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UNH 2020 Off-Season Thread: That Rinky-Shrinky Thang And Other Lively Banter :D

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Scott

Quasi-Inactive
Despite their 15-15-4 record which ended a four-year streak of losing seasons, UNH hockey fails to make the Hockey East playoffs for the first time in 32 years....and yes, all because of an arbitrary rule change made by Hockey East. :mad:

Lots to chew on this off-ssason:

-- Who leaves early?? Obviously at least one. ;)

-- Will the new freshman class be THE ONE the pushes this program out of "treading water" mode?

-- And has anyone given any thought that what happens if this big rink-reduction project at the Whitt impacts the start of the 2020-21 season??
 
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Re: UNH 2020 Off-Season Thread: That Rinky-Shrinky Thang And Other Lively Banter :D

FWIW, I don’t think everyone should make the playoffs, and this team did not deserve to.
 
Re: UNH 2020 Off-Season Thread: That Rinky-Shrinky Thang And Other Lively Banter :D

That said, they played hard last night.
 
Re: UNH 2020 Off-Season Thread: That Rinky-Shrinky Thang And Other Lively Banter :D

That said, they played hard last night.

Yes, they did. It was actually quite an entertaining game to watch, and I'm glad that they chose to play with that intensity.

As for deserving a playoff bid - I have mixed feelings on this topic. I'm convinced that they can beat anyone in the league, but they shot themselves in the foot too many times, especially in key matchups.
 
Re: UNH 2020 Off-Season Thread: That Rinky-Shrinky Thang And Other Lively Banter :D

-- Who leaves early?? Obviously at least one. ;)

-- Will the new freshman class be THE ONE the pushes this program out of "treading water" mode?

Out
forwards
Liam Blackburn 34-5-13-18 // 81 career points
Justin Fregona 24-1-1-2 // 12 career points
defense
Anthony Wyse 33-1-6-7 // 18 career points
Max Gildon 34-7-22-29 led team
Matt Dawson 14-0-0-0 // 14 career points
backup goalie
Joe Lazzaro 1 game,


In
Carsen Richels -- HS player, potential NHL pick
Nick Carefelli - BCHL 42-17-23-40
Will Margel - BCHL - 30-6-17-23
................- USHL - 12-1-0-1
Cam Gendron- NAHL - 49-15-18-33
defense
Luke Reid- USHL - 45-2-17-19
Joe Nagle - NAHL - 50-3-21-24

other potential freshmen
Liam Devlin- USHL -36-6-2-8
Robert Cronin- USHL - 43-2-6-8
Timo Bakos- USHL -41-7-8-15
Connor Sweeney- BCHL - 58-2-12-14
Jack Ring - NAHL - 35-3-12-15
...............-NCDC - 14-3-4-7
Aidan Curran - BCHL - 11-1-4-5
....................-AJHL - 13-0-4-4
...................-NCDC- 22-4-21-25
Defense
Cade Penney- NAHL - 50-6-23-29
Nick Ardanaz- BCHL- 58-4-28-32 All-Rookie Team
Nikolai Jenson- USHL - 39-3-2-5
 
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Re: UNH 2020 Off-Season Thread: That Rinky-Shrinky Thang And Other Lively Banter :D

Yes, they did. It was actually quite an entertaining game to watch, and I'm glad that they chose to play with that intensity.

As for deserving a playoff bid - I have mixed feelings on this topic. I'm convinced that they can beat anyone in the league, but they shot themselves in the foot too many times, especially in key matchups.

They showed they were capable on many occasions this season. But could not take that into the games that ultimately cost them. (I know, repeating the obvious). This hurts more than I thought it would. Who cares if it would have been (or would it) a 'one and done' playoff experience? At least, we are still playing. WAH! I agree....I enjoyed watching a great hockey game last night. We did not get smoked. Held our own. Fuel for next season, or...? Only the shadow knows....Now watch the 8th seed tear it up.
 
Out
forwards
Liam Blackburn 34-5-13-18 // 81 career points
Justin Fregona 24-1-1-2 // 12 career points
defense
Anthony Wyse 33-1-6-7 // 18 career points
Max Gildon 34-7-22-29 led team
Matt Dawson 14-0-0-0 // 14 career points
backup goalie
Joe Lazzaro 1 game,


In
Carsen Richels -- HS player, potential NHL pick
Nick Carefelli - BCHL 42-17-23-40
Will Margel - BCHL - 30-6-17-23
................- USHL - 12-1-0-1
Cam Gendron- NAHL - 49-15-18-33
defense
Luke Reid- USHL - 45-2-17-19
Joe Nagle - NAHL - 50-3-21-24

other potential freshmen
Liam Devlin- USHL -36-6-2-8
Robert Cronin- USHL - 43-2-6-8
Timo Bakos- USHL -41-7-8-15
Connor Sweeney- BCHL - 58-2-12-14
Jack Ring - NAHL - 35-3-12-15
...............-NCDC - 14-3-4-7
Aidan Curran - BCHL - 11-1-4-5
....................-AJHL - 13-0-4-4
...................-NCDC- 22-4-21-25
Defense
Cade Penney- NAHL - 50-6-23-29
Nick Ardanaz- BCHL- 58-4-28-32 All-Rookie Team
Nikolai Jenson- USHL - 39-3-2-5

Facebook rumor has Crook leaving. THAT would be a problem.
 
Re: UNH 2020 Off-Season Thread: That Rinky-Shrinky Thang And Other Lively Banter :D

Facebook rumor has Crook leaving. THAT would be a problem.

Not as much if you had a forward in the pipeline with more than 7 goals playing junior hockey. All six 2001 forwards have six or fewer goals... let that sink in.
But his leaving would be a suprise - he still needs to grow, and isn't a top prospect.
 
Re: UNH 2020 Off-Season Thread: That Rinky-Shrinky Thang And Other Lively Banter :D

Facebook rumor has Crook leaving. THAT would be a problem.

hmmm heard that as well. I'd be surprised if this were true. I know there were scouts (as usual) at the game last night, Red Wings for one. Good lord...losing him would be a blow.
 
Re: UNH 2020 Off-Season Thread: That Rinky-Shrinky Thang And Other Lively Banter :D

Not as much if you had a forward in the pipeline with more than 7 goals playing junior hockey. All six 2001 forwards have six or fewer goals... let that sink in.
But his leaving would be a suprise - he still needs to grow, and isn't a top prospect.

You know? I wonder how many fans know/have a clue about their incoming recruits. I mean, if I didn't follow this board and have other connections for recruit info that I trust, I'd never know one way or the other. If they did know...would they clamor for 'better prospects' or ask 'why' we aren't landing top prospects? Things that keep you up at night...I mean, I doubt seriously the casual fan would have interest, or, care. Interesting.
 
Re: UNH 2020 Off-Season Thread: That Rinky-Shrinky Thang And Other Lively Banter :D

Well, its not just casual fans. My belief is that Umile has zero clue about recruiting, and by ignorance, developed a narcissitic belief (as you describe with fans) that players show up, and "great coaches" like him were what made the teams great. That narcissim translated to the decision making process for a successor, where recruiting was basically a negligible characteristic that they sought. So from 2015-18 they got a head coach who didn't care about recruiting, and a chief recruiter who didn't know about recruiting, leading to..... bad recruits. We can only hope that the hard lessons have been learned and the necessary changes are made.... whether that's possible at this point with a view of the program becoming settled in the community.

Edit: Not sure they are "lessons to be learned." I imagine its known, but finding the right fixes is critical. His focus on the rink makes me worry.

edit 2: the view that Coaches are more important than players leads to more defensive scheming and trying to win games 1-0 through schemes, because goals against is one thing that can be bettered by coaching systems. But it comes at the cost of goals. It takes a coach with some vision to see that there are two paths out to better goal differentials, and the ability to increase scoring also has benefits of getting better players, rather than the "we need to get bigger and stronger" approach of clogging the game.

to quote myself from February 2017, albeit in the context of being somewhat excited about a recruit that failed (Marek Wazny), my thoughts remain the same about how Souza picked kids with few options, and by and large, those players were who we thought they were:

With the caveat that he is not quite a blue chipper (23rd forward by Jeff above, and in the second tier “A-/B+” Group by USHR), I think he qualifies as the first real positive recruiting move by Souza. To now, his recruits have been kids where the competition has been weak or non-existent. Bahn literally had no offers, Crookshank had no offers, and was just getting to the point where Denver might offer. Verrier was a fringe DI kid, perhaps starting to draw some ECAC offers, Miller was a second or third tier Alberta kid. Corson Green is a raw kid who probably had more interest from Major Junior than from colleges when UNH popped him. McAdams had some interest from PC and BU, but it is unclear the price range of their offers and how much of priority he was -- I suspect those top teams probably were pretty low on the scholarship front.


So, with that backdrop, and importantly, without any info yet about Wazny's other schools, I suspect he probably was a solid "second tier" (not BU, BC or PC or top two ECAC -Q, Harvard- type of recruit) kid. Given that we have seemed to be losing kids who might fall into that profile (including to Maine, U.Mass, Northeastern, etc.), this is the first recruit with some options to affirmatively select UNH. A lot of my angst was the product of the fact that literally no recruit with good options was picking us. Marek changes this. Let's hope he is not an outlier. I have come to accept that we have gone past the point of an exciting coach yielding a huge recruiting surge. We are at the point (if you accept that Souza is the successor) that any upgrades will be marginal, slow and incremental. In that framework, this is a small incremental step, the first one in the right direction.

While the defensemen recruits are at least known (and even wished for by me -- Ardanaz), so that they have become decent, the forwards remain mid-to-low tier kids on the recruiting scale.
 
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Re: UNH 2020 Off-Season Thread: That Rinky-Shrinky Thang And Other Lively Banter :D

Well, its not just casual fans. My belief is that Umile has zero clue about recruiting, and by ignorance, developed a narcissitic belief (as you describe with fans) that players show up, and "great coaches" like him were what made the teams great. That narcissim translated to the decision making process for a successor, where recruiting was basically a negligible characteristic that they sought. So from 2015-18 they got a head coach who didn't care about recruiting, and a chief recruiter who didn't know about recruiting, leading to..... bad recruits. We can only hope that the hard lessons have been learned and the necessary changes are made.... whether that's possible at this point with a view of the program becoming settled in the community.

Edit: Not sure they are "lessons to be learned." I imagine its known, but finding the right fixes is critical. His focus on the rink makes me worry.

edit 2: the view that Coaches are more important than players leads to more defensive scheming and trying to win games 1-0 through schemes, because goals against is one thing that can be bettered by coaching systems. But it comes at the cost of goals. It takes a coach with some vision to see that there are two paths out to better goal differentials, and the ability to increase scoring also has benefits of getting better players, rather than the "we need to get bigger and stronger" approach of clogging the game.

Like I said...if you listen to last night's post game presser, he (Souza) takes it on himself, what he 'could have said that would have made a difference' in the season. It's the product on the ice; the 'groceries' as you guys like to say, that are the ultimate difference. Sure, coaching is huge but well, you can only do so much with what you have to work with. And I hate to impugn any UNH players, past, or present, with that statement. In fact, to this observer, I think he got a lot out of those players. You don't win big games by a fluke, and the 'Cats showed they could do that, more than a few teams in the most recent past. (which is the hard part of not making the playoffs but...)

It's a fact of life...and, sports. You either have the horses or you don't. Some will develop into horses, but it helps to have them in the barn at the get go...that much, I have learned in these past 7 seasons. Like I've said too, I'm looking forward to what's coming in. I'm disappointed for those who did not, (Stutzle esp but I get it). The size of the rink is the least of our problems. Anyway...sorry to have clogged up the airways this morning. guess I better move it along.
 
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Re: UNH 2020 Off-Season Thread: That Rinky-Shrinky Thang And Other Lively Banter :D

They showed they were capable on many occasions this season. But could not take that into the games that ultimately cost them. (I know, repeating the obvious). This hurts more than I thought it would. Who cares if it would have been (or would it) a 'one and done' playoff experience? At least, we are still playing. WAH! I agree....I enjoyed watching a great hockey game last night. We did not get smoked. Held our own. Fuel for next season, or...? Only the shadow knows....Now watch the 8th seed tear it up.

While I am sorry for your pain, this is precisely the reason that some teams SHOULD be eliminated from the playoffs at the end of the regular season. Allowing all teams into the postseason tourney renders much of the regular season meaningless. Sure there are byes,and home ice, but no real consequences for an underachieving program. If anything the everybody gets a medal mindset masks deficiencies. If a program doesn't take a critical look at itself and is not realistic about realities its is only deceiving itself. UNH finished in the top eight only one time in the past five seasons, yet until this year always managed to participate in the postseason. Its one thing to miss the playoffs one time in 32 tries, but its another thing to miss four times in five seasons. Perhaps if they had, it would have created a sense of urgency that seems lacking and the program would be better off for it.
 
Re: UNH 2020 Off-Season Thread: That Rinky-Shrinky Thang And Other Lively Banter :D

While I am sorry for your pain, this is precisely the reason that some teams SHOULD be eliminated from the playoffs at the end of the regular season. Allowing all teams into the postseason tourney renders much of the regular season meaningless. Sure there are byes,and home ice, but no real consequences for an underachieving program. If anything the everybody gets a medal mindset masks deficiencies. If a program doesn't take a critical look at itself and is not realistic about realities its is only deceiving itself. UNH finished in the top eight only one time in the past five seasons, yet until this year always managed to participate in the postseason. Its one thing to miss the playoffs one time in 32 tries, but its another thing to miss four times in five seasons. Perhaps if they had, it would have created a sense of urgency that seems lacking and the program would be better off for it.

Well I agree totally. Let's hope this creates that sense of urgency...just being selfish I guess!
 
While I am sorry for your pain, this is precisely the reason that some teams SHOULD be eliminated from the playoffs at the end of the regular season. Allowing all teams into the postseason tourney renders much of the regular season meaningless. Sure there are byes,and home ice, but no real consequences for an underachieving program. If anything the everybody gets a medal mindset masks deficiencies. If a program doesn't take a critical look at itself and is not realistic about realities its is only deceiving itself. UNH finished in the top eight only one time in the past five seasons, yet until this year always managed to participate in the postseason. Its one thing to miss the playoffs one time in 32 tries, but its another thing to miss four times in five seasons. Perhaps if they had, it would have created a sense of urgency that seems lacking and the program would be better off for it.

Exactly, getting into the playoffs mean fork all when everyone makes it. So UNH, Souza, et al, how do you react? How do you get better?
 
Re: UNH 2020 Off-Season Thread: That Rinky-Shrinky Thang And Other Lively Banter :D

Well, its not just casual fans. My belief is that Umile has zero clue about recruiting, and by ignorance, developed a narcissitic belief (as you describe with fans) that players show up, and "great coaches" like him were what made the teams great.

It is FAR more common than people would ever wish to admit, for NCAA coaches to view recruiting as a nuisance and, at best, a necessary evil. I cringe every time I here some semblance of the, "I'd rather win with hard-working two stars than lazy five stars" argument. This makes the assumption that talented kids can't also be hard workers - but in reality its just BS often spouted by coaches to lazy to make the recruiting effort or lacking in the sales ability to actually land top players. Umile was hardly unusual in his indifference and Souza is hardly unusual in his struggles...

As far as recruiting goes - even your worst college coach may be a likeable and charismatic personality. Unfortunately, recruiting is relative and the only thing that matters is how your likeability, passion and sales ability stack up against the recruiting competition NOT the general public.

I agree with you that recruiting has been a disaster. Souza has simply not gotten the job done with any level of consistency the position requires. I don't buy that he was hamstrung in his first three years - he was the head coach in waiting, recruiting players who would never play for his predecessor and had plenty of space available to bring in talent. He either failed to attract the necessary talent (on his own) or didn't sense the urgency to upgrade the recruiting coffers. He simply hasn't shown the ability to acquire the players needed to move UNH back towards the top of Hockey East...

Outside of Luke Reid (another late decommit) who in this most recent flurry of activity is a true difference maker, capable of lifting the talent around him and, as a result, the program to old heights? To me, the recent activity seems more like grabbing a bunch of guys to increase your odds that one of them suddenly turns out to be a GUY...

There are certainly lessons to be learned in recruiting, but I'm not sure how much a tiger can change his stripes. One either embraces and enjoys the commitment and the challenge or does not. One either has the passion, communication skills and intensity to impress upon top recruits or they don't. If there is a lesson for Souza to learn, IMO, it is recognizing his inability to front a recruiting process and making the hard decision to find someone who can. Who knows if he's willing to do that at this point - egos in coaching are VERY real. Even if they wanted to make this move, I'm sure they would loudly lament their ability to adequately pay the going rate for a top recruiter in today's game - which is why you don't throw away money on frivolous avoidances of accountability like rink size...

Neither NU or UMass 'got it going' right away in terms of wins and losses - but both heavily announced their presence on the recruiting trail almost immediately. Carvel completely changed the perception around UMass and its future, kept Makar in the pipeline and went to work adding talent way beyond what anyone thought UMass was capable of attracting. Madigan, as you noted, hired Keefe and that immediately translated into Roy, Aston-Reese, Sikura, Szmatula and the Stevens brothers...

If Souza hasn't been able to make that shift in culture, perception and energy in five seasons, than I see no reason why he would be capable of doing it now. It's a very real possibility that they've missed their window...

---

As for this season, it was the best talent and depth of roster that UNH has had in a long time - thanks to some key Borek holdovers, and the handful of above average talent Souza has actually landed. They wasted it completely. One of the easier things to do in coaching is take a bad team to mediocre. Its exponentially harder to make any further progress. Its the business 80-20 rule, where twenty percent of the effort, ability and production can push you toward the mean while the smaller steps to actual success take SO MUCH more. I have a hard time seeing legitimate progress or reason for optimism and I wonder if those who do are more hopeful than convinced...

Next year, with Reid and (likely) Ardanaz being FR - I think we will realize what we had in Gildon and Wyse this season. Maass will go from one of three top D to THE guy and UNH will need BIG jumps from their other three regulars, who will be thrust into the limelight that comes with increased responsibility and role next season. If they don't make those jumps the defense will take a step back. Simply not being Gildon will no longer cover up the flaws/mistakes in their games.

UNH's scoring will take a massive hit if Crookshank leaves. He is the one true impact forward they have - capable of making plays on his own and creating offense out of any situation. The rest of the offensive talent would be better suited as secondary top-six pieces, much like Souza himself (a hardworking, solidly-skilled player who capable of a big year if skating with players like Krog/Haydar/Kelleher/Poturalski - but only capable of so much impact when carrying a line). With no Gildon and no Crookshank, its hard to imagine UNH's production getting any better. They NEED Angus back, but who could blame him if he thought he'd better develop elsewhere...

There are other 'key' players at UNH that I have concerns about wanting to return. The cat is out of the bag with BVR. There is one school that has had a lot of success with transfer's at a key position and suddenly has a connection to a UNH student-athlete. I'm sure a lot of others might look at one UNH upperclassman, in particular, and envision skating him alongside two of their better forwards and offering a lot of production.

At first glance, I'd predict UNH is back under .500 next season - and they're at a major crossroads where things could actually get a lot worse if they don't take significant steps forward in critical areas like recruiting. Next year will be year six of Souza, not two or three - at least in my eyes - if UNH cares about its hockey program than significant progress needs to be made and perception around the program and on the trail need to shift dramatically. If that doesn't happen, hard decisions need to be made. This is not your standard give the coach 4-5 years scenario, he's had his time to build his roster - its time to deliver...
 
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Re: UNH 2020 Off-Season Thread: That Rinky-Shrinky Thang And Other Lively Banter :D

Thank goodness the season is over. We went out on a sort of kind of high note. The prize for playoff qualifying was a 2 of 3 series at Conte against a more motivated Eagles team. Our not getting blown out run against them would have been in serious jeopardy.

I got my UML/BU wish. :)
 
Re: UNH 2020 Off-Season Thread: That Rinky-Shrinky Thang And Other Lively Banter :D

There is so much I would like to discuss about UNH's season and about the future. I will take it one thing at a time over the next few days. For now, I would like to discuss something that is not so emotional. What players may leave early? There has been talk about Gildon and a little bit about Crookshank. How about Maass? Do you think the Washington Capitals want him to play four full years of college hockey and lose his NHL rights the following summer? I have not researched the Washington Capitals' prospect pool of right-handed defensemen, but I think they would like to have Maass in their system. I feel he could develop into a similar player as Matt Niskanen. There is no guarantee Maass will be back next season. Crookshank's NHL rights are owned by the Ottawa Senators. Ottawa has traded away so many older players the last year and a half for young players, prospects and draft picks that I think they have a log jam of left-handed wingers. So why sign with them? If I was representing Crookshank I would be asking Ottawa to trade his rights to another team or plan on staying in college for four years and become a free agent the following summer. At this point, I feel it would be smarter for Maass to leave than Crookshank.

Who knows!
 
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Re: UNH 2020 Off-Season Thread: That Rinky-Shrinky Thang And Other Lively Banter :D

Maass is an exceptional student, who likely realizes that his future would be better served getting his degree, rather than getting an "early jump" on riding around the ECHL/AHL. That's why he chose us in the first place, because we offered a spot as a true freshman rather than riding the buses in the USHL.
He has a better chance of being Brad Flaishans than Brett Pesce.
 
While I am sorry for your pain, this is precisely the reason that some teams SHOULD be eliminated from the playoffs at the end of the regular season. Allowing all teams into the postseason tourney renders much of the regular season meaningless. Sure there are byes,and home ice, but no real consequences for an underachieving program. If anything the everybody gets a medal mindset masks deficiencies. If a program doesn't take a critical look at itself and is not realistic about realities its is only deceiving itself. UNH finished in the top eight only one time in the past five seasons, yet until this year always managed to participate in the postseason. Its one thing to miss the playoffs one time in 32 tries, but its another thing to miss four times in five seasons. Perhaps if they had, it would have created a sense of urgency that seems lacking and the program would be better off for it.

+1!!!
 
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