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Average Men's Attendance
- Thread starter Sean Pickett
- Start date
Sean Pickett
2009 NCAA Champions
Re: Average Men's Attendance
I haven’t updated my men’s home attendance spreadsheet, but over on the BU thread there is currently a discussion about attendance at the Hockey East opening round games. I think it is a good idea to move the discussion into this thread, as I think it is more appropriate for such a discussion.
I have all Hockey East opening round and quarterfinal game attendance from 2002 up to today. I have also been compiling true home games game-by-game attendance of all Hockey East teams and currently have complete information back to the 2001-02 season for all teams and I am able to compare each team’s regular season average attendance with their playoff average attendance. As most of the discussion on the BU thread has been about the opening round I will focus on those games in this post.
This past weekend completed the fifth season Hockey East has had an opening round and the third in which it has been a best of three series. Most people forget Hockey East had an opening round 8 vs 9 game back in 1995, the first season Massachusetts was in the league. In that game Massachusetts upset Boston College before just 723 fans. When Hockey East brought back the opening round in 2014 it was single elimination and the three games had the best average attendance for the opening round, 3,841 per game. Since then the average attendance for the opening round games has decreased each year: 3,065 in 2015, 2,406 in 2016 and 2,266 this year.
However, looking deeper at the opening round shows a more complicated story. Since 2014 nine of the 12 teams in the league have hosted at least one opening round game/series. Both Northeastern and Vermont have hosted three times, Merrimack and Notre Dame have hosted twice, while Boston University, Connecticut, Maine, New Hampshire and Providence have hosted once each.
Of the 2 teams that have hosted 3 times we see different attendance patterns. For Northeastern, which has hosted for three consecutive seasons, attendance has been very poor. In 2015 they had a 2 game average of 1,673, a 40% (1,117) drop from their regular season average of 2,790. In 2016 they had a 2 game average of 1,261, a 52.1% (1,370) drop their regular season average of 2,630 and down 24.6% (412) from the playoff attendance the previous year. This year they had a 2 game average of 1,276, down 45.1% (1,049) from their regular season average, but up a tick from the playoff attendance last year.
For Vermont, which hosted in 2014 and 2015 before hosting again this year, attendance dipped, then improved. In 2014 Vermont hosted a single game which had an attendance of 2,823, a drop of 24% (892) from their regular season average of 3,715. In 2015 they had a 3 game average of 2,663, a drop of 33.2% (1,323), but only down 5.6% (160) from the playoff average the previous year. This year, after hosting no playoff games in 2016, Vermont’s 2 game average was 3,228, a drop of 12.4% (456) from their regular season average and an increase of 21.2% (565) from their playoff average of 2015 and an increase of 14.3% (405) from their playoff average of 2014.
Of the two which hosted twice Notre Dame had a sellout of 5,022 for the single elimination game in 2014, an increase of 4.5% (216) from their regular season average of 4,806. In 2015 they didn’t do as well, with a 3 game average of 3,884, down 15% (684) from their regular season average of 4,568. That average is only 1.6% (65) less than their 2016 2 game quarterfinal average of 3,949 and had a smaller drop from the regular season attendance (-15% (-684) vs -18.4% (-889)). And the average for the first two games of the 2015 opening round was 4,141, better than the 2016 quarterfinal round, before the poor attendance for the third game of the series (the lowest of any game that season) brought it down.
The other team to host twice, Merrimack, has seen their playoff attendance improve from 2016 to this year. In 2016 their 3 game average was 2,282, a drop of 3.8% (91) from their regular season average of 2,373. This year their 3 game average was 2,416, an increase of 4.3% (100) from their regular season average of 2,316.
Of the five teams to host an opening round just once only Boston University’s can be considered a complete disaster. Their 2016 2 game average was 1,835, a 60.8% (2,841) drop from their regular season average of 4,676. It was also their lowest playoff average since the 2002 quarterfinals hosted at Walter Brown Arena and they also had the lowest single playoff game attendance since then.
Connecticut, which also hosted in 2015, had what can be considered good attendance, with a 2 game average of 4,309. This was down -17.7% (930) from their regular season average of 5,238.
Maine, who hosted in 2014, had 3,678 for a single game. It was down 10.7% from their regular season average of 4,120. That was less than the 4,188 3 game average they had for the 2012 quarterfinals, but better than the 3,182 2 game average they had for the 2010 quarterfinals (and which was down 30.8% (1,389) from the 2009-10 regular season average of 4,510).
New Hampshire hosted in 2015 and had a 2 game average of 3,834. It was a drop of 26.5% (1,379) from their regular season average of 5,213. It was, however, better than their previous two quarterfinal series in 2014 and 2011. The previous year (2014) the 3 game quarterfinal average was 3,077, down 42.1% (2,235) from their regular season average of 5,312 and the 2011 2 game quarterfinal series average was 3,093, a drop of 48.7% (2,939) from their regular season average of 6,032. The 2015 opening round average was up 24.6% (757) over the 2014 quarterfinals and up 24% (741) over the 2011 quarterfinals.
Finally, Providence hosted an opening round series for the first time this year. The 2 game average attendance was 2,069, down 18.9% (483) from their regular season average of 2,552. It was also down 26.3% (740) from last year’s 2 game quarterfinal average of 2,809. It was better than their 2015 3 game quarterfinal average of 1,702 and on par with their 2014 2 game quarterfinal series average of 2,131 and their 2 game quarterfinal series average of 2,010.
Furthermore, the 2014 opening round 3 game average of 3,841 was better than the quarterfinal 11 game average of 3,421. It was also better than the quarterfinal averages back to 2007. The 2015 opening round 10 game average of 2,791 was again better than the quarterfinal 11 game average of 2,791 (the only quarterfinal average below 3,000 since 2002).
For complete regular season, playoff and overall attendance averages for every Hockey East team from 2001-to date you can view my Hockey East Playoff Attendance spreadsheet. It lists each team's regular season attendance average, their playoff average if they hosted a series and their overall season average. It also shows how much the playoff attendance decreased or, on occasion, increased from the regular season attendance. It also shows the overall league averages for each season.
Sean
I haven’t updated my men’s home attendance spreadsheet, but over on the BU thread there is currently a discussion about attendance at the Hockey East opening round games. I think it is a good idea to move the discussion into this thread, as I think it is more appropriate for such a discussion.
I have all Hockey East opening round and quarterfinal game attendance from 2002 up to today. I have also been compiling true home games game-by-game attendance of all Hockey East teams and currently have complete information back to the 2001-02 season for all teams and I am able to compare each team’s regular season average attendance with their playoff average attendance. As most of the discussion on the BU thread has been about the opening round I will focus on those games in this post.
This past weekend completed the fifth season Hockey East has had an opening round and the third in which it has been a best of three series. Most people forget Hockey East had an opening round 8 vs 9 game back in 1995, the first season Massachusetts was in the league. In that game Massachusetts upset Boston College before just 723 fans. When Hockey East brought back the opening round in 2014 it was single elimination and the three games had the best average attendance for the opening round, 3,841 per game. Since then the average attendance for the opening round games has decreased each year: 3,065 in 2015, 2,406 in 2016 and 2,266 this year.
However, looking deeper at the opening round shows a more complicated story. Since 2014 nine of the 12 teams in the league have hosted at least one opening round game/series. Both Northeastern and Vermont have hosted three times, Merrimack and Notre Dame have hosted twice, while Boston University, Connecticut, Maine, New Hampshire and Providence have hosted once each.
Of the 2 teams that have hosted 3 times we see different attendance patterns. For Northeastern, which has hosted for three consecutive seasons, attendance has been very poor. In 2015 they had a 2 game average of 1,673, a 40% (1,117) drop from their regular season average of 2,790. In 2016 they had a 2 game average of 1,261, a 52.1% (1,370) drop their regular season average of 2,630 and down 24.6% (412) from the playoff attendance the previous year. This year they had a 2 game average of 1,276, down 45.1% (1,049) from their regular season average, but up a tick from the playoff attendance last year.
For Vermont, which hosted in 2014 and 2015 before hosting again this year, attendance dipped, then improved. In 2014 Vermont hosted a single game which had an attendance of 2,823, a drop of 24% (892) from their regular season average of 3,715. In 2015 they had a 3 game average of 2,663, a drop of 33.2% (1,323), but only down 5.6% (160) from the playoff average the previous year. This year, after hosting no playoff games in 2016, Vermont’s 2 game average was 3,228, a drop of 12.4% (456) from their regular season average and an increase of 21.2% (565) from their playoff average of 2015 and an increase of 14.3% (405) from their playoff average of 2014.
Of the two which hosted twice Notre Dame had a sellout of 5,022 for the single elimination game in 2014, an increase of 4.5% (216) from their regular season average of 4,806. In 2015 they didn’t do as well, with a 3 game average of 3,884, down 15% (684) from their regular season average of 4,568. That average is only 1.6% (65) less than their 2016 2 game quarterfinal average of 3,949 and had a smaller drop from the regular season attendance (-15% (-684) vs -18.4% (-889)). And the average for the first two games of the 2015 opening round was 4,141, better than the 2016 quarterfinal round, before the poor attendance for the third game of the series (the lowest of any game that season) brought it down.
The other team to host twice, Merrimack, has seen their playoff attendance improve from 2016 to this year. In 2016 their 3 game average was 2,282, a drop of 3.8% (91) from their regular season average of 2,373. This year their 3 game average was 2,416, an increase of 4.3% (100) from their regular season average of 2,316.
Of the five teams to host an opening round just once only Boston University’s can be considered a complete disaster. Their 2016 2 game average was 1,835, a 60.8% (2,841) drop from their regular season average of 4,676. It was also their lowest playoff average since the 2002 quarterfinals hosted at Walter Brown Arena and they also had the lowest single playoff game attendance since then.
Connecticut, which also hosted in 2015, had what can be considered good attendance, with a 2 game average of 4,309. This was down -17.7% (930) from their regular season average of 5,238.
Maine, who hosted in 2014, had 3,678 for a single game. It was down 10.7% from their regular season average of 4,120. That was less than the 4,188 3 game average they had for the 2012 quarterfinals, but better than the 3,182 2 game average they had for the 2010 quarterfinals (and which was down 30.8% (1,389) from the 2009-10 regular season average of 4,510).
New Hampshire hosted in 2015 and had a 2 game average of 3,834. It was a drop of 26.5% (1,379) from their regular season average of 5,213. It was, however, better than their previous two quarterfinal series in 2014 and 2011. The previous year (2014) the 3 game quarterfinal average was 3,077, down 42.1% (2,235) from their regular season average of 5,312 and the 2011 2 game quarterfinal series average was 3,093, a drop of 48.7% (2,939) from their regular season average of 6,032. The 2015 opening round average was up 24.6% (757) over the 2014 quarterfinals and up 24% (741) over the 2011 quarterfinals.
Finally, Providence hosted an opening round series for the first time this year. The 2 game average attendance was 2,069, down 18.9% (483) from their regular season average of 2,552. It was also down 26.3% (740) from last year’s 2 game quarterfinal average of 2,809. It was better than their 2015 3 game quarterfinal average of 1,702 and on par with their 2014 2 game quarterfinal series average of 2,131 and their 2 game quarterfinal series average of 2,010.
Furthermore, the 2014 opening round 3 game average of 3,841 was better than the quarterfinal 11 game average of 3,421. It was also better than the quarterfinal averages back to 2007. The 2015 opening round 10 game average of 2,791 was again better than the quarterfinal 11 game average of 2,791 (the only quarterfinal average below 3,000 since 2002).
For complete regular season, playoff and overall attendance averages for every Hockey East team from 2001-to date you can view my Hockey East Playoff Attendance spreadsheet. It lists each team's regular season attendance average, their playoff average if they hosted a series and their overall season average. It also shows how much the playoff attendance decreased or, on occasion, increased from the regular season attendance. It also shows the overall league averages for each season.
Sean
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Sean Pickett
2009 NCAA Champions
Re: Average Men's Attendance
I would also be interested in hearing (reading) about playoff attendance issues for all of the leagues.
Sean
I would also be interested in hearing (reading) about playoff attendance issues for all of the leagues.
Sean
Split-N
All Hail
Re: Average Men's Attendance
First of all, thanks for putting the time and effort into gathering and preserving the numbers. Every college (and even pro) sports marketing staff ought to be taking a careful look at what the numbers are saying.
The timing of semester breaks certainly doesn't help playoff attendance but I think there are societal trends that go deeper than that. Here's an example: There is something of a kerfluffle going on here in WashDC stemming from what turned out to be an embarrassing attempt to produce a reality-type TV commercial. None other than Alex Ovechkin was sent to deliver a Papa John's pizza (blecch!) to a teenage girl who was baby sitting for a neighbor. When she opened the door, it was instantly clear that she had no idea who was handing her the pizza. When a field producer told her the delivery guy was the all-star forward of the Washington Caps, the girl replied blandly: "I don't do sports."
I'm far removed from my college days but I do try to keep up with cultural changes and get the clear impression that kids who are now coming of age tend to be somewhat indifferent (at best) to competitive sports. Lots of reasons including Netflix, networked gaming, the various flavors of social media, and the fact that, beyond those, college kids have a wealth of choices competing for their time, attention, and money that didn't exist even 10 years ago, especially in the urban areas.
Declining attendance is a real issue, and not just for HEA or even college hockey. It's hard not to notice rows of empty seats on televised games where there used to be none. And not just for hockey and not just at the college level. I think the marketing people have their work cut out for them going forward.
Wouldn't mind hearing viewpoints from folks who are in the "target demographic."
First of all, thanks for putting the time and effort into gathering and preserving the numbers. Every college (and even pro) sports marketing staff ought to be taking a careful look at what the numbers are saying.
The timing of semester breaks certainly doesn't help playoff attendance but I think there are societal trends that go deeper than that. Here's an example: There is something of a kerfluffle going on here in WashDC stemming from what turned out to be an embarrassing attempt to produce a reality-type TV commercial. None other than Alex Ovechkin was sent to deliver a Papa John's pizza (blecch!) to a teenage girl who was baby sitting for a neighbor. When she opened the door, it was instantly clear that she had no idea who was handing her the pizza. When a field producer told her the delivery guy was the all-star forward of the Washington Caps, the girl replied blandly: "I don't do sports."
I'm far removed from my college days but I do try to keep up with cultural changes and get the clear impression that kids who are now coming of age tend to be somewhat indifferent (at best) to competitive sports. Lots of reasons including Netflix, networked gaming, the various flavors of social media, and the fact that, beyond those, college kids have a wealth of choices competing for their time, attention, and money that didn't exist even 10 years ago, especially in the urban areas.
Declining attendance is a real issue, and not just for HEA or even college hockey. It's hard not to notice rows of empty seats on televised games where there used to be none. And not just for hockey and not just at the college level. I think the marketing people have their work cut out for them going forward.
Wouldn't mind hearing viewpoints from folks who are in the "target demographic."
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ericredaxe
Veteran
Re: Average Men's Attendance
I don't know how much it actually varies. Off of the top of my head, I can't remember a time when these playoff games did not coincide with spring break.
And I'm sure that has a very big impact. You start off with taking away 1,000 (a guess?) students from the attendance, and then more follow because there are people who get turned off by the empty arena so it spirals down.
I don't know how much it actually varies. Off of the top of my head, I can't remember a time when these playoff games did not coincide with spring break.
And I'm sure that has a very big impact. You start off with taking away 1,000 (a guess?) students from the attendance, and then more follow because there are people who get turned off by the empty arena so it spirals down.
beaverhockeyfan
Well-known member
Re: Average Men's Attendance
Here are the attendance numbers from the first round of the WCHA playoffs last weekend.
Mankato: 2887, 2984 (students started Spring Break)
Bemidji: 2401, 2767, 2107 (Spring Break 03/11-03/19)
Michigan Tech: 2377, 2392 (students started Spring Break)
Bowling Green: 1697, 2055 (students started Spring Break)
*** With the first Bemidji game, the USCHO boxscore shows 2904, collegehockeystats and BSU's website show 2401 ***
Average Attendance this season:
Mankato: 3862
Bemidji: 2803
Michigan Tech: 3049
Bowling Green: 2349
Here are the attendance numbers from the first round of the WCHA playoffs last weekend.
Mankato: 2887, 2984 (students started Spring Break)
Bemidji: 2401, 2767, 2107 (Spring Break 03/11-03/19)
Michigan Tech: 2377, 2392 (students started Spring Break)
Bowling Green: 1697, 2055 (students started Spring Break)
*** With the first Bemidji game, the USCHO boxscore shows 2904, collegehockeystats and BSU's website show 2401 ***
Average Attendance this season:
Mankato: 3862
Bemidji: 2803
Michigan Tech: 3049
Bowling Green: 2349
Sean Pickett
2009 NCAA Champions
Re: Average Men's Attendance
I'm working on my analysis of the Hockey East quarterfinals attendance, but in the meantime I am also interested in learning more about home postseason attendance in general, so I've created a poll to learn who attends and who doesn't attend.
Sean
I'm working on my analysis of the Hockey East quarterfinals attendance, but in the meantime I am also interested in learning more about home postseason attendance in general, so I've created a poll to learn who attends and who doesn't attend.
Sean
Re: Average Men's Attendance
Well, I'm certainly not in the "target demographic" (lol)....but I can tell you this. At least as it applies to myself, there would be almost a direct correlation between the sports I PLAYED and the ones I WATCHED. We played baseball EVERY DAY after school for probably ten years when I was a kid. We would imitate the players we saw on TV (Yaz adjusting his hat, Tiant's crazy pitching motion, etc.). Naturally, the things you "imprint" when you're young tend to stay with you most of your life. What I notice today is that kids don't play sports unless it's "organized." We would just go out in the yard and play. OK - you can say "well, there was nothing else to do," and that's sort of the point. There are so many other distractions today, plus the fact that parents feel that every SECOND of their kids time has to be planned. We didn't have control freaks for parents. We just did our own thing with our friends. They didn't check up on us every second. So what happens with these "organized" sports? The "good" players play and the rest of them sit around and watch. And most of these kids don't play ANY OTHER TIME except the "organized" time. We ALL played, no matter how good we were, because we weren't "competing" to see who was better. And we played every day. EVERYBODY played, and we had FUN. And we developed skills, which can only be honed through repetition. When you play once a week, unless you have natural ability, you don't really develop. So once your parent takes you out of the "organized" environment, you lose interest. With us, there was no pressure from parents, coaches, or anyone else. We played because we wanted to and we loved it! And then when we got junior high and high school, we weren't "burned out."
Also, my Dad TOOK me to games. I went to my first Red Sox game when I was six. I went to my first Bruins game when I was eight. Dropping your kid off at the soccer field isn't the same thing. It's kind of like, "OK, kid, get out of my hair for a couple of hours." Not the same as when you are indoctrinated into it and someone takes an interest in exposing you to it and teaching you.
It was a different time. I know people will say (and have said it already) that I can't "adjust" to today's "technology." Well, #1 that's not true because I am a software developer and that's all I do all day every day. What I can't adjust to is people's inability to separate themselves from it in every aspect of their lives. They live in a different reality, and I'm sorry, but to me it's not for the better.
Bottom line: Why would you go to a game that you never had any interest in? And how do you develop "interest?" You INVOLVE yourself in it by either having played or watched. A huge number of kids today don't do that. Heck, they hardly go outdoors. A friend of mine had a son who did nothing but sit in front of a video game console ALL DAY EVERY DAY. Scary...
Well, I'm certainly not in the "target demographic" (lol)....but I can tell you this. At least as it applies to myself, there would be almost a direct correlation between the sports I PLAYED and the ones I WATCHED. We played baseball EVERY DAY after school for probably ten years when I was a kid. We would imitate the players we saw on TV (Yaz adjusting his hat, Tiant's crazy pitching motion, etc.). Naturally, the things you "imprint" when you're young tend to stay with you most of your life. What I notice today is that kids don't play sports unless it's "organized." We would just go out in the yard and play. OK - you can say "well, there was nothing else to do," and that's sort of the point. There are so many other distractions today, plus the fact that parents feel that every SECOND of their kids time has to be planned. We didn't have control freaks for parents. We just did our own thing with our friends. They didn't check up on us every second. So what happens with these "organized" sports? The "good" players play and the rest of them sit around and watch. And most of these kids don't play ANY OTHER TIME except the "organized" time. We ALL played, no matter how good we were, because we weren't "competing" to see who was better. And we played every day. EVERYBODY played, and we had FUN. And we developed skills, which can only be honed through repetition. When you play once a week, unless you have natural ability, you don't really develop. So once your parent takes you out of the "organized" environment, you lose interest. With us, there was no pressure from parents, coaches, or anyone else. We played because we wanted to and we loved it! And then when we got junior high and high school, we weren't "burned out."
Also, my Dad TOOK me to games. I went to my first Red Sox game when I was six. I went to my first Bruins game when I was eight. Dropping your kid off at the soccer field isn't the same thing. It's kind of like, "OK, kid, get out of my hair for a couple of hours." Not the same as when you are indoctrinated into it and someone takes an interest in exposing you to it and teaching you.
It was a different time. I know people will say (and have said it already) that I can't "adjust" to today's "technology." Well, #1 that's not true because I am a software developer and that's all I do all day every day. What I can't adjust to is people's inability to separate themselves from it in every aspect of their lives. They live in a different reality, and I'm sorry, but to me it's not for the better.
Bottom line: Why would you go to a game that you never had any interest in? And how do you develop "interest?" You INVOLVE yourself in it by either having played or watched. A huge number of kids today don't do that. Heck, they hardly go outdoors. A friend of mine had a son who did nothing but sit in front of a video game console ALL DAY EVERY DAY. Scary...
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Happy
Registered User
Re: Average Men's Attendance
Trying not to be old, but I live across the street from a neighborhood with lots of kids. These kids never go outside. I have a lot of woods and nature out back literally 100s of acres of unfenced land, and I never see a kid back there any more. I used to see kids in the woods, and I used to see them at the local outside rink. I used to see kids walking and bikeing with a fishing pole, or a baseball bat. Not any more.
Trying not to be old, but I live across the street from a neighborhood with lots of kids. These kids never go outside. I have a lot of woods and nature out back literally 100s of acres of unfenced land, and I never see a kid back there any more. I used to see kids in the woods, and I used to see them at the local outside rink. I used to see kids walking and bikeing with a fishing pole, or a baseball bat. Not any more.
Sean Pickett
2009 NCAA Champions
Re: Average Men's Attendance
I agree that playing and/or watching sports is the best way to develop an interest and that today's kids usually are too distracted to do either. I also think there are fewer kids in many suburban neighborhoods, so it is hard to get enough together to play games.
Sean
I'm something of an exception, as although I did occasionally play outdoors with the other neighborhood kids, I rarely played any sports games, and I also preferred to stay indoors and read whenever I could. However, my father did take me and my sisters to a Red Sox game or two every year and he watched sports on TV, so I did tend to see many baseball, football, basketball and hockey games on TV. I'm not really sure why I ended up preferring hockey over the other sports, but I did.
I agree that playing and/or watching sports is the best way to develop an interest and that today's kids usually are too distracted to do either. I also think there are fewer kids in many suburban neighborhoods, so it is hard to get enough together to play games.
Sean
buoldtimer
The social ramble ain't restful
Re: Average Men's Attendance
I don't understand this thread.
How is "average man" defined? Height, weight, income, "package"?
Even if we agree upon a definition, how can we apply it to all of the men attending a college hockey game?
I have massimo rispetto for Sean, but this sounds like too daunting a task for anyone.
I don't understand this thread.
How is "average man" defined? Height, weight, income, "package"?
Even if we agree upon a definition, how can we apply it to all of the men attending a college hockey game?
I have massimo rispetto for Sean, but this sounds like too daunting a task for anyone.
Happy
Registered User
Re: Average Men's Attendance
I got into college hockey after going to my first game when I was 20. I was never really interested in hockey previous to that aside from watching a game very occasionally on TV. You don't have to be "indoctrinated" as a child and immersed every second of the day.
I got into college hockey after going to my first game when I was 20. I was never really interested in hockey previous to that aside from watching a game very occasionally on TV. You don't have to be "indoctrinated" as a child and immersed every second of the day.
Re: Average Men's Attendance
There are exceptions to every rule. In most cases, you tend to gravitate to the things you were exposed to early.
There are exceptions to every rule. In most cases, you tend to gravitate to the things you were exposed to early.
sterlippo1
Well-known member
Yuppie Scum
New member
Re: Average Men's Attendance
I'm not sure if the leagues are doing the best job of marketing themselves. HEA is leaps and bounds ahead of where they were in regards to social media, but I don't think that has quite paid dividends yet. And yes, college life is downright luxurious compared to even ten years ago. (Can I get a mulligan?)
I'm not sure if the leagues are doing the best job of marketing themselves. HEA is leaps and bounds ahead of where they were in regards to social media, but I don't think that has quite paid dividends yet. And yes, college life is downright luxurious compared to even ten years ago. (Can I get a mulligan?)