Covfefe-19 The 12th Part: The Only Thing Worse Than This New Board Is TrumpVirus2020

[Deutsche Gopher Fan]

Remener when our local Rs here would freak out when you’d compare us to any other nation because it was so much harder here? Lol.
beyond pathetic. There should be no easier place to slow the spread than in wastelands like the dakotas. Think of the population density in korea.

this is just abject dereliction of duty. But I’m sure someone will come by and complain about newsom or CA.

 

[SJHovey]

We can compare states to other states- is that ok?

North Dakota with a population density if 9.7 people per square mile has 791 deaths.
vs.
Washington DC with a population density of 11,570 people per square mile has 665 deaths.

It's *slightly* better for S Dakota- population density of 11.3 people per square mile has 674 deaths.

Funny thing is when you look at population density- S Korea is around 1,300 people per square mile- which makes DC's death numbers pretty remarkable.

Hovey- Tell me again how nothing could be done?

If you're not going to pay attention in class, why should I waste my time repeating myself?

But, population density, I believe, does play a role in all of this. Honestly, people aren't going to act unless they think it affects them (see, present activities of 18-35 year olds), and people are really only going to react based upon either a fear of death or a fear that there won't be enough hospital beds. Until those two fears are instilled, people aren't going to feel that it affects them in any sort of meaningful way, and that's their choice.

You cited North Dakota's death totals, but that's not what caused the recent mask mandate action by the Governor. It's the fear of no hospital beds. If he can convince the citizens there are no hospital beds available, they'll act.

On a per capita basis the death total is high. But look at it another way.

There has been one death every 90 square miles in North Dakota. Obviously, there are more concentrated areas of death in places like Fargo or Bismarck, but all that means is that for about 98% of the area of North Dakota, you'd have to, on average, look 10, 12, maybe 15 miles in any direction to hear of someone who died, and in most cases it would be a person in a nursing home. For most of these people, 10, 12 or maybe 15 miles in any direction is most of their world. They might drive to Fargo a couple of times a year, or drive 60 miles to Minot to go to a Target store. But 360 days a year they're within 10 miles of their homes, and no one (or maybe one person) has died of Covid in that area.

So you can crow about the per capita death rate all you want, but that isn't going to push them to do anything.

 

[Kepler]

What really sucks about that is that this country actually needs a lot of basic educated people to do work. Plumbers, electricians, machinists, etc.

One thing that should help is that we should all stop looking down on people w/o an education, or at least change the message from "YOU MUST GO TO COLLEGE" to something else- as it backs people who can't or won't go into a corner where they feel inferior. Which means they will band together and lash out to people who are not part of their tribe.

If anything has separated the D party from their core blue collar worker, it's that "MUST GO TO COLLEGE" attitude that we all have.

The whole "college boy" think will never go away- that's been around for millennia. But at least we can not back them into a corner making them feel less- so they band together to lash out.

It used to be the reputation of countries like Germany, which had dual track post-secondary education, that you could take the training track for things like electrician, plumber, cook, auto repair and have just as high a salary and status as if you took the academic track.

In the US the only comparable situation is with professional post-graduate degrees (MD, JD) being the equal of academic post-graduate degrees (PhD) but that only applies to a thin slice of the population.

A really, really good electrician should make as much money, and have as much social clout, as a really, really good lawyer or doctor, and for the same reason: mediocre ones are legion and having a really good one can literally save your life.

I think the first step towards this would be to make the training track in the US absolutely free. Establish federal standards for accreditation that are genuine, to avoid fraud mills, and then make it maximally attractive for the smartest and hardest working kids who graduate high school and want to do those kinds of jobs to choose to train for them rather than go to college for a credential and crippling debt and become just another drone at BigLaw.

 

[dxmnkd316]

While I feel very bad for the workers they are clearly abusing, I see no reason to ever buy a tyson product ever again. They make tons of money, and very little of it goes to the people who actually do the work- between growing and taking them apart for us to consume.

Goes along with Smithfield- who had issues earlier in the pandemic, and eventually had to shut it's doors because they ran out of healthy workers.

On the other hand, Ford Motor Company closed down BEFORE they anyone got sick. And then carefully found ways to protect all workers to prevent spread. Last I've heard, there have been a handful of traced transmissions at Ford facilities, all of which were taken seriously right away. I know this as that's the company I work for.

It's POSSIBLE to make a work environment that keeps employees safe. So it's important to avoid the companies that refuse to do that. It's bad enough that many of these are predatory companies who use immigrant labor in a weaponized way, but it's inhuman to put people's lives at risk so that you can make money.

#boycott tyson

Wasn’t Tyson where MissT worked? And I thought the vast majority of employees treated her like shit. I can’t remember the last time I bought Tyson, pretty sure it was around the time MT quit.

smithfield is hard to get around when it comes to pork. Not much choice in MN. I think you basically get Smithfield, hormel, and one other I always forget.

Either way, I need to figure out how to buy my meat more locally. Costco just has such an incredible quality, going to be hard to get away from them.

 

[SJHovey]

Either way, I need to figure out how to buy my meat more locally. Costco just has such an incredible quality, going to be hard to get away from them.

Sometimes I think we get caught up in the ease of going to a Costco or grocery store to buy things like meat.

I've had mixed luck at Costco. Some of their meat has been very, very good, but a few times it's been almost inedible.

I think a good local butcher is priceless, and once you find one you like, you have to support him or her. I have one I go to and the steaks I get are so far superior to anything I've gotten at Costco or the local grocer, you can't even describe it. Obviously it costs more, but I've always thought it's worth it.

But you usually have to go out of your way and make a special trip. Most of these places are little holes in the wall in some location, but well worth a venture.

 

[Kepler]

Wasn’t Tyson where MissT worked? And I thought the vast majority of employees treated her like ****. I can’t remember the last time I bought Tyson, pretty sure it was around the time MT quit.

My wife has ex-in-laws in Arkansas from a prior marriage. Most of them are sketchy but a handful are really nice people. They all work at Tyson, it's basically a company town where they are.

The place is hell on earth for low wage workers. They are treated like fungible plantation labor, have zero rights, are forced to submit to insane indignities, and in general the whole place is run like the Republican id. Bullying, sexism, racism, insane levels of Christian fundy evangelism and of course only speak red talking points or have a nasty work "accident."

It's the kind of place your co-workers of 20 years will slice your tires if you get a pro-choice bumper sticker.

The only solution for factory prisons like that is to nationalize them and use a federal management workforce to clean them up and make them safe and good workplaces. The people who own them are psychopaths and the people in the management chain are either sh-t-eating Darryl Issas or traumatized ex-workers who finally bought in to stop the pain.

There's still slavery in the US. It's just corporate.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Denying something can be done appears to be the Right's mantra right now. Thank God every day we see doctors on real newscasts imploring people to do what must be done.

We need Congress to act. We need a third bill by now and we haven't even passed the second one yet. These businesses, people, and hospitals need help ASAP.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Sometimes I think we get caught up in the ease of going to a Costco or grocery store to buy things like meat.

I've had mixed luck at Costco. Some of their meat has been very, very good, but a few times it's been almost inedible.

I think a good local butcher is priceless, and once you find one you like, you have to support him or her. I have one I go to and the steaks I get are so far superior to anything I've gotten at Costco or the local grocer, you can't even describe it. Obviously it costs more, but I've always thought it's worth it.

But you usually have to go out of your way and make a special trip. Most of these places are little holes in the wall in some location, but well worth a venture.

I've tried a few around the area. I know a lot of the best are in the the exurbs, especially the NW. IN the metro, Von Hansen's can be good. I had another one down in Cottage Grove called Bonngard's. Good stuff, just a long drive. Looks like there are a few that are relatively close (Flicker, Angus, Borcherts, & Big Steer). Never been to any of them but maybe I'll have to.

We are going in with my in-laws to get a quarter cow from a family friend in Foley. Grass-fed, non-certified organic. INcredible price at around $2.50/lb avg. That's on par with ground beef for everything including steaks. We'll see what the quality is like. Wouldn't have an issue sticking with this in the future.

Thanks for the push.

 

[rufus]

If you're not going to pay attention in class, why should I waste my time repeating myself?

But, population density, I believe, does play a role in all of this. Honestly, people aren't going to act unless they think it affects them (see, present activities of 18-35 year olds)

Do months of federal and local officials telling 18-35 year olds that they have nothing to fear from this virus, and they should just continue their lives as normal play any part in that?

Or do they just act this way because..........reasons?

So you can crow about the per capita death rate all you want, but that isn't going to push them to do anything.

Because........people are ****ing stupid.

Or, its not their responsibility to look out for other people.

Or whatever reason the sociopaths are using today to justify their not giving a shit.

 

[Deutsche Gopher Fan]

Do months of federal and local officials telling 18-35 year olds that they have nothing to fear from this virus, and they should just continue their lives as normal play any part in that?

Or do they just act this way because..........reasons?

It tracks because conservatives don’t care who gets it or if they spread it

 

[ScoobyDoo]

It tracks because conservatives don’t care who gets it or if they spread it

This. When half of your population is checked out of logic you're going to be pushing huge boulders uphill and a lot of people are going to die. I heard we have 19% of the worlds death. That's government failure right there in a nutshell.

 

[Kepler]

The saddest words you will read today: "a former neurosurgeon."

 

[SJHovey]

I've tried a few around the area. I know a lot of the best are in the the exurbs, especially the NW. IN the metro, Von Hansen's can be good. I had another one down in Cottage Grove called Bonngard's. Good stuff, just a long drive. Looks like there are a few that are relatively close (Flicker, Angus, Borcherts, & Big Steer). Never been to any of them but maybe I'll have to.

We are going in with my in-laws to get a quarter cow from a family friend in Foley. Grass-fed, non-certified organic. INcredible price at around $2.50/lb avg. That's on par with ground beef for everything including steaks. We'll see what the quality is like. Wouldn't have an issue sticking with this in the future.

Thanks for the push.

Yeah, you can't beat going to a butcher and buying the side of beef or quarter. When the kids were home we did that all the time. With just my wife and I we've gotten away from it.

 

[SJHovey]

Do months of federal and local officials telling 18-35 year olds that they have nothing to fear from this virus, and they should just continue their lives as normal play any part in that?

Or do they just act this way because..........reasons?

I don't think it has anything to do with what people may or may not be telling them. They're doing it because they are 18-35. People that age are intensely social, they are looking to mate, looking to find a mate, looking to hang with friends. That's what I did. That's probably what you did. They aren't going to go home and just watch Netflix.

 

[SJHovey]

And that's resulted in a per POPULATION DENSITY death rate that is higher than DC by a 1000X and S Korea by 100x.

The same 18-35 year olds live in DC, and somehow they've managed to keep the spread down. Just like in S Korea.

The Dakotas are some of the most spread out places around, and you manage to kill more people than DC and S Korea has. Not corrected for ANYTHING- both Dakota states have killed more people than DC.

Stop pretending that the Dakota's citizens are so unique that they need some kind of social interaction more than DC.

What I'm reading is that people are not capable of doing the right thing, and the government needs to step in to save people's lives.

I don't think the 18-35 year olds in ND or SD are unique at all. I think the same problem is happening in other states too, hence Walz calling out the 18-35 year olds here in Minnesota the other day, as well as others like Cuomo in NY.

 

[Deutsche Gopher Fan]

And that's resulted in a per POPULATION DENSITY death rate that is higher than DC by a 1000X and S Korea by 100x.

The same 18-35 year olds live in DC, and somehow they've managed to keep the spread down. Just like in S Korea.

The Dakotas are some of the most spread out places around, and you manage to kill more people than DC and S Korea has. Not corrected for ANYTHING- both Dakota states have killed more people than DC.

Stop pretending that the Dakota's citizens are so unique that they need some kind of social interaction more than DC.

What I'm reading is that people are not capable of doing the right thing, and the government needs to step in to save people's lives.

They may be unique. Still haven’t seen pregnant women smoking and drinking outside of ND.

 

[Handyman]

Is "Honorable Mention" the same as "Receiving Votes?"

Yeah. I didnt think 'Others Receiving Votes" worked though. Americans take pride in being the best though so it would be great to be just outside the top ten!

 

[Kepler]

They may be unique. Still haven’t seen pregnant women smoking and drinking outside of ND.

You've never been to Revere.

 

[SJHovey]

Here is the thing about ND. It's an extremely young state. I don't know where we stand now, but I think we are very close to having one of the lowest median ages in the US. The percentage of our residents who are 65 and older is one of the smallest, if not the smallest in the US. Why? As soon as you retire, you move somewhere warm, like AZ, TX or FLA. It's that simple. It's miserable dealing with winters there.

So what does that mean. If you look, something like 93% of the deaths in ND, and probably most states, fall in that 65 and older category. Those are the vulnerable people. So, we have a bunch of young people in the state, who the disease isn't affecting, spreading it largely without consequence. But when if finds that tiny percent of residents who are in that vulnerable age, it's lethal.

 

[Handyman]

Well maybe if your moron Governor hadnt waited to act until it was too late you wouldn't be in this position. That is what leadership is. But no the Governors of the Dakotas talked about how people "know to do the right thing" and let it be the Wild West. (as did many of the other states that are now being screwed without lube and have small populations) Anyone with an IQ over 12 knows Americans never "do the right thing" until it suits them. One side turned the whole thing into a political game and now all people are losing. Their fake mask mandates now are like the Titanic avoiding further iceburgs as it is sinking.

Literally everyone here was saying we would be in this exact spot at almost this exact time. Did we all just get extraordinarily lucky? No, unlike a certain segment of the population we actually know how to do math and understand science. We err on the side of caution, they err on the side of "It doesnt matter what happens to you as long as it doesnt happen to me"!

For all the flack Walz got he actually tried to take control. Then he "re-opened" and the morons (i.e. the Republican Party) basically spent months demonizing him and telling people to do whatever the fcuk they like.