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Illinois to D1

Re: Illinois to D1

Happy said:
No.

title 9 has 3 parts to satisfy, and every time any other than an equal quota has been tried, a liberal judge has been found that says the school has to have as many women's scholarships as men's. So, if you add 18 men's hockey scholarships, the school will have to add 18 womens, and track or rowing are the cheapest.
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You obviously know this, but for others who don't bother to research, one of the other 3 "tests" for title IX that you can legally use is the "progress" test - that your institution is making progress towards the athletic opportunities/funding being proportional for women compared to the student population.

So, for example, say a school has a 50/50 male/female ratio in the general student population but is giving 200 men's scholarships and 150 women's. If they add 18 scholarships for men's hockey and 18 for women's hockey, the school would have moved from 57% for the men to 56% even though they're adding equal numbers for each - voila, progress towards the ultimate 50/50 ratio. So that keeps the government regulators at bay for a little while longer without actually being at the correct ratio.
 
Re: Illinois to D1

I'm sure some of you know that The University of Illinois at Chicago Circle once had a DI hockey team from 1966 to 1996. See this link: U I C C Hockey. Does anyone know why this hockey program was discontinued? Title 9, perhaps?
 
aygwm2 said:
I'm sure some of you know that The University of Illinois at Chicago Circle once had a DI hockey team from 1966 to 1996. See this link: U I C C Hockey. Does anyone know why this hockey program was discontinued? Title 9, perhaps?
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So did the University of Illinois in Champaign. Not sure about other programs, but the Gophers played them 17 times between 1938-1943.

Not sure why either school dropped their program, but my guess would be $$$.

EDIT: the Gophers played Illinois-Chicago 7 times between 1983-1993.
 
Re: Illinois to D1

aygwm2 said:
I'm sure some of you know that The University of Illinois at Chicago Circle once had a DI hockey team from 1966 to 1996. See this link: U I C C Hockey. Does anyone know why this hockey program was discontinued? Title 9, perhaps?
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As mentioned previously in this thread:
aparch said:
That would be great. Such a shame that a focus on basketball was picked at UIC over keeping hockey. Would have been an insta-rivalry, and the Blackhawks resurgence would have only helped the University.

If this does happen, someone at Northwestern needs to be fired over their incompetence to see the explosion of hockey in the region. They're next. And Wirtz is already a big time supporter of their University.
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Re: Illinois to D1

JDUBBS1280 said:
So did the University of Illinois in Champaign. Not sure about other programs, but the Gophers played them 17 times between 1938-1943.

Not sure why either school dropped their program, but my guess would be $$$.

EDIT: the Gophers played Illinois-Chicago 7 times between 1983-1993.
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I think Illinois at Champaign dropped it because of WW II and didn't pick it up after the war.
 
Re: Illinois to D1

Good luck.............

Brian Gentry said:
Never even heard of Jimmy John's?
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Cousins (started in Milwaukee in the 70's) is my favorite; Jimmy John's a close 2nd. BTW, I know The Chief is gone, but will the Fighting Illini thing will disappear like the Fighting Sioux? It's still there for football.




Relax, just kidding! :p
 
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Re: Illinois to D1

MadCityRich said:
Good luck.............

Cousins (started in Milwaukee in the 70's) is my favorite; Jimmy John's a close 2nd. BTW, I know The Chief is gone, but will the Fighting Illini thing will disappear like the Fighting Sioux? It's still there for football.




Relax, just kidding! :p
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From Wikipedia: The name "Fighting Illini" pre-dates the Chief Illiniwek symbol and was bestowed upon the team in honor of Illinoisans who fought in World War I; the use of the name "Illini" dates to the 19th century. I saw the just kidding, but just wanted to clarify the difference between the two. (Lifelong Illini fan who once lived in Grand Forks)
 
Re: Illinois to D1

JDUBBS1280 said:
Neither Michigan nor Michigan State have a women's hockey program.
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Tough to do when a school has only a single arena. You'll never see it at Michigan, Red doesn't play well with others and share. lol! Ohio State was able to add a womens team only when the mens team moved into the new arena opening up the small old one for the women to use. It would certainly enhance the sport if Illinois could add both.
 
Re: Illinois to D1

Hockeybuckeye said:
Tough to do when a school has only a single arena. You'll never see it at Michigan, Red doesn't play well with others and share. lol! Ohio State was able to add a womens team only when the mens team moved into the new arena opening up the small old one for the women to use. It would certainly enhance the sport if Illinois could add both.
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Last I checked, most schools with women's hockey only have one rink. And, the opening of Value City notwithstanding, women's college hockey (out west anyway) didn't really exist before '98 (only the Gophers amongst WCHA teams had a program before that year), so why would OSU even think of starting a team before Value City opened?
 
Re: Illinois to D1

Hockeybuckeye said:
Tough to do when a school has only a single arena. You'll never see it at Michigan, Red doesn't play well with others and share. lol! Ohio State was able to add a womens team only when the mens team moved into the new arena opening up the small old one for the women to use. It would certainly enhance the sport if Illinois could add both.
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I know I am beating a dead horse with my fellow OSU fans, but I have always maintained that it would be tough for a coach to win at tOSU even though I believe tOSU to be a sleeping giant in the sport of ice hockey due to the lack of a hockey-only facility at Ohio State. Thankfully, both of our new coaches (Coach Osiecki is actually in his second season with the men, first year for Coach Handrahan with our womens program) have proven me wrong. Good luck to Illinois if they decide to go forward with a varsity mens program. The more, the better for the Big Ten Hockey Conference. I would still like to see Michigan and Michigan State add womens hockey. There are a number schools in college hockey where the men and women share the same arena.
 
Re: Illinois to D1

goldy_331 said:
Around here it doesn't get you any more than a city rec arena.
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Crookston (MN) Sports Center (87,000 sq ft and $15 million):

http://www.grandforksherald.com/event/photogallery/id/655/

Don't get me wrong - it's a nice rink for what it is (a community rink with high school and club college - former D-II Minnesota-Crookston), but it's no where near a D-I rink (at least, no where near a B1G/NCHC/WCHA rink. AHA? Sure). I do agree though, that if there already is a plan in place for a $15 mil facility, one could see a big donor just adding to the pot...
 
Re: Illinois to D1

moose97 said:
Crookston (MN) Sports Center (87,000 sq ft and $15 million):

http://www.grandforksherald.com/event/photogallery/id/655/

Don't get me wrong - it's a nice rink for what it is (a community rink with high school and club college - former D-II Minnesota-Crookston), but it's no where near a D-I rink (at least, no where near a B1G/NCHC/WCHA rink. AHA? Sure). I do agree though, that if there already is a plan in place for a $15 mil facility, one could see a big donor just adding to the pot...
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Indeed. If UIUC wanted to get in on the ground floor, they could maybe get away with a Bemidji State/Sanford Center-sized arena: seating 4,373 (though listed elsewhere as 4,700), cost $35 million according to Wikipedia. That said, most of Jimmy's money would go to start-up costs and an endowment for the team, leaving $10 million if that for an arena. Good chunk of seed money, but that's about it.

Too bad the existing UI Ice Arena isn't larger - it's a handsome facility, though it only seats 1,200 and holds 2,000. It's also a wider-than-standard sheet at 115 feet, so perhaps Illinois could squeeze in taller bleachers on one side by cutting it back to 90 feet... that could yield perhaps 3,000 total capacity. It would probably be enough for a women's team, but still inadequate for a B1G men's team.
 
Re: Illinois to D1

moose97 said:
Last I checked, most schools with women's hockey only have one rink. And, the opening of Value City notwithstanding, women's college hockey (out west anyway) didn't really exist before '98 (only the Gophers amongst WCHA teams had a program before that year), so why would OSU even think of starting a team before Value City opened?
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Having two ice sheets is a big help. But if you're at all flexible, two varsities can share a rink without difficulty. Note that the OSU Men's Varsity regularly practices at the Ice Rink. The Ice Rink is also home to two club teams. I don't know how often the club teams practice. But you might say that the Ice Rink is actually home to 3.5 teams.

If there's only one rink with adequate seating, game times can be an issue. Some schools have addressed this by having the Women's Varsity play on a Saturday afternoon/Sunday afternoon basis. Maybe that's not a first choice, but it's not a bad solution at all.

I don't know much about the current set-up at Illinois. But if they were to build a new facility for Men's D-1 and renovate the existing rink for Women's D-1, they'd be following closely in our footsteps. I'm sure that both programs could thrive in that arrangement. But a single hockey-only facility can work just as well. Add a second sheet of ice for practice and you've got the best of the both worlds. All you'd lose is the option for the two teams to host games simultaneously. Personally I'd rather our two varsities didn't play head-to-head!

As for the late '90s, I'd say that a number of things came together at roughly the same time, but it was more of coincidence than anything else. Women's Club Hockey was very strong at OSU in the '90s, so there was a foundation in place that a new varsity could build on when the opportunity arose. And at the time the decision to build the Schott was made, there was a definite void in this market for an NHL/NBA caliber building. Yes, these two things happened contemporaneously. And it's probably fair to say that they were both part of a large package deal. But to the extent that Hockeybuckeye is saying there's a necessary connection between the two, I'd partially disagree. Was the package deal necessary from a political point of view? Quite possibly yes. Was it necessary from the perspective of operating two hockey programs? Again, no.
 
Re: Illinois to D1

On Illinois web site they list 9 Men's sports and 10 Women's sports. Maybe they are already lined up for this to happen.
 
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