Cops 8: I Am Out Of Here...

[The Rube]

Re: Cops 8: I Am Out Of Here...

History has demonstrated that peaceful protests have accomplished absolutely nothing. If you think they are the answer you have a profound misunderstanding of the problem.

I think this time, it WILL change things. Friday, curfew enacted, but not enforced. The protesters marched, no issues. The rioters did their thing, and chaos.

Saturday, the protesters marched and rallied until curfew, and then went home. That proved a point. We're still gonna protest hardcore, but we will compromise, for the safety of the city. That is a HUGE message. Little happened last night, in comparison with the rest of the week. All the coward rioters stayed home.

I was more than impressed that THAT tactic worked, and the protesters listened to the organizers/community leaders, etc. I applaud the discipline that took to step back a little.

 

[Drew S.]

Re: Cops 8: I Am Out Of Here...

Random legal question...do towns, cities, and states have to negotiate a contract with whatever union represents the officers. Obviously our country needs unions more than ever, but it seems like with policing issues unions are a big part of the problem.

 

[J.D.]

History has demonstrated that peaceful protests have accomplished absolutely nothing. If you think they are the answer you have a profound misunderstanding of the problem.

Except I haven't stated they are THE answer.

 

[J.D.]

I’m not sure what coverage JD has been watching but in what I have seen there is a lot of concern about Covid. I’ve ever seen some protesters say this is so important they are completely fine risking their health.

It's not just about them. Do they have families they go home to? What's their job situation and who do they interact with?

 

[Rover]

History has demonstrated that peaceful protests have accomplished absolutely nothing. If you think they are the answer you have a profound misunderstanding of the problem.

An elitist white privileged attitude with a stunning lack of historical knowledge.

Birmingham bus boycott. Rosetta Parks. Selma. All instrumental in civil rights legislation. Funny how easily you want to ignore the courage of people like John Lewis for example.

 

[Rover]

Ummmm, who here is justifying rioting?

Fade, Scooby and Kep if memory serves. Will have to go back to the prior thread to find more.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Cops 8: I Am Out Of Here...

And I see no evidence that Kepler wants rioting. Kepler seems more of the "let them do what they think is right it isnt my place cause I am a white Bougie it wont affect my life anyways" type of guy. The problem with him is he has very little tact and gives zero phucks how he words things.

Kepler thinks it's racist for a white man to dictate to these people what to do, because he's never had to face what they face. That means he won't put white hats and black hats on protesters / rioters / looters, and that makes people who need white hats and black hats to pigeonhole a situation very upset.

Kepler's point is that our reaction cannot be legitimately analytical because we don't have the most important information: what it is like to be black and poor in America. That means any attempt we make to judge will be equivalent to Ben Shapiro whitesplaining why rap isn't music.

But this puts nice white liberals in the same category as, well, Ben Shapiro, and nice white liberals don't want to hear that. After all, they aren't racist, they just abhor violence. So riots and looting and arson are never justified even if that means another hundred years of the misery of... somebody else.

Kepler is on the side of the people who have gotten f-cked. Part of his understanding of white privilege is whites always set the rules on what is or is not permitted response. He has faith that the people who have been stabbed in the face for 400 years know better than he how to respond to being stabbed.

Kepler is telling whitey to shut up and since Kepler is white he's shutting up.

I will give more attention to phrasing, however, because you are right that that is distracting and loses people who otherwise would be allies.

 

[Handyman]

Re: Cops 8: I Am Out Of Here...

Kepler also likes to use a lot of words when a few will do

 

[Kepler]

Re: Cops 8: I Am Out Of Here...

Kepler also likes to use a lot of words when a few will do

It's a fair cop.

 

[jerphisch]

Re: Cops 8: I Am Out Of Here...

An elitist white privileged attitude with a stunning lack of historical knowledge.

Birmingham bus boycott. Rosetta Parks. Selma. All instrumental in civil rights legislation. Funny how easily you want to ignore the courage of people like John Lewis for example.

You act as if that solved the problem, yet here we still are. All that legislation has amounted to little change in over half a century because whites, law enforcement and the haves have failed to hold up their end of the bargain. If you haven't, I'd recommend watching Trevor Noah's latest video.

Edit: It should would be interesting to hear what MLK had to say after seeing decades pass with no further progress. Remind me again why he isn't sharing his thoughts?

 

[Handyman]

Re: Cops 8: I Am Out Of Here...

Well I mean the Supreme Court did tell us that racism is no longer a problem...so maybe Rover is right

 

[MissThundercat]

Re: Cops 8: I Am Out Of Here...

I will say as a queer, the Stonewall Riots helped the LGBT Community by getting the police off our backs.

Peaceful protests did nothing for us. There's a feeling in our community it's time for another Stonewall.

And as a queer, I vote. Fat lot of good that's done us.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Cops 8: I Am Out Of Here...

Violence is inefficient but when the alternative is intolerable it can have a higher ROI than non-violence.

Non-violence works when the oppressor's conscience can be appealed to. America is both so racist and classist that sometimes only violence shakes the tree of white complacency enough that they actually start listening to non-violent protesters to save themselves.

"You can get more with a kind word and a gun than with just a kind word."

 

[The Rube]

Re: Cops 8: I Am Out Of Here...

Violence is inefficient but when the alternative is intolerable it can have a higher ROI than non-violence.

Non-violence works when the oppressor's conscience can be appealed to. America is both so racist and classist that sometimes only violence shakes the tree of white complacency enough that they actually start listening to non-violent protesters to save themselves.

"You can get more with a kind word and a gun than with just a kind word."

You don't have to use the gun, though. Just have to show it. We saw that last night with the Guard and the curfew.

 

[J.D.]

Re: Cops 8: I Am Out Of Here...

I don't want to dictate how black people should act in these situations either but I also think there has to be a line somewhere. People can argue where the line is but I just can't get behind an "anything goes" type reasoning just because I don't know what it feels like to be a black person.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Cops 8: I Am Out Of Here...

You don't have to use the gun, though. Just have to show it. We saw that last night with the Guard and the curfew.

Yes. But (to extend this already tenuous metaphor, and turn it back in the correct direction) the oppressor has to realize that you are prepared to use it.

Violence does not spin out of control in a fairly just society because everybody has something to lose. Republican post-1980 America is "Devil take the hindmost," so the Poors and especially poor blacks have no f-cks to give. If you reduce people to absolute desperation violence becomes a rational choice.

Either you raise the poor or they will lower you.

 

[Rover]

You act as if that solved the problem, yet here we still are. All that legislation has amounted to little change in over half a century because whites, law enforcement and the haves have failed to hold up their end of the bargain. If you haven't, I'd recommend watching Trevor Noah's latest video.

Edit: It should would be interesting to hear what MLK had to say after seeing decades pass with no further progress. Remind me again why he isn't sharing his thoughts?

So...... going from being beaten trying to register to vote to a black president is no progress? Sheesh, tough crowd!

Step off your privileged white horse and acknowledge the gains achieved by heroes like King and Lewis and Evers even if it interferes with your preconceived notions.

 

[The Rube]

Re: Cops 8: I Am Out Of Here...

Yes. But (to extend this already tenuous metaphor, and turn it back in the correct direction) the oppressor has to realize that you are prepared to use it.

Violence does not spin out of control in a fairly just society because everybody has something to lose. Republican post-1980 America is "Devil take the hindmost," so the Poors and especially poor blacks have no f-cks to give. If you reduce people to absolute desperation violence becomes a rational choice.

Either you raise the poor or they will lower you.

And I truly believe that this week, the peaceful protests really will change things. This week was a little different with last night's happenings. The peaceful protesters said, "Hey, we'll work with you, just work with us." The protesters DEFINITELY sent a message by obeying the curfew. They hadn't done that before, to my recollection.

They took that first step. I hope authorities listen this time.

 

[jerphisch]

Re: Cops 8: I Am Out Of Here...

So...... going from being beaten trying to register to vote to a black president is no progress? Sheesh, tough crowd!

Step off your privileged white horse and acknowledge the gains achieved by heroes like King and Lewis and Evers even if it interferes with your preconceived notions.

So they should be happy with that progress and call it a day?

 

[Kepler]

Re: Cops 8: I Am Out Of Here...

One difference now as opposed to the late 60s / early 70s riots is there are actually POC in positions of authority now. It isn't rooms full of whites knitting their brows and discussing "the race problem."

The middle class, educated POC who overwhelmingly occupy those positions probably don't understand the class problems of America but they sure understand the racism. So hopefully when knuckledragger cons or Ivory Tower liberals start in with their bullsh-t they will take the mic away and say, "go boil water, we'll deal with this."