How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

[Terrierbyassociation]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

Using your figures, the gate revenue was probably about $3 million on the weekend, with the host building probably keeping most of the ancillaries (concessions, etc.). When you figure in the event staging and promotion costs, you are probably looking at about 1 to 1.5 million in overhead they spent. My guess is they probably cleared about $1.5 million in profit, about $500,000 more than they'd make in a hockey arena.

How does the host building calculate who gets concessions and what not? Do they rent the building to the NCAA and how much does that cost?

Does the NCAA pay for the security or is that part of the contract? I wouldn't be surprised if the NCAA's feasibility and planning committees ate into that profit margin. I also wouldn't be surprised if the NCAA did the feasibility studies all over again when they only sold 22K tickets through October. Now the question is whether or not all of those 22K were in the 189-119 range. I assumed that the tickets being cited in that 22K were indeed of the higher two price points. If not, that could radically shift the profit margin.

 

[Puck Swami]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

How does the host building calculate who gets concessions and what not? Do they rent the building to the NCAA and how much does that cost?

Does the NCAA pay for the security or is that part of the contract? I wouldn't be surprised if the NCAA's feasibility and planning committees ate into that profit margin.

Typically, most of the NCAA's people are either on salary from the head office in Indy, or they are volunteers (like the hockey committee) who get paid by the schools, so planning costs are minimal. They will hire some people as the event gets close, but most of them are likely volunteers.

The host committee (in Detroit) gives guarantee bid figure to the NCAA in their pitch for the event, and assuming that once that figure is met, I am not sure if the host or the NCAA keeps the excess, or it it is split. My guess is that Ford Field offered their building to the host committee at or near cost in terms of rent, as they probably don't get a lot of high profile events in there each year beyond the Lions, and the City wanted the event for exposure and tourism money, so to get a good guarantee to the NCAA, they probably cut the operational costs to a minimum. In terms of concessions, the host group typically makes that money, with a percentage going to the NCAA. Detroit doesn't make much money on the actual arena revenue - they make money on the tax take from the visitor spending in hotels, restuarants, bars, airport, etc. The NCAA pays for the team travel and officials. The host pays for security, game prep, and other arena costs.

 

[Scarlet]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

Whoever designed the layout for the ice and the risers was definitely not a hockey person. Someone who has been to a few hockey games would know that players sometimes stand rather than sit. And that coaches stand behind the bench. And block the view. I don't know if any posters here were on the risers opposite the benches. The slope was just as low there, but they did not have the benches in their way so I'm wondering what the view was like from that side.

Unless there were weekly concerts or something of that ilk at Ford Field, not sure why they couldn't have done a dry run or something. I know one of the Michigan-Michigan St. games was played at the Joe. Why couldn't they have configured the rink then and played that game there and worked out the kinks? Better to do that in a regular season game than the biggest, most important college hockey games of the season.

The security getting in was a pain. I don't recall the lines to get frisked at other FF's. It took longer than usual to get in the actual building.

The FF logo at center ice was painted the wrong way. It was facing the riser seats across from the benches. Shouldn't it have been facing the cameras? I know that's a small nit pick, but I thought it was a silly mistake and should be called out.

I stayed in the riser seats for both games on Thursday. Since it cleared out, we were able to move around to different sections as the teams switched sides of the ice. For Saturday, though, there were ushers and FF staff that were down there to exchange tickets. We moved to the top of section 130 and the view was much better. They offered us a suite, but they were waaaaaay too high. Unless they were willing to throw in the free booze and food, we passed.

The city was ok. I liked being close to Greektown. The walk to GM Place was pretty easy. Tried and failed miserably at getting tickets to Opening Day. Was told more than once how Opening Day is a big deal there. Um, OK. It's kind of a big deal most places.

I will say that what makes the FF fun for me is just getting to hang out and meet up with friends and other college hickey fans. So, in that way, it was a great time.

 

[scsutommyboy]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

How does the host building calculate who gets concessions and what not? Do they rent the building to the NCAA and how much does that cost?

Does the NCAA pay for the security or is that part of the contract? I wouldn't be surprised if the NCAA's feasibility and planning committees ate into that profit margin. I also wouldn't be surprised if the NCAA did the feasibility studies all over again when they only sold 22K tickets through October. Now the question is whether or not all of those 22K were in the 189-119 range. I assumed that the tickets being cited in that 22K were indeed of the higher two price points. If not, that could radically shift the profit margin.

I could be wrong, but I thought the host city ahs to give the NCAA a guarantee and they are never going to lose money?

 

[Puck Swami]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

I could be wrong, but I thought the host city ahs to give the NCAA a guarantee and they are never going to lose money?

That is correct. The NCAA does not lose money on d-i hockey anymore.

But they do lose money on most other NCAA tourneys that cannot make the guarantees that hockey does.

The big risk on the host city commitee, who needs good deals from the local vendors to make its guarantee...

 

[kdilks]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

The security getting in was a pain. I don't recall the lines to get frisked at other FF's. It took longer than usual to get in the actual building.

The FF logo at center ice was painted the wrong way. It was facing the riser seats across from the benches. Shouldn't it have been facing the cameras? I know that's a small nit pick, but I thought it was a silly mistake and should be called out.

Security varies from venue to venue. I've been frisked every time I've gone to a game at Mariucci/TCF Bank Stadium/Target Center this past year. Can't remember if they do it at the Xcel Center or not.

Weren't the cameras above the risers opposite the players' bench?

 

[Scarlet]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

Security varies from venue to venue. I've been frisked every time I've gone to a game at Mariucci/TCF Bank Stadium/Target Center this past year. Can't remember if they do it at the Xcel Center or not.

Weren't the cameras above the risers opposite the players' bench?

Not from the view of the jumbotrons. That's how I noticed it. Cuz, you know, I couldn't see the ice in person. There were cameras on the other side but they used them from reverse angle replays.

 

[Puck Swami]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

Unless there were weekly concerts or something of that ilk at Ford Field, not sure why they couldn't have done a dry run or something. I know one of the Michigan-Michigan St. games was played at the Joe. Why couldn't they have configured the rink then and played that game there and worked out the kinks? Better to do that in a regular season game than the biggest, most important college hockey games of the season.

A dry run would have been a good idea. It costs about $250-$300,000 to have the portable rink put up and you'd probably need ticket revenue at $500,000 to break even on a single game. That means you'd to have need 20,000 people @25.000 per ticket or therabouts.

 

[bluevox]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

Not from the view of the jumbotrons. That's how I noticed it. Cuz, you know, I couldn't see the ice in person. There were cameras on the other side but they used them from reverse angle replays.

In house cameras, for the jumbotrons, were located on the bench side, while ESPN cameras were on the cherry-pickers behind the curtain. The logo faced the ESPN cameras.

 

[Terrierbyassociation]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

A dry run would have been a good idea.

Well of course it is, that's why the NCAA didn't do it.

 

[Slasher7]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

The FF logo at center ice was painted the wrong way. It was facing the riser seats across from the benches. Shouldn't it have been facing the cameras? I know that's a small nit pick, but I thought it was a silly mistake and should be called out.

It was straight on TV, the cameras were above the curtains for the broadcast

 

[mcboozle]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

I agree with most of the opinions already stated.

Detroit=Yay

Ford Field=Boo

I was first row, sec 203 (behind the goalie) and the area from just past the near goalline back was blocked by the boards....and if anything was going on in front of the far goalie, the jumbotron was needed. Although the seat was very comfortable, it faced behind the players benches....which meant I had to be turned to the right to watch the action on the ice. My neck had a nice kink in it by the end of Thursday's games.

A lot of effort, time and $$$ were spent trying to make a hockey arena out of a football stadium and in my opinion, they failed. I can not see myself attending another Frozen Four that is not at a hockey arena.

 

[Slasher7]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

Not to sound like a drunk, but the city/arena/NCAA would make a lot more money if they allowed beer to be served at these events. They leave countless money on the table by turning off the taps.

 

[Bill]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

Whoever designed the layout for the ice and the risers was definitely not a hockey person. Someone who has been to a few hockey games would know that players sometimes stand rather than sit. And that coaches stand behind the bench. And block the view. I don't know if any posters here were on the risers opposite the benches. The slope was just as low there, but they did not have the benches in their way so I'm wondering what the view was like from that side.

The risers opposite the benches were terrible. Aside from the low pitch itself, you had to contend with the penalty box and officials area. Basically we couldn't see anything happening on the far end of the ice from where our seats were (row 8, just inside the blue line), especially anything near the net. We left after a few minutes of game 1 and got seats up in the handicapped section at the top of the lower bowl. Whoever came up with the layout probably never saw a hockey game in their life, unless perhaps it was on TV.

 

[gscott13]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

i had a good time in detroit, but never want to see the frozen four in anything but an ice arena ever again... i had very good seats compared to most (16 rows back in section 104), but as has been mentioned by many, couldn't see the bottom of the net... it dulled the reaction for fans who could only react to the players and the goal light as opposed to reacting upon seeing the puck go in... 16 rows back and without the rise of a normal rink, it felt like i was 40 feet farther away... as has been noted by others, the shear size of the place muted the sounds and killed the buzz that normally fills the ff...

as for positives, the staff working the event were nothing but top notch... from the guys patting people down, to the ticket scanners, to the concessions staff, everyone was very friendly, very respectful, and very helpful... can't say enough good things about them...

as for the games, unfortunately, we only got to see about four periods of good hockey... and with a combined score of 20-2 for the three games, their was very little drama and anticipation. every game was well decided with 15 minutes left...

as for the pricing, it's a bit upsetting to know that i dropped $189 to gain the priority level only to have $40 seats sold that were not much worse than what many were assigned in the lottery...

for those wondering about next season at the X, 1 ticket plus the service charge is $201 (195+6)... add in a hotel and flights, etc and this is easily a $1000 per person event... i'm conflicted, because i have a very good priority number now and tend to get above average seats, but at the same time, its becoming harder to justify dropping that kind of cash on a weekend of hockey... right now i am leaning towards going to the HE tournament and watching the FF at home... good thing i have until june 1 to make up my mind

 

[Terrierbyassociation]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

Not to sound like a drunk, but the city/arena/NCAA would make a lot more money if they allowed beer to be served at these events. They leave countless money on the table by turning off the taps.

The NCAA only cares about money. Will sacrifice anything for more cash, doesn't care about morality at all.

Except with alcohol.

But yet serves alcohol in the suites.

YAY COMMON SENSE!

 

[gscott13]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

The NCAA only cares about money. Will sacrifice anything for more cash, doesn't care about morality at all.

Except with alcohol.

But yet serves alcohol in the suites.

YAY COMMON SENSE!

ncaa has no control over the suites... my old company had a box at the shawmut/bankboston/fleet/tdbanknorth/tdbank center-garden and we had a three year lease for the space, paying a few hundred thousand dollars a year. we in essence owned that property and could do whatever we wanted with it... if we wanted to have a company meeting in the box in the middle of august, we could... point is, they legally cannot prevent suite owners from having alcohol in the box because the arena had assigned tenancy to our company... the only way they could prevent it is if they specifically addressed it in the lease, and i am not sure they are/were thinking/worried about a few potential events a decade...

 

[Scottyp]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

Got back yesterday. Final Fours are always a fun experience just due to the people there. Been to several now and here are my ratings, from 1 - 10 with 10 being the best.

Facility: 2
- riser seats were awful, really almost obstructed view since pitch was so low.
- Sitting in risers, hard to make it to bathrooms and back during intermission, since they were so far away.
- Pitch in bowl seating was better but still too flat and too far away from rink.
- Locating bands where they were took them out of the action, which is definitely a big part of college hockey experience.
- Facility was so big, poor atmosphere as noise was soaked up.
- Couldn't understand announcer well in the risers, voice was muddled and geared towards those in bowl seats.
- Lack of scoreboards - Only had one or two stats, and had to turn head to see time.
- Bad ice. Although nobody really was talking about it, too many repairs and it was really slow. Puck kept slowing down so much, jumping over people's sticks, odd bounces off boards... Seeing the checked pattern of the cooling lines was really an indication of the quality of the ice.
- Good food, tons of choices.

Hotel/NCAA non-game events
- N/A as we didn't make it to them.

City: 10
- People went out of their way to welcome you, be friendly, etc.
- Bars for the most part were pretty fun and there was a choice of different types of venues. Cheli's for the partiers, Detroit Brewing club for those who like a bit of better beer with their hockey, etc.
- Can tell they are really struggling in Detroit. Encounter of the weekend was with a rather inebriated Michigan fan giving us a bit of a hard time. When I asked what time they played this weekend and how their football team was doing, he wanted to talk some smack and get into it, but just shook his head, smiled and thanked us for supporting the local economy. All in fun, and a good comeback.
- Good afterbar food with Greektown and Lafayette's Coney Dogs. Although not so sure I'd recommend the Coney Dogs to a group of six guys piling into a hotel room....

All in all a good time, but please NCAA, not in a football stadium ever again. Hopefully next time in Detroit is in the Red Wings new stadium....

 

[R Habs]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

Whoever designed the layout for the ice and the risers was definitely not a hockey person. Someone who has been to a few hockey games would know that players sometimes stand rather than sit. And that coaches stand behind the bench. And block the view. I don't know if any posters here were on the risers opposite the benches. The slope was just as low there, but they did not have the benches in their way so I'm wondering what the view was like from that side.

I was directly across from the player benches, RS02 Row 1, I couldn't see anything past center ice due to the penalty boxes being in the way, and my seats were LOWER than the ice surface, so it made it hard to see the puck if it came over to that side as well. While this was my first Frozen Four, I was disappointed in the seats, along with the condition of the glass, being a photo person, I have scratches and smears all over my pictures. The only thing I really had a clear view of, was both teams benches. I did however enjoy Detroit and caught the Tigers/Indians game on Saturday before the final and that was a blast.

 

[eddieras]

Re: How was the Frozen Four form people who went?

I've been going to the Frozen Four since 1993 and i'm part of a large group (15-20) of varying priority. I'm at 13 - the highest. in my opinion i look at the following key areas:

• the games themselves
• the venue (including my seat location)
• The immediate area around the arena
• The city
• Accommodations
• Social considerations

here's how i experienced Detroit -
games unfortunately were not very good - previous poster had it down stating a combined score of 20-2 pretty much sums it up.

the venue was fine - for football. Not hockey. i agree with most - please never again. No matter how you spin it you have 35K people in a 65K building. Any sound just dissipated. It seemed hard to sustain it. I sat behind the net, near the RIT folks and i still found the electricity lacking that of a hockey arena. Re the seating, as a 13 i thought (hoped) our seats would be in the only area with a decent view - the field risers. since there were no seats behind them to be blocked i assumed they would be pitched properly for hockey. obviously that was not the case. I was in RS2 row 11 and it was horrible. We moved after the 1st. People in our group with lower priority had what i guess were the best (relatively speaking) being in section 137 about row 37.

the immediate area was great - just what you look for.. bars, restaurants... bars....

city itself was fine as well.

we stayed at the Marriott Renaissance and loved it. Not a bad walk to Ford Field. A lot right in the facility - our Cruise ship as we called it. It had everything needed right there. Or a captive audience depending on your perspective!

Socially - it's always good! most of my memories comes from the "off ice" stuff - equally as from the on ice product.

what ticks me off, and touched on by many - is that non-hockey people had to be the decision makers here re seating. for high priorities to be in the RS was BS - at $189 no less.

i doubt very much i'd attend another at a non-hockey venue. Probably buy one tix and keep my priority going. Even if the 'adjust' the risers, i'd doubt i'd go. you just loose that ambiance that college hockey is know for...