Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

[The Sicatoka]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

People hate the EPA and regulation. That's only going to gain him support.

The EPA is one of few groups that could have lower public approval ratings than Trump, Clinton, or Congress. < gulp > Scoob is right.

 

[alfablue]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

The EPA is one of few groups that could have lower public approval ratings than Trump, Clinton, or Congress. < gulp > Scoob is right.

But why?

They don't actually kill jobs, the rules generally add highly skilled jobs to meet the rules. If jobs were lost, well, you were doing it wrong.

 

[The Sicatoka]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

Listening to my in-laws makes me seriously worry about the election.

They don't like Trump. But they think Hillary is just as bad. They can't say why, but they just don't like her.

I used the term despicable yesterday. I was asked why. I answered:

Missing billing records that appear in the White House.
Landing under sniper fire.
No classified emails.
It was a video.

She's smarter than all of that, all of that; however, her default mode is, well, questionably truthful (some have used harsher terms, wait for it). Worse? The questionable truthfulness, that's fixable. Not fixing it (the lying) is stupid. "Yup, there was classified. It was a mistake. I've retrained and so has all my staff" is all it would've taken. The cover-up (or excuses) is always worse than the original problem.

At least Trump is just plain dumb.

A lying fool or an ignorant fool (or a fool of another sort).

The American public has seen this pattern for 24 years, or is it more like 40 to those who recognize her from Watergate committee staffer days. That continual swirl of "is there, isn't there, why doesn't she come clean" noise about Mrs. Clinton, much of it fabricated, some of it of her own doing, has worn some folks out. A lifelong Democrat I know has told me they won't be voting for her because her history says she'll create another avoidable mess of her own doing in office (and end up harming the Ds) and he's had enough. Anecdotal? Definitely. But it's out there.

Unfortunately, too many believe there is only one alternative.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

They don't actually kill jobs

Irrelevant. All that matters is how well the "campaign" has gone. The "campaign" waged against the EPA has been staggering, massive, and successful. You can put trickle down in the same box. It never ceases to amaze how well voodoo economics polls.

 

[The Sicatoka]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

But why?

They don't actually kill jobs, the rules generally add highly skilled jobs to meet the rules. If jobs were lost, well, you were doing it wrong.

Honestly, part of it is because the EPA is perceived as out of touch bureaucrats living in Washington and not "upstate" America. Part of it is some of their actions. I'm not a big fan of how they pulled a bait-and-switch on the CPP for some states. The WOTUS is another case where their rules are troubling.

 

[aparch]

But why?

They don't actually kill jobs, the rules generally add highly skilled jobs to meet the rules. If jobs were lost, well, you were doing it wrong.

Because the vocal minority tens of dozens that resists change is much louder than the millions who actually benefit from the EPA.


Kinda like the NPR comment section on their website. Millions of unique visitors a month, and their comments were dominated by a fraction of a percent of those readers.


Trump supporters = YouTube commenters.

 

[Handyman]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

The EPA is one of few groups that could have lower public approval ratings than Trump, Clinton, or Congress. < gulp > Scoob is right.

Then people are even dumber than Kepler gives them credit for...these are the same numbnuts that hate the FDA but then call for hangings when they get served spoiled meat and get sick. The uneducated are a virus much worse than Zika...

The WaPo article about Drumpf using charity money (possibly) illegally again should be the silver bullet but I get it gets zero play. Every day new evidence appears and no one seems to care. It is like high school sports stars who run lawless because the town would rather have a good team than do what is right only this is on a national scale.

Seriously, for all the "lies" we hear about with Clinton Drumpf beats them almost every day. People need to open their friggin eyes. Hate Clinton all you want but at this point it is either her or full blown insanity. 3rd party is just not a viable option either.

 

[The Sicatoka]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

But why?
They don't actually kill jobs, the rules generally add highly skilled jobs to meet the rules. If jobs were lost, well, you were doing it wrong.

Irrelevant. All that matters is how well the "campaign" has gone. The "campaign" waged against the EPA has been staggering, massive, and successful. You can put trickle down in the same box. It never ceases to amaze how well voodoo economics polls.

You're both expecting politics to make sense. Wrong brain. You should have your logical brain to run your life and your political brain to process this other stuff.

 

[aparch]

Honestly, part of it is because the EPA is perceived as out of touch bureaucrats living in Washington and not "upstate" America. Part of it is some of their actions. I'm not a big fan of how they pulled a bait-and-switch on the CPP for some states. The WOTUS is another case where their rules are troubling.

This, coupled with industries using the EPA as a lame excuse to close factories and mines that weren't *as* profitable as they once were to move to a location more profitable.

 

[Rover]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

That's funny because if I do word association with most Americans and I say EPA the response I would get is "Job Killer". Been a pretty fantastic campaign by the GOP. Hell, look at how they got elected to power in Michigan and destroyed Flint's water supply without even so much as an EPA going, you're doing what?

Have you actually done this word association or did you just pull that out of your arse?

 

[aparch]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

The biggest thing I've learned from this election cycle while reading USCHO is someone needs to buy me a Washington Post subscription because I hit the monthly limit *way* to quickly.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

You're both expecting politics to make sense. Wrong brain. You should have your logical brain to run your life and your political brain to process this other stuff.

No, not politics. Policy. There was a time when policy was done despite politics. Now, policy only gets done with politics. See the difference? Utter and complete stupidity is now setting the POLICY of this country. It is why, despite the fact that there is consensus a lot of the time, that nothing ever gets fixed or logical compromises are never struck. Given more time it will be over.

 

[The Sicatoka]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

The biggest thing I've learned from this election cycle while reading USCHO is someone needs to buy me a Washington Post subscription because I hit the monthly limit *way* to quickly.

Do the two-for-one and give the the second.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

This, coupled with industries using the EPA as a lame excuse to close factories and mines that weren't *as* profitable as they once were to move to a location more profitable.

Yet, they were profitable. So, why close them? Why bring environment killing affects elsewhere when they have a perfectly working mine in place? This is again another example where government has failed us.

 

[The Sicatoka]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

No, not politics. Policy. There was a time when policy was done despite politics.

So you see the conflict. Policy should be calmly logical --> logical brain. But now policy is overwrought by the politics --> political brain.

You're trying to do policy with the political brain. As I said .... wrong brain.

You're trying to do politics with the logical brain. Again ... wrong brain.

 

[Handyman]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

No, not politics. Policy. There was a time when policy was done despite politics. Now, policy only gets done with politics. See the difference? Utter and complete stupidity is now setting the POLICY of this country. It is why, despite the fact that there is consensus a lot of the time, that nothing ever gets fixed or logical compromises are never struck. Given more time it will be over.

This is the most true thing Scooby has said in quite some time.

 

[Handyman]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

The biggest thing I've learned from this election cycle while reading USCHO is someone needs to buy me a Washington Post subscription because I hit the monthly limit *way* to quickly.

Kinda sad that WaPo is the only paper giving a **** about it outside of a few editorials in the Times. The people are lazy and stupid so the media reacts in kind. At least a few TV people are trying...

 

[The Sicatoka]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

Yet, they were profitable. So, why close them? Why bring environment killing affects elsewhere when they have a perfectly working mine in place? This is again another example where government has failed us.

Yup. I know of a couple coal plants in Scoob's state that are or are slated for shutdown due to CPP.

But the company still needed the electricity for its consumers. What'd they do? They "greenfielded" a new power station in ND.

 

[aparch]

Have you actually done this word association or did you just pull that out of your arse?

Auto-answers thanks to Google:
Why the EPA
... Is unconstitutional
... Is bad
... Should be abolished

Why does the EPA
... Need guns
... Hate diesel
... Have a SWAT team

Why do the EPA
... Why do we need the EPA
... Why do conservatives hate the EPA
... Why do Republicans hate the EPA

 

[alfablue]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XVIII: I'm OK, You're Deplorable

Honestly, part of it is because the EPA is perceived as out of touch bureaucrats living in Washington and not "upstate" America. Part of it is some of their actions. I'm not a big fan of how they pulled a bait-and-switch on the CPP for some states. The WOTUS is another case where their rules are troubling.

All WOTUS does is define what water is covered by the clean water act. What's troubling about that? Farmers don't like it, but like any industry, they need to be responsible for the water that comes out of their industry. Tough.

And be a little more specific about the bait and switch for the clean plants. Not sure what you mean by that. Is it because coal is being left out in the cold? Or because it's regulating CO2?

BTW, EPA's regulation of CO2 was the result of them being sued because they were NOT regulating it. Courts were presented with evidence that excess CO2 was a bad thing, so they told the EPA to do something via the Clean Air Act. So they got control over it because someone demanded they get control of it. Not because they just wanted to.

As for the EPA- we are regulated by a group near us- not in Washington. We work together to come up with new regulations- as an industry.

If you want to have conflict with a group for the sake of conflict- go for it. But it's a whole lot easier to work with them.