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117th Congress: DEMS IN DISARRAY!!!111!!

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psych said:
Right on cue! I don’t think infrastructure and reconciliation are dead yet. Drastically watered down? Absolutely.

Edit: All of this internal disagreement and time spent crafting the bill adds to the “Dems in Disarray” narrative that the MSM is pushing, which may end up coming true if we torpedo everything, while allowing Republicans to craft a compelling* messaging of their own for the midterms.

*compelling to the average mainstream voter, not hardcore partisans who read political articles daily like I’m guessing all of us do.
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I think they are because The Progressives won't lower the number and neither side wants to budge. Manchin and Sinema have nothing to gain they aren't going anywhere. Manchin literally "Rich-Splained" why they can't do Reconciliation from his yacht when he was confronted and Sinema ran away. The Progressives want all or nothing and Manchin and Sinema are there to say "ok, nothing" because they got their headlines when they negotiated the bipartisan deal.

Maybe "dead" isn't the right term, but it is on a ventilator and never got the vaccine so its days are numbered.
 
Handyman said:
I think they are because The Progressives won't lower the number and neither side wants to budge. Manchin and Sinema have nothing to gain they aren't going anywhere. Manchin literally "Rich-Splained" why they can't do Reconciliation from his yacht when he was confronted and Sinema ran away. The Progressives want all or nothing and Manchin and Sinema are there to say "ok, nothing" because they got their headlines when they negotiated the bipartisan deal.

Maybe "dead" isn't the right term, but it is on a ventilator and never got the vaccine so its days are numbered.
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Going from $6 trillion to $2 trillion is budging. No, no one thought $6 trillion was the real number, but I’ll admit I was fooled when Manchin/Sinema voted to advance the $3.5 reconciliation budget framework since I figured they’d land close to that number.
That Manchin has drawn his redline at $1.5 trillion, and decries Democrats proposing subsidizing coal workers’ pay, until they can transition into clean jobs, as “welfare”, means you’re right, we’re likely fucked. Giving Manchin and his state- his constituents- billions more wasn’t enough to move the needle on the overall number. I was wrong.
Yarmuth retiring as chair of one of the top 3-5 most powerful House committees is kind of a canary in the coal mine for Democrats’ chances come the midterms, and he’s doing it before the infrastructure and reconciliation bills are officially dead. At this point, even if they both pass, I think the narrative is firmly in GOP hands, and it’ll take some amazing messaging from Democrats to turn the tables.
 
The Sicatoka said:
You'd be happier if they switched and that thing called Mitch was majority leader again?
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Wouldn't make much difference. As usual the Dems oversight is a joke and their DOJ is a bigger joke. At least if Mitch were in charge we'd have a shot of getting over the hump in the midterms. Now the mindless idiots and the facebook algorithm will just continue to make everything close again.

I'll ask the easy question. It's simple to answer. Why isn't Trump in jail? He committed treason in office. There is no doubt about that. He's still doing it in plain sight.
 
psych said:
Going from $6 trillion to $2 trillion is budging. No, no one thought $6 trillion was the real number, but I’ll admit I was fooled when Manchin/Sinema voted to advance the $3.5 reconciliation budget framework since I figured they’d land close to that number.
That Manchin has drawn his redline at $1.5 trillion, and decries Democrats proposing subsidizing coal workers’ pay, until they can transition into clean jobs, as “welfare”, means you’re right, we’re likely fucked. Giving Manchin and his state- his constituents- billions more wasn’t enough to move the needle on the overall number. I was wrong.
Yarmuth retiring as chair of one of the top 3-5 most powerful House committees is kind of a canary in the coal mine for Democrats’ chances come the midterms, and he’s doing it before the infrastructure and reconciliation bills are officially dead. At this point, even if they both pass, I think the narrative is firmly in GOP hands, and it’ll take some amazing messaging from Democrats to turn the tables.
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Bernie wont lower from $3.5 (neither will the House Progs) and Manchin is a no at $3.5. Dropping from $6 isn't budging anymore than me saying I will accept less than $80k to be a community college teacher is budging.
 
dxmnkd316 said:
So you'd make it official then?
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Do you think I want to expel Manchin from the Senate or something? He isn't going anywhere and nothing the Dems do will hurt him or help him.

You want us to coddle him because he is a Blue Senator in a Red State. I think they should ignore him and tell him WV can pound sand because of the way he acts. He and Sinema are not crusaders, they are destroying the Democratic Party (and the Country) from within. I am not going to stand by and applaud that because they have Ds behind their name.

Your fear mongering doesn't hold water. He isn't flipping parties and he will live and die in the next election on his family name. He knows that which is why he doesn't even hide how bought and sold he is anymore.
 
Handyman said:
I think they should ignore him and tell him WV can pound sand because of the way he acts.
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As soon as you get 50 senators to the left of him, by all means. Right now you have 48. You don't have to like that, but that's reality as we sit here today.
 
What really needs to happen is a Constitutional amendment to reform the entire Senate, its raison d'etre, and introduce term limits, but I'm well aware that has a snowball's chance in Hell of ever happening.
 
Serious question. What do term limits actually buy?

im just not convinced they're going to provide the solutions people think they will. If anything, you've got new people more susceptible to corporate bribes.
 
dxmnkd316 said:
Serious question. What do term limits actually buy?

im just not convinced they're going to provide the solutions people think they will. If anything, you've got new people more susceptible to corporate bribes.
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Maybe. But at least it wouldn't always be the same people, and maybe it would be different companies bribing them.

Diversity is good, right?
 
dxmnkd316 said:
Serious question. What do term limits actually buy?

im just not convinced they're going to provide the solutions people think they will. If anything, you've got new people more susceptible to corporate bribes.
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They won't work either. Citizens United made things worse and without a complete overhaul via legislation it's pretty hopeless to be honest.
 
I don't think it's unreasonable to support a lifetime two-term limit for Senators - 12 years in one public office is plenty. I'd probably leave Reps as-is.
 
FadeToBlack&Gold said:
I don't think it's unreasonable to support a lifetime two-term limit for Senators - 12 years in one public office is plenty. I'd probably leave Reps as-is.
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May I amend that to 12 years total in Congress (House and Senate)? 16 years total (2 House terms + 2 Senate terms)?

Either way, I can agree with you on your base premise.
 
The Sicatoka said:
So the IRS is having banks report transactions of $600 or more.

In a couple months that'll be paying the monthly winter heat bill, or filling up the gas tank, or going to the grocery store. :-(

https://apnews.com/article/business...ation-prices-e80c0c24a6ec5ca1c977eccd6294d01b
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If you're not doing anything illegal, why are you worried? [/conservative talking point when discussing the PATRIOT Act]

Did you know that banks and financial institutions already report interest income greater than ten dollars to the IRS? Now you do.



The language, as it stands, says that the banks/financial institutions would track and submit to the IRS about total inflow AND outflow of every account with a balance of 600 or more at any point in the year, or with at least that much in transactions going through the account all year.

So... pretty much everyone. As it is, they already report to the IRS any transaction over $10k in an effort to combat money laundering.

The $600 amount seems flexible, with banks wanting a much higher number because, as one article quoted the Consumer Bankers Association: "The fact that raw data exists somewhere in a system does not mean it is easily compiled or produced." Potentially some banks would pass the cost of mining this data on to the customers.


I get there are terrible ideas, but if scaring the rich into paying their fair share helps, then why not. Set a high threshold and go from there. Is $600 right? It's probably way too low, but how about some compromise instead of just poo-pooing the idea right out of the gate?
 
The Sicatoka said:
May I amend that to 12 years total in Congress (House and Senate)? 16 years total (2 House terms + 2 Senate terms)?

Either way, I can agree with you on your base premise.
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I'd be fine with ~25 years in US Federal elected service (if elected position goes over the ~25 years, they can complete the term).

But, it's a 20 year hard ban on working for a lobbyist in Washington DC. I'd also venture to throw a ban for a few years on them working for *any* entity that has a contract with the US govt or is directly involved in the three branches of government.
 
dxmnkd316 said:
Serious question. What do term limits actually buy?
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They completely deliver the government into the hands of lobbyists and industries that write their own regulations.

"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong."
 
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