2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

[Foxton]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

Rep. Pres. 51 GOP Senate, GOP House. Bye Bye PPACA and there will be nothing the Dems can do to stop it.

Or Dem Pres. 51 Dem Senate, Dem House. 70% tax rate on incomes over $250,000.

Yes, I know Prince Harry said only for cabinet and lower level federal courts, but do you honestly think he's going to stop there?

Of course not, soon Obama will simply vote to become dictator and become the first nationalist socialist dictator in history!

 

[Priceless]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

Or Dem Pres. 51 Dem Senate, Dem House. 70% tax rate on incomes over $250,000.

I'm sorry, but who is advocating for that?

 

[joecct]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

I'm sorry, but who is advocating for that?

Nobody. But an unchecked majority can do anything it wants. With the fillibuster emasculated, now all you need is a majority to ram your agenda through (see PPACA).

With the fillibuster at least you had to make it somewhat pleasing to the minority, now - not so much.

 

[Foxton]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

Nobody. But an unchecked majority can do anything it wants. With the fillibuster emasculated, now all you need is a majority to ram your agenda through (see PPACA).

With the fillibuster at least you had to make it somewhat pleasing to the minority, now - not so much.

Not so interesting how it's suddenly become a majority free for all, instead of just limited removal of filibusters on whether or not to move to confirming judicial nominees. Also how that it's a negative. Usually people like you are all for majority rules, then again, that's only when it suits your needs.

Surely you should be against the blatant abuse of the filibuster that has been occurring since Obama took office if you care at all about these procedures.

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

Alabama Pardons 3 ‘Scottsboro Boys’ After 80 Years

There are many who believe Alabama, others haven't corrected the underlying process problems that led to this outcome.

Alabama senator: “The passage of time and doing nothing is no excuse. This hearing marks a significant milestone for these young men, their families and for our great state by officially recognizing and correcting a tremendous wrong.”

Funny...I see it as recognizing a tremendous wrong. Not correcting a tremendous wrong.

 

[Handyman]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

Nobody. But an unchecked majority can do anything it wants. With the fillibuster emasculated, now all you need is a majority to ram your agenda through (see PPACA).

With the fillibuster at least you had to make it somewhat pleasing to the minority, now - not so much.

The fillibuster was being abused by the minority, they blocked dozens of appointments and had little merit to do so. Their obstructionism is an actual threat, unlike you and the GOP's "OMG MAJORITY RULE IS A DICTATORSHIP!!11!!!" BS.

The GOP played chicken and lost, time for their sycophants to sack up and stop them or sit down and shut up. This is what you all wanted...

 

[goldy_331]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

The fillibuster was being abused by the minority, they blocked dozens of appointments and had little merit to do so. Their obstructionism is an actual threat, unlike you and the GOP's "OMG MAJORITY RULE IS A DICTATORSHIP!!11!!!" BS.

Which ones? The stats I saw on judicial appointments were 6 blocked and 215 approved. Is that a threat? To what?

 

[unofan]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

Which ones? The stats I saw on judicial appointments were 6 blocked and 215 approved. Is that a threat? To what?

Of the roughly 170 presidential appointments that have been filibustered in all of American history, just under half have occurred since President Obama took office. (82/168)

The GOP is claiming that President Obama is trying to "pack" the DC Circuit. Not by adding or creating new seats, mind you, but simply by having the gall to nominate people for 3 open seats. The GOP didn't filibuster them because they were unqualified, or because there was a scandal, but simply because they don't want Obama to be able to appoint anyone.

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

I'm still amazed that there aren't one or two more viable political parties, because that would solve many of the absurd issues were forced to endure with these clowns.

It's either a testament to the stupidity of our fellow countrymen or the pervasive influence that party donors have on politics.

 

[St. Clown]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

I'm still amazed that there aren't one or two more viable political parties, because that would solve many of the absurd issues were forced to endure with these clowns.

It's either a testament to the stupidity of our fellow countrymen or the pervasive influence that party donors have on politics.

Many of the election laws, mostly in the funding aspects, have been established by the two current main parties to protect themselves. Look at McCain-Feingold, if it was truly intended anything more than the Incumbant Protection Act, I'll eat my hat. Limiting outside political donations to a campaign while at the same time stating that the only way to get federal campaign money was for your party to have received at least 5% in the prior election cycle for any particular seat. All it did was to reinforce the squashing of third-party chances at getting more participation in the government.

 

[gounhwildcats]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

Not so interesting how it's suddenly become a majority free for all, instead of just limited removal of filibusters on whether or not to move to confirming judicial nominees. Also how that it's a negative. Usually people like you are all for majority rules, then again, that's only when it suits your needs.

Surely you should be against the blatant abuse of the filibuster that has been occurring since Obama took office if you care at all about these procedures.

In 2005 when the Senate Republicans were proposing this very same deal and Harry Reid, then Senator Barack Obama and Joe Biden were all protesting that getting rid of the filibuster for judicial nominees was " a black chapter in the history of the Senate. I hope we never, ever get to that again because I really do believe it will ruin our country." - Harry Reid

or were you saying:

"I pray God, when the Democrats take back control, we don’t do the kind of naked power grab that [the GOP] is doing now." - Joe Biden

did you feel that:

"If the majority chooses to end the filibuster, if they choose to change the rules and put an end to democratic debate then the fighting, the bitterness, and the gridlock will only get worse." - Senator Barack Obama

or that the senate should:

"We Must Protect ‘Free and Democratic Debate’" - Senator Barack Obama

I mean I'm just curious how you felt then, because you seem to think it's a great idea now that the Democrats have done what they hated then but seem to like now. Don't get me wrong, the Republicans are equally hypocritical for taking the opposite stance now that they are the one's being affected. Just curious if you have flip flopped as badly as the Democrats or were you siding with the Republicans in 2005?

 

[Foxton]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

I mean I'm just curious how you felt then, because you seem to think it's a great idea now that the Democrats have done what they hated then but seem to like now. Don't get me wrong, the Republicans are equally hypocritical for taking the opposite stance now that they are the one's being affected. Just curious if you have flip flopped as badly as the Democrats or were you siding with the Republicans in 2005?

If you find the two situations comparable in scope and intrusion on how the senate works then you've had your head shoved in the sand too long to be brought up to speed.

Thanks to McConnell, almost 1/3rd of the clotures in the history of the senate have come under him. Senate republicans aren't invoking the filibuster because they have actual qualms about the nominees but to slow down/stop anyone from getting through.

Visual aids
Through 2012
<img src=http://www.tcf.org/assets/images/blog_images/20121130-graph-why-we-need-filibuster-reform.png></src>

Just 2010
<img src=http://newsjunkiepost.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/Cloture-Invoked3Final.png></src>

 

[Handyman]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

In 2005 when the Senate Republicans were proposing this very same deal and Harry Reid, then Senator Barack Obama and Joe Biden were all protesting that getting rid of the filibuster for judicial nominees was " a black chapter in the history of the Senate. I hope we never, ever get to that again because I really do believe it will ruin our country." - Harry Reid

or were you saying:

"I pray God, when the Democrats take back control, we don’t do the kind of naked power grab that [the GOP] is doing now." - Joe Biden

did you feel that:

"If the majority chooses to end the filibuster, if they choose to change the rules and put an end to democratic debate then the fighting, the bitterness, and the gridlock will only get worse." - Senator Barack Obama

or that the senate should:

"We Must Protect ‘Free and Democratic Debate’" - Senator Barack Obama

I mean I'm just curious how you felt then, because you seem to think it's a great idea now that the Democrats have done what they hated then but seem to like now. Don't get me wrong, the Republicans are equally hypocritical for taking the opposite stance now that they are the one's being affected. Just curious if you have flip flopped as badly as the Democrats or were you siding with the Republicans in 2005?

Any party that abuses the power like this gets my hatred. The GOP has basically decided they would rather burn the system down than even do the basic work and vote on appointments. (remember they are fillibustering to block even the up and down votes) They have made a mockery of the system and if I was a conservative right now I would be at their door with tar and feathers ready to make them pay for how they have ****ed on all of us. (and the system itself)

If I thought they could be trusted to not throw a wedge in the door I would be ticked the Dems did this, but fact is the GOP has decided that nothing is better than something and as such this was the only way to get things done. We will see how the people feel about it come the next election. One thing is for sure, now Senate elections truly do have consequences which makes it actually important to vote.

 

[walrus]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

. One thing is for sure, now Senate elections truly do have consequences which makes it actually important to vote.

When was the last time an incumbent senator was voted out.?I'm sure its happened lately but not very often

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

Which ones? The stats I saw on judicial appointments were 6 blocked and 215 approved. Is that a threat? To what?

http://www.upworthy.com/they-did-it...ent-combined-82-times-to-obama-alone-6?c=ufb1

86 Times Presidential appts. have been filibustered from Washington to Bush II. 82 Times for Obama alone.

Yeah, there's a problem here.

 

[walrus]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

http://www.upworthy.com/they-did-it...ent-combined-82-times-to-obama-alone-6?c=ufb1

86 Times Presidential appts. have been filibustered from Washington to Bush II. 82 Times for Obama alone.

Yeah, there's a problem here.

Yeah with Obamas pinko appointees

 

[busterman62]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

So let me get all this straight. It's OK for one party to abuse their powers because the other party was or will be abusing theirs? Rules were set to prevent abuse of power but it's abusing your power if you change the rules to prevent the other party from abusing it's power. Clear as mud. The great part about the whole fiasco is that you can put a D or a R on either side of your argument. I'll take Hypocrisy for the win, Alex.

Why do we let these ******ebags stay in power? Simple, they set the rules to abuse their incumbency and we the sheeple are left with a choice of idiot on the right or moron on the left.

 

[burd]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

So let me get all this straight. It's OK for one party to abuse their powers because the other party was or will be abusing theirs? Rules were set to prevent abuse of power but it's abusing your power if you change the rules to prevent the other party from abusing it's power. Clear as mud. The great part about the whole fiasco is that you can put a D or a R on either side of your argument. I'll take Hypocrisy for the win, Alex.

Why do we let these ******ebags stay in power? Simple, they set the rules to abuse their incumbency and we the sheeple are left with a choice of idiot on the right or moron on the left.

We let them stay in power by being swayed by their sound-bite salesmanship intended to appeal to our political prejudices rather than focusing on policy issues themselves. How many people with strong views of ACA could explain it in any level of detail or the differences between it and the Massechusetts plan? How many of us watch news shows that devote more time to analyzing the political effect an issue will have on its supporters and opponents than they do analyzing the policy itself? It's like political game channel.

I think we as voters and consumers of political and economic information have abdicated our responsibility and have invited the most simplistic and slogan-driven advocacy to seize both the day and the office. I'm sure many have not, including some on this board, but I can say I have.

 

[joecct]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

+1

BTW, with 1,038 posts, does this mean that the admin can't/won't invoke cloture??

 

[Priceless]

Re: 2nd Term, Part VI: Burnin' down the House

+1

BTW, with 1,038 posts, does this mean that the admin can't/won't invoke cloture??

The thread automatically closing at 1000 posts stopped working with the update a few weeks ago. Rather than closing threads one at a time board will be closing several at once. This thread will be closed then. Until that happens, post away.