Is Utica University (fka Utica College) CHA bound?

[Scott_TG]

Utica University is preparing to reclassify the entire athletic dept from DIII to DII for 2023-24, which would make both ice hockey programs eligible for the DI championships instead of DIII. It appears the whole thing hinges on the Utica men being accepted into the Atlantic Hockey Federation or else they scrap the whole thing.

The question I'm not seeing addressed is does their women's program go into the CHA (where some counterparts of other Atlantic Hockey men's programs play) or do they join other DII schools in the NEWHA. The CHA already has play-up school in RIT and geographically they fit with RIT, Syracuse, Penn State, Mercyhurst, and a returning RMU with Lindenwood being the outlier from the rest of the conference.

I'm curious how Utica will do competing in a DI level conference. They've usually been second or third best in the UCHC. They would give RIT someone to beat up on as the Tigers did in the old ECAC West days.

 

[HawksHockey]

The more stable conference, in terms of membership as it pertains to the AQ, is actually the NEWHA, believe it or not (seven members in 2022-23 with the addition of Stonehill).

On the flip side, the geographic benefits are there for Utica with the CHA.

 

[Scott_TG]

The more stable conference, in terms of membership as it pertains to the AQ, is actually the NEWHA, believe it or not (seven members in 2022-23 with the addition of Stonehill).

On the flip side, the geographic benefits are there for Utica with the CHA.

I also learned that Atlantic Hockey, where the men want to be, and the CHA have the same commissioner. Seems like if this happens that it is definitely the CHA. I just don't know how competitive they can be in the conference when they haven't been a national contender at the DIII level. RIT was the reigning DIII champs when they jumped and the runner-up the season before that. St. Thomas had been a perennial contender. Utica at most has been second best in their conference and the UCHC is one of the weakest.

 

[HawksHockey]

I also learned that Atlantic Hockey, where the men want to be, and the CHA have the same commissioner. Seems like if this happens that it is definitely the CHA. I just don't know how competitive they can be in the conference when they haven't been a national contender at the DIII level. RIT was the reigning DIII champs when they jumped and the runner-up the season before that. St. Thomas had been a perennial contender. Utica at most has been second best in their conference and the UCHC is one of the weakest.

And the NEWHA commissioner is also the CHA and Atlantic Hockey commissioner! What makes you say "definitely" with that being the case?

 

[ARM]

And the NEWHA commissioner is also the CHA and Atlantic Hockey commissioner!

If the NEWHA and the CHA have the same commissioner, one would think that there would be a conflict of interest when it comes to recruiting a team to join. Maybe the commissioner is unbiased enough to equally represent the position of all involved, but that is a rare individual in today's society. I suppose I have to remember that we're talking women's NCAA hockey here, and its not like there are fortunes to be gained through shenanigans.

 

[Lindsay]

If the NEWHA and the CHA have the same commissioner, one would think that there would be a conflict of interest when it comes to recruiting a team to join. Maybe the commissioner is unbiased enough to equally represent the position of all involved, but that is a rare individual in today's society. I suppose I have to remember that we're talking women's NCAA hockey here, and its not like there are fortunes to be gained through shenanigans.

He’s also listed as treasurer for College Hockey Inc and as a board member for USA Hockey. He has a lot of jobs; perhaps he’d also like to be PHF commissioner. They are hiring.

 

[Scott_TG]

This isn't unprecedented. The commissioner of the SUNYAC and NEWHL is the same person. Katie Boldvich was at one point in her career commissioner of both the Colonial Hockey Conference and the New England Hockey Conference at the same time as Suffolk was going from one to the other (Suffolk ended up back with the CHC as it finally was absorbed by the multisport CCC where most schools were already members). I believe that Boldvich is still the NEHC commish while also the same for the multi-sport Landmark Conference

There is a risk of an appearance of a conflict of interest but as long as the member schools are satisfied it isn't a problem. It appears that being a commissioner of a single-sport conference isn't a full-time job and I think the member schools feel having their commissioner with experience/connection to their single sport is worth it looking weird that one executive is the commissioner for multiple conferences. I imagine most schools are more concerned about what the commissioner does between schools in their own conference where they play most of their schedule than what their commissioner gets up to on his/her other jobs. As ARM arrives at in their previous post, I don't think there's much opportunity for it to really matter.

 

[Scott_TG]

And the NEWHA commissioner is also the CHA and Atlantic Hockey commissioner! What makes you say "definitely" with that being the case?

I guess "definitely" is too strong, I guess "highly likely" is more accurate? I think Utica fits in geographically with the CHA much better than it would the NEWHA and the teams have counterparts in Atlantic Hockey.

 

[Russell Jaslow]

If the NEWHA and the CHA have the same commissioner, one would think that there would be a conflict of interest when it comes to recruiting a team to join. Maybe the commissioner is unbiased enough to equally represent the position of all involved, but that is a rare individual in today's society. I suppose I have to remember that we're talking women's NCAA hockey here, and its not like there are fortunes to be gained through shenanigans.

Ultimately, it’s the schools in a conference which has the final vote whether to let someone in or not.

 

[shelfit]

I was surprised to read the original post that Utica is going to D2 but I suppose that's because they are going from "college" to "university" unless there's some other reason for it. I don't know much about their men's hockey team but the women's team does have a history of being quite a good team. I just scrolled through their history here and it looks like they've only been below .500 three times since they started in 2001-02 (21 years) and one of those below .500 seasons was the COVID season. They were exactly .500 just one year. Otherwise all the 17 other seasons have been over .500. How many D3 programs can say that? I think that's pretty good. What's more impressive is they've only had one coach! Wow!

I don't like the comparison with RIT because the RIT head coaches were known for telling potential recruits that they were going D1 years before they finally did. I would guess the Utica coach never told any recruits anything but the truth. Now he'll be able tell them his school is going D2 so I think that will help with his recruiting efforts to make the transition up. With Utica going D2 I think they should just join the other D2 schools in the NEWHA.

 

[ARM]

Ultimately, it’s the schools in a conference which has the final vote whether to let someone in or not.

I was looking at it from the other side. Suppose each league was down to five teams and needed a sixth team to get an NCAA bid, and one team was looking to join a league and narrowed its choices down to the NEWHA and the CHA. The new-program AD meets with the NEWHA Commissioner and says, "Make your pitch -- why should my team join your conference?" The subsequent similar meeting with the CHA Commissioner just seems odd. Or if one league needs a sixth team and the other doesn't, is the commissioner going to try to steer the new program into the smaller conference, even if it isn't the best fit overall?

I guess that sixth-team threshold is really the only case where the stakes are high at all, because we're not talking about Texas or Notre Dame football here, where visions of TV contracts are dancing in commissioners' brains.

 

[Scott_TG]

In your scenario, the commissioner can and should make a good faith pitch for how each conference would benefit the new program because ultimately it's up to the school to apply to where they want to be and the institutions in the conference where they apply to admit them.

 

[shelfit]

Geographically it would make sense for Lindenwood and The OSU to flip-flop conferences but that's never going to happen. What a pain in the *ss it must be for the rest of the CHA teams to travel out to St Louis every year. I wouldn't want that hassle as an opposing team.

 

[CROSS BAR]

Geographically it would make sense for Lindenwood and The OSU to flip-flop conferences but that's never going to happen. What a pain in the *ss it must be for the rest of the CHA teams to travel out to St Louis every year. I wouldn't want that hassle as an opposing team.

All WCHA teams travel the same distance to play Ohio State. What a pain it must be for St Cloud, Mankato, St Thomas and Bemidji to travel to Columbus to get beat up on by a team filled with transfers.

Moving Ohio State would definitely strengthen the CHA, bring much needed respect to that conference and provide a great measuring stick for the current top 3 CHA teams. I would guess Ohio State could schedule as strong a non conference schedule as they wanted and still have a top SOS.

This would probably help Lindenwood's recruiting, along with giving a boost to the WCHA's bottom 4 teams as well. Wisconsin, UMD and the Gophers wouldn't feel the need or have to schedule non conference games against the bottom teams from the other conferences, as they would have enough average teams in their own conference. It would probably force them to schedule better non conference games to increase their SOS. A win win for ranking systems and women's college hockey.

 

[slapshot willy]

Geographically it would make sense for Lindenwood and The OSU to flip-flop conferences but that's never going to happen. What a pain in the *ss it must be for the rest of the CHA teams to travel out to St Louis every year. I wouldn't want that hassle as an opposing team.

It has to be worse for Lindenwood to play away games. Literally every away weekend series is a flight. That has to be such a pain and very expensive, especially for a small school like that.

 

[Russell Jaslow]

Geographically it would make sense for Lindenwood and The OSU to flip-flop conferences but that's never going to happen. What a pain in the *ss it must be for the rest of the CHA teams to travel out to St Louis every year. I wouldn't want that hassle as an opposing team.

No different than Atlantic Hockey teams having to travel out to Air Force. It's once a year. They are D1 programs. All D1 programs take a long trip at least once a year for one reason or another.

 

[Russell Jaslow]

I was looking at it from the other side. Suppose each league was down to five teams and needed a sixth team to get an NCAA bid, and one team was looking to join a league and narrowed its choices down to the NEWHA and the CHA. The new-program AD meets with the NEWHA Commissioner and says, "Make your pitch -- why should my team join your conference?" The subsequent similar meeting with the CHA Commissioner just seems odd. Or if one league needs a sixth team and the other doesn't, is the commissioner going to try to steer the new program into the smaller conference, even if it isn't the best fit overall?

It's like those scenes you see in comedies where someone is playing chess with himself and he's physically jumping from one side of the board to another.