needed drawn up, it was Ben doing the drawing. I believe a young coach with smarts, charisma, and passion would inject new life blood into this program. And I don’t fault Ben or Allfie.
 
Also, that little bruneski is about the best man in front of his own net. So. He needs to be in the line up in front of VMT. VMT is a bit lost and needs be 19 th skater or a forward.
 
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Re: Maine

BlackI said:
It didn’t take any alcohol to label your post of “I will take Whitehead back” as pathetic. I guess you think it went over well and got a great reception.
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I'm not running for office here, and I never asked to get TW back.

But Whitehead very easily had a better track record than has had Red, you dope. That's verifiable.

Again, have someone read that you to you, once you sober-up. (Assuming that ever happens.)
 
Fishman'81 said:
I'm not running for office here, and I never asked to get TW back.

But Whitehead very easily had a better track record than has had Red, you dope. That's verifiable.

Again, have someone read that you to you, once you sober-up. (Assuming that ever happens.)
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Wrong. You clamored for his firing. Now you clamor for his hiring. You are a bit wish washy. Watch tv. Impeach president. Your gen f’d us with nafta. You know that. Your gen gave us a hell of a lot of backlash because ya shipped it all overseas. All manufacturing overseas. Your generation was absolute ****. Left us with nothing from my grandpas days. You should be ashamed.
 
Re: Maine

BlackI said:
Wrong. You clamored for his firing. Now you clamor for his hiring. You are a bit wish washy. Watch tv. Impeach president. Your gen f’d us with nafta. You know that. Your gen gave us a hell of a lot of backlash because ya shipped it all overseas. All manufacturing overseas. Your generation was absolute ****. Left us with nothing from my grandpas days. You should be ashamed.
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Christ. Drunk as Hell again.

I've been nice enough to you, ignoring most of your elementary school playground bullying BS for a couple of years now, but you are way off the rails again.

And *** are you talking about as far as politics go? I never went there.

You need some help. Serious help.
 
Fishman'81 said:
Christ. Drunk as Hell again.

I've been nice enough to you, ignoring most of your elementary school playground bullying BS for a couple of years now, but you are way off the rails again.

And *** are you talking about as far as politics go? I never went there.

You need some help. Serious help.
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You need help. You know nothing about hockey. That is a fact. You have already embarrassed yourself... what with begging for a **** coach and all. You are an embarrassment for any self respecting Maine fan.
 
Fishman'81 said:
Christ. Drunk as Hell again.

I've been nice enough to you, ignoring most of your elementary school playground bullying BS for a couple of years now, but you are way off the rails again.

And *** are you talking about as far as politics go? I never went there.

You need some help. Serious help.
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Shame on you.
 
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