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Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

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Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

dxmnkd316 said:
Thank god. Regulators block Chinese firm from buying Chicago stock exchange (no, not the mercantile)

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...e-sale-to-china-based-investors-idUSKCN1G000H
Click to expand...

yeah you can buy the CBOE if you want as its a publically listed company- in fact I would say its on sale now as far as its price goes.

I didn't hear of this until after the fact. I don't have anything against the Chinese, but I am glad that a major company didn't have their hands on our stock exchanges.

As for the overall markets, the "good news" spooked the market from the perspective of interest rate hikes. This tell me that the overall market is held only by those with real financial means (duh), and that this "recovery" has been to one part of the economy, meanwhile the other part of the economy has still suffered. Dalio covers this in a paper as well. It also tells me the Fed's implicit mandate is to keep market valuation high, although you'll never read that explicitly in the minutes. I don't think the fed should exist, but since its here to stay, I definitely don't think they should play the role of market manipulator either!
 
Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

Lovely, allowing the defaulting of student loans without any sort of repercussion whatsoever, seeing how the debt has zero collateral and could never be recovered: https://schiffgold.com/key-gold-news/change-federal-policy-pop-student-loan-bubble/

The only compromise I would ever consider towards this is if the person who took out the loan has paid the principle plus statutory interest from the time the degree was finished, whether that's based on the Federal Funds Rate, the state of residence, whatever it may be; heck I'd even hear an argument for zero interest. It's high time people start becoming responsible for the debts they incur.
 
Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

FlagDUDE08 said:
Lovely, allowing the defaulting of student loans without any sort of repercussion whatsoever, seeing how the debt has zero collateral and could never be recovered: https://schiffgold.com/key-gold-news/change-federal-policy-pop-student-loan-bubble/

The only compromise I would ever consider towards this is if the person who took out the loan has paid the principle plus statutory interest from the time the degree was finished, whether that's based on the Federal Funds Rate, the state of residence, whatever it may be; heck I'd even hear an argument for zero interest. It's high time people start becoming responsible for the debts they incur.
Click to expand...

I don't see why students are not afforded the same rights as over leveraged companies in violation of their debt covenants. Why should a company get a break when it goes bankrupt while a student who might need emergency medical care continue to incur debts which would for all practical purposes make him or her an indentured servant for their lifetime.

I agree that debts should be repaid - at personal, corporate and governmental levels. However, in the case of the last two, this often isn't the case. Debts in corporate america can be written off, restructured etc. In most cases, the banks/creditors don't want the company to liquidate, and would rather see them operate as a going concern. In the case of a few offshore drillers, they extended maturities, took a haircut, and diluted common stock by 98%.

Perhaps with students "discharging" their debt, there can be more involved process that (a) won't screw the creditors and (b) won't leave the borrower in debt for the rest of their lives.

As for governments...not great examples. Here is the debt on the feds balance sheets - this is the bad debt they removed from the financial system back in 09

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/FDHBFRBN

Here is the total debt

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/GFDEBTN

I am sure we can go on. But our own government/institutions aren't the best examples to follow
 
Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

Kepler said:
I don't think the GOP Congress is good for $10T.
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They are not. In fact, the government only has 1-2 months spending on hand at any given time. This is why these government shutdowns come at you like Paul Walker/ Vin Diesel from Fast and the Furious.

Uncle sam is able to make money by selling bonds every Thursday. Our biggest customer is China. We talk tough about china, but what do you think China does if we try to (for example) devalue our currency against the RMB? Whats to stop them from buying US treasuries?

Like it or not, it really is a global economy. And our governments ability to run on a month to month basis quite literally is in the hand of the world.
 
Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

unh_hockey said:
I don't see why students are not afforded the same rights as over leveraged companies in violation of their debt covenants. Why should a company get a break when it goes bankrupt while a student who might need emergency medical care continue to incur debts which would for all practical purposes make him or her an indentured servant for their lifetime.

I agree that debts should be repaid - at personal, corporate and governmental levels. However, in the case of the last two, this often isn't the case. Debts in corporate america can be written off, restructured etc. In most cases, the banks/creditors don't want the company to liquidate, and would rather see them operate as a going concern. In the case of a few offshore drillers, they extended maturities, took a haircut, and diluted common stock by 98%.

Perhaps with students "discharging" their debt, there can be more involved process that (a) won't screw the creditors and (b) won't leave the borrower in debt for the rest of their lives.

As for governments...not great examples. Here is the debt on the feds balance sheets - this is the bad debt they removed from the financial system back in 09

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/FDHBFRBN

Here is the total debt

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/GFDEBTN

I am sure we can go on. But our own government/institutions aren't the best examples to follow
Click to expand...

The biggest difference between student loan debt and the other forms of debt is, as was mentioned in my original statement, collateral. When a company goes bankrupt, all of its assets are forfeited and liquidated in order to attempt to recover what amount of debt can be recovered. Same thing with the personal loans, as a house or car is usually put up as collateral. Think of it as a sort of insurance. With an education loan, what collateral is there? None. Obviously there's refinancing and some creditors are OK with that if it means a better chance at recovering the loaned amount, and I'm fairly certain we're both in agreement with that being viable. The main issue here is the charge off.
 
Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

FlagDUDE08 said:
The biggest difference between student loan debt and the other forms of debt is, as was mentioned in my original statement, collateral. When a company goes bankrupt, all of its assets are forfeited and liquidated in order to attempt to recover what amount of debt can be recovered. Same thing with the personal loans, as a house or car is usually put up as collateral. Think of it as a sort of insurance. With an education loan, what collateral is there? None. Obviously there's refinancing and some creditors are OK with that if it means a better chance at recovering the loaned amount, and I'm fairly certain we're both in agreement with that being viable. The main issue here is the charge off.
Click to expand...

rotflmao
 
unh_hockey said:
They are not. In fact, the government only has 1-2 months spending on hand at any given time. This is why these government shutdowns come at you like Paul Walker/ Vin Diesel from Fast and the Furious.

Uncle sam is able to make money by selling bonds every Thursday. Our biggest customer is China. We talk tough about china, but what do you think China does if we try to (for example) devalue our currency against the RMB? Whats to stop them from buying US treasuries?

Like it or not, it really is a global economy. And our governments ability to run on a month to month basis quite literally is in the hand of the world.
Click to expand...

If you owe the bank 1000 dollars, the bank owns you.
If you owe the bank 10,000,000 dollars, you own the bank.

You think China is in any hurry to see their money go belly up?
 
Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

World reactions to TT (the Trump tariff) ranked by the importance of the partner:

#1 European Union: "We will not sit idly while our industry is hit with unfair measures that put thousands of European jobs at risk, The EU will react firmly and commensurately to defend our interests."
#2 China "urges the United States to show restraint in using protective trade measures, respect multilateral trade rules, and make a positive contribution to international trade order,"
#3 Canada: "Canada will take responsive measures to defend its trade interests and workers, its absolutely unacceptable."
#4 Mexico "made it clear that if included [in tariffs], Mexico will have no other option than to react."
#5 Japan Japan: "I don't think exports of steel and aluminum from Japan, which is a U.S. ally, damages U.S. national security in any way, and we would like to explain that to the U.S."
#6 Germany called on the EU to respond "with determination, its not at all acceptable,"
#10 Australia "The imposition of a tariff like this will do nothing other than distort trade and ultimately, we believe, will lead to a loss of jobs,"

This says nothing about the costs to producing businesses and consumers of increasing across the board prices of products using said materials.

Simply catastrophic policy.
 
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Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

5mn_Major said:
World reactions to TT (the Trump tariff) ranked by the importance of the partner:

#1 European Union: "We will not sit idly while our industry is hit with unfair measures that put thousands of European jobs at risk, The EU will react firmly and commensurately to defend our interests."
#2 China "urges the United States to show restraint in using protective trade measures, respect multilateral trade rules, and make a positive contribution to international trade order,"
#3 Canada: "Canada will take responsive measures to defend its trade interests and workers, its absolutely unacceptable."
#4 Mexico "made it clear that if included [in tariffs], Mexico will have no other option than to react."
#5 Japan Japan: "I don't think exports of steel and aluminum from Japan, which is a U.S. ally, damages U.S. national security in any way, and we would like to explain that to the U.S."
#6 Germany called on the EU to respond "with determination, its not at all acceptable,"
#10 Australia "The imposition of a tariff like this will do nothing other than distort trade and ultimately, we believe, will lead to a loss of jobs,"

This says nothing about the costs to producing businesses and consumers of increasing across the board prices of products using said materials.

Simply catastrophic policy.
Click to expand...

Yeah, but some steel worker in Pennsylvania is happy. Just like those three coal miners that got hired.
 
Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

Everyone digging their tax cut? Remember all the bonuses the media fell for?

And in any case the bonus hype was out of all proportion to the reality. So far, we’ve seen about $6 billion in bonuses versus more than $170 billion in stock buybacks, that is, handing money to wealthy stockholders. And money spent on buybacks is money that isn’t being invested in plants and equipment, the supposed point of the tax cut.

So the message to middle-class taxpayers is, if you think you were helped by the tax cut, think again. Donald Trump and his allies pretended to give you a gift, but they gave themselves and their wealthy patrons much bigger gifts — and they’re going to stick you with the bill. You’ve been scammed.
Click to expand...

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/01/...ed-republicans.html?smid=fb-nytimes&smtyp=cur
 
Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

More.

President Trump promised that his tax cut would encourage companies to invest in factories, workers and wages, setting off a spending spree that would reinvigorate the American economy.

Companies have announced plans for some of those investments. But so far, companies are using much of the money for something with a more narrow benefit: buying their own shares.
Click to expand...

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/26/...acks-corporate.html?smid=fb-nytimes&smtyp=cur
 
Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

Stock buybacks are a little more complicated than “giving money to the rich”
 
Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

dxmnkd316 said:
Stock buybacks are a little more complicated than “giving money to the rich”
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Sure. So are all those fancy derivatives that caused the collapse of '08. Lots of fancy things in Finance that benefit the few.
 
Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

Although a stock buy back can help a given company modestly...the primary motivation for stock buy backs is to significantly increase the value of top executives holdings in the company (read: money for the board). Not sure if that's a good pay off for an additional $1 trillion in debt.
 
Re: Business, Economics & Tax Policy 6.0: Nope, it only found woven strands

5mn_Major said:
Although a stock buy back can help a given company modestly...the primary motivation for stock buy backs is to significantly increase the value of top executives holdings in the company (read: money for the board). Not sure if that's a good pay off for an additional $1 trillion in debt.
Click to expand...

^^^^^^^^^
 
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