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Big 10 a scapegoat?
- Thread starter gophfan
- Start date
giwan
Really??!!
Re: Big 10 a scapegoat?
This scapegoat of the BT is overblown. If the idea is that they will only schedule certain other teams and none of the smaller ones then college hockey as a whole will suffer. I don't see a bunch of other schools going and starting hockey programs, so less schools is better for hockey? You could make that argument but there are not many schools playing hockey as it is now. The idea has to be increased exposure to raise all the boats not just a few.
This scapegoat of the BT is overblown. If the idea is that they will only schedule certain other teams and none of the smaller ones then college hockey as a whole will suffer. I don't see a bunch of other schools going and starting hockey programs, so less schools is better for hockey? You could make that argument but there are not many schools playing hockey as it is now. The idea has to be increased exposure to raise all the boats not just a few.
ExileOnDaytonStreet
Drunkard
Re: Big 10 a scapegoat?
People at small schools might not want to admit this sort of thing, but there are a LOT of reasons that people go to college hockey games. If the quality of the opposing team is your best way to lure people into paying the price of admission and coming to your arena, then you've got real problems. Certain opponents will draw more fans on account of rivalries and the expected quality of the game, sure, but how sad is it when you are DEPENDENT on that?
Perhaps I should phrase it this way: Is there some way that the B1G schools are ripping off smaller schools? Are they taking a larger share of conference tourney money? Are they paying a smaller percentage of their ticket revenue to visiting teams than everyone else? Are they otherwise impeding the smaller schools' abilitiy to make money? If the answer to that is "no", then how are the B1G schools at fault here?
Minnesota State was probably a bad choice to include in that list... in the WCHA, really only Tech and UAA will have anything to worry about in the coming years, and even that might be a stretch. It's primarily the troubled schools of the CCHA (BGSU, FSU, LSSU, etc.) that should be worried.
Is it Minnesota's fault that you get more butts in seats when the gophers come to town? Is it Wisconsin's fault that they might have a similar effect on your school or others?
People at small schools might not want to admit this sort of thing, but there are a LOT of reasons that people go to college hockey games. If the quality of the opposing team is your best way to lure people into paying the price of admission and coming to your arena, then you've got real problems. Certain opponents will draw more fans on account of rivalries and the expected quality of the game, sure, but how sad is it when you are DEPENDENT on that?
Perhaps I should phrase it this way: Is there some way that the B1G schools are ripping off smaller schools? Are they taking a larger share of conference tourney money? Are they paying a smaller percentage of their ticket revenue to visiting teams than everyone else? Are they otherwise impeding the smaller schools' abilitiy to make money? If the answer to that is "no", then how are the B1G schools at fault here?
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MavHockey14
New member
I estimated 1500 for the weekend..
I understand that it's not maybe as big an impact as one would think, I'm just bitter as hell.
MavHockey14
New member
Unfortunately it does hurt to some extent. It's embarassing to say, but our program has no coach, a growing number of people getting rid of season tickets due to the lack of coaching and care from our university's administration. This just adds to the struggles thus far. I will agree I have no worries of our program folding, and that we don't belong on that list.
yooper(UP) hockey
Banned
Re: Big 10 a scapegoat?
Yes i am worried about the small schools like LSSU, NMU, MTU, BGU, UAA, and UAF. The CCHA will lose four big schools in three years UNO, MSU, MICH, and OSU. The WCHA will lose only WIS and MIN. I think people in these small school will have to worry about scheduling when the Big 10 forms. The big boys are going to play good teams in the midwest ND, Miami, Denver, CC, UND, UMD, and St Cloud. Elite will play elite. The bottom dwellers will play bottom dwellers.
After next season will the UP ever see a big 10 school fly to Marquette, Soo and Hoton ever again? Reality tells me no. But maybe the Big 10 school would come to the Winter Carnival in Hoton. I hope the decision makers will support teams along the Sceney stretch.
Yes i am worried about the small schools like LSSU, NMU, MTU, BGU, UAA, and UAF. The CCHA will lose four big schools in three years UNO, MSU, MICH, and OSU. The WCHA will lose only WIS and MIN. I think people in these small school will have to worry about scheduling when the Big 10 forms. The big boys are going to play good teams in the midwest ND, Miami, Denver, CC, UND, UMD, and St Cloud. Elite will play elite. The bottom dwellers will play bottom dwellers.
After next season will the UP ever see a big 10 school fly to Marquette, Soo and Hoton ever again? Reality tells me no. But maybe the Big 10 school would come to the Winter Carnival in Hoton. I hope the decision makers will support teams along the Sceney stretch.
MavHockey14
New member
And also be less prepared for the tournament, with a lower strength of schedule.
Re: Big 10 a scapegoat?
gophfan is largely correct. These schools need to either invest in their programs or admit they don't care and kill them off. BTHC has nothing to do with their demise. For too long in college hockey schools have tried to get away with running a D-1 program on the cheap. For lots of reasons, those days are over. I'm not expecting these places to build a 15,000 seat arena, but some upgrades and a committment to winning instead of accepting losing seasons every year and not making any changes has to be part of these universities' plans.
I'm indifferent as to whether the national champion is a Michigan or a Bimidji State. Just support the program fully that you have.
Lastly, don't the Big 10 schools have to schedule a good deal of out of conference away games anyway? The point being I don't see why these schools wouldn't occasionally get to host a larger school unless these 6 teams plan on playing each other 5 times a year during the regular season.
gophfan is largely correct. These schools need to either invest in their programs or admit they don't care and kill them off. BTHC has nothing to do with their demise. For too long in college hockey schools have tried to get away with running a D-1 program on the cheap. For lots of reasons, those days are over. I'm not expecting these places to build a 15,000 seat arena, but some upgrades and a committment to winning instead of accepting losing seasons every year and not making any changes has to be part of these universities' plans.
I'm indifferent as to whether the national champion is a Michigan or a Bimidji State. Just support the program fully that you have.
Lastly, don't the Big 10 schools have to schedule a good deal of out of conference away games anyway? The point being I don't see why these schools wouldn't occasionally get to host a larger school unless these 6 teams plan on playing each other 5 times a year during the regular season.
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bronconick
Yep, still here
Re: Big 10 a scapegoat?
I'll agree with most of that, but BT schools aren't going to be scheduling many road games OOC. Maybe 2-4 out of 14. In most cases, it just doesn't make economic sense.
I'll agree with most of that, but BT schools aren't going to be scheduling many road games OOC. Maybe 2-4 out of 14. In most cases, it just doesn't make economic sense.
uaafanblog
AKA - "Drop The Puck"
Re: Big 10 a scapegoat?
This argument about loss of attendance was just as exaggerated when DU fans insisted how hard their program would be hit. A three year average of attendance at their rink showed they lost a maximum of 600 fans if the opponent wasn't UM or UW. Good to see the numbers I came up with regarding DU hold true for other schools as well.
This argument about loss of attendance was just as exaggerated when DU fans insisted how hard their program would be hit. A three year average of attendance at their rink showed they lost a maximum of 600 fans if the opponent wasn't UM or UW. Good to see the numbers I came up with regarding DU hold true for other schools as well.
SCSU Euro
New member
uaafanblog
AKA - "Drop The Puck"
Re: Big 10 a scapegoat?
I won't speak for Tech but as for UAA you couldn't be farther from the truth than you are with this statement.
giwan
Really??!!
Re: Big 10 a scapegoat?
So you are saying that there are 10-12 teams (or 5-6 if they play two games on the weekend) that are willing to play a BT school for example UMaa at Yost and will not want a return trip.
So you are saying that there are 10-12 teams (or 5-6 if they play two games on the weekend) that are willing to play a BT school for example UMaa at Yost and will not want a return trip.
Re: Big 10 a scapegoat?
That's exactly right. In a league, you have to play road games. But the B10 league will have fewer league road games, and B10 schools will just refuse to play most out-of-conference games in other school's barns. So small schools are going to lose more than just having these teams visit; they are likely to end up with fewer home games. This is just one of several ways the B10 league will end up using its clout to transfer existing revenues away from smaller schools that are already struggling.
That's exactly right. In a league, you have to play road games. But the B10 league will have fewer league road games, and B10 schools will just refuse to play most out-of-conference games in other school's barns. So small schools are going to lose more than just having these teams visit; they are likely to end up with fewer home games. This is just one of several ways the B10 league will end up using its clout to transfer existing revenues away from smaller schools that are already struggling.
Dirty
#BanBiddy
Re: Big 10 a scapegoat?
UND, and perhaps UAA due to the schedule exemption, are the only schools in the WCHA that will be able to get Minnesota and Wisconsin to come to their arena without having to do 2-for-1's or something. Michigan and Minnesota don't go on the road right now, why would that change?
UND, and perhaps UAA due to the schedule exemption, are the only schools in the WCHA that will be able to get Minnesota and Wisconsin to come to their arena without having to do 2-for-1's or something. Michigan and Minnesota don't go on the road right now, why would that change?
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Fighting Sioux 23
New member
Re: Big 10 a scapegoat?
The problem with looking at just the UM and UW games as far as lost attendance is that there is going to be a certain % of season ticket holders who only have tickets because of the UW/UM games. Also, there are people like me, who go to DU/CC games to watch games even when my team is not playing. A good example of this, is that I have probably seen 25-30 games at each of DU and CC since I moved to Colorado about 4 years ago. This is largely because I like watching WCHA hockey because my team is in that conference. I have seen 1 Air Force game since I have lived here. It has nothing to do with style of play, but everything to do with the fact that Air Force isn't in the WCHA. If they were, I would probably make it to a half dozen games/year. I know there are several UM/UW fans out here that are similar to me. IMO, that 600 number is probably more like 1000 when you factor in lost season ticket holders, and lost UM/UW fans to non-UM/UW games.
The problem with looking at just the UM and UW games as far as lost attendance is that there is going to be a certain % of season ticket holders who only have tickets because of the UW/UM games. Also, there are people like me, who go to DU/CC games to watch games even when my team is not playing. A good example of this, is that I have probably seen 25-30 games at each of DU and CC since I moved to Colorado about 4 years ago. This is largely because I like watching WCHA hockey because my team is in that conference. I have seen 1 Air Force game since I have lived here. It has nothing to do with style of play, but everything to do with the fact that Air Force isn't in the WCHA. If they were, I would probably make it to a half dozen games/year. I know there are several UM/UW fans out here that are similar to me. IMO, that 600 number is probably more like 1000 when you factor in lost season ticket holders, and lost UM/UW fans to non-UM/UW games.
aparch
Well-known member
Re: Big 10 a scapegoat?
As Dirty said, this is EXACTLY what will happen. As it is, NMU already has the following arrangement for Wisconsin: 1 weekend in Madtown, 1 weekend in a neutral site (Green Bay), 1 Badger Showdown appearance.
And, NMU has a non-conference game scheduled against NoDak. Terms of that trip? 1 weekend in Grand Forks. No return trips, no future dates.
If you're living in Marquette, how many times will you see Wisconsin an NoDak at the Berry Events Center? Zero.
It's already happening. The B1G blows it wide open.
As Dirty said, this is EXACTLY what will happen. As it is, NMU already has the following arrangement for Wisconsin: 1 weekend in Madtown, 1 weekend in a neutral site (Green Bay), 1 Badger Showdown appearance.
And, NMU has a non-conference game scheduled against NoDak. Terms of that trip? 1 weekend in Grand Forks. No return trips, no future dates.
If you're living in Marquette, how many times will you see Wisconsin an NoDak at the Berry Events Center? Zero.
It's already happening. The B1G blows it wide open.