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COVID-19 - Part 2

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  • Re: COVID-19 - Part 2

    Originally posted by Dutchman View Post
    Federal bureaucracies are never the solution to anything.
    Agree 100%. A necessary evil to an extent, but ours are way too big, and way too inefficient.
    Sworn Enemy of the Perpetually Offended
    Montreal Expos Forever ...

    Comment


    • Re: COVID-19 - Part 2

      Originally posted by Wayuphere View Post
      Still obsessed I see.
      Ironic much?
      Sworn Enemy of the Perpetually Offended
      Montreal Expos Forever ...

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Chuck Murray View Post
        Ironic much?
        Lol. Most posters don’t go to your extremes of having to refute anything, I mean anything, posted that doesn’t conform to your views. Your excessive use of quotes and then the personal attacks of “stupid “, etc. because you don’t agree is a red flag of ego issues. Just like your hero.
        $90(more) for a drink holding ledge and a Maine blanket, but the views still great.
        Just win.....

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Chuck Murray View Post
          We are the United States - plural, States - of America.

          We are NOT the United State (singular) of America, or the Federal State (singular) of America.

          I know this cuts against the Left's statist fantasies, but the spelling does count. Sorry.
          No no
          Ben Gates explained this in national treasure 2

          We stopped saying the United States are, and changed to the United States is
          a legend and an out of work bum look a lot alike, daddy.

          Comment


          • Re: COVID-19 - Part 2

            Where's the Hydroxichloroquine hater poster? Has he gone underground since it's effectiveness has apparently been substantiated and is being widely used now?
            UNH Hockey: You can check out any time you like but you can never leave!

            Comment


            • Originally posted by mookie1995 View Post
              No no
              Ben Gates explained this in national treasure 2

              We stopped saying the United States are, and changed to the United States is
              Precisely. The name of the country is The United States of America, not These United States of America. United is past tense. The Uniting is done, and we are now one State, whose next level administrative districts unfortunately misuse the term “state.” No entity beholden to a higher authority, as our “states” are via the supremacy clause would ever fit the true definition of a state.

              States didn’t make their preparations in a vacuum; they beloved incorrectly that our national government would actually be helpful at a time of crises. Bet they won’t make that mistake again.
              If you don't change the world today, how can it be any better tomorrow?

              Comment


              • Originally posted by acs64 View Post
                No need to cook em yet. Still 4 more deaths from snowmobile accidents here in Maine versus the bat “cough” flu🦠
                This is further evidence that we need to isolate snowmobiles acs At the very least we need to keep six feet away from them
                UNH Hockey: You can check out any time you like but you can never leave!

                Comment


                • Re: COVID-19 - Part 2

                  Originally posted by e.cat View Post
                  Where's the Hydroxichloroquine hater poster? Has he gone underground since it's effectiveness has apparently been substantiated and is being widely used now?
                  Hopefullly he's OK and not experiencing any of the following: blurred vision, fast, pounding, uneven heartbeat, inability to move the eyes, large, hive-like swelling on the face, eyelids, lips, tongue, throat, hands, legs, feet, and sex organs, trouble with breathing, speaking, or swallowing, uncontrolled twisting movements of the neck, trunk, arms, or legs, unusual facial expressions, feeling that others are watching you or controlling your behavior, feeling that others can hear your thoughts, feeling, seeing, or hearing things that are not there.

                  I am less of a chemist than a statistician, but FWIW I once used Mefloquine. Once.

                  Going back a day or two, thanks for the Ozark reminder. I watched season one a while back, plan to pick up with two and three.
                  I will not be out cheered in my own building.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Darius View Post
                    Hopefullly he's OK and not experiencing any of the following: blurred vision, fast, pounding, uneven heartbeat, inability to move the eyes, large, hive-like swelling on the face, eyelids, lips, tongue, throat, hands, legs, feet, and sex organs, trouble with breathing, speaking, or swallowing, uncontrolled twisting movements of the neck, trunk, arms, or legs, unusual facial expressions, feeling that others are watching you or controlling your behavior, feeling that others can hear your thoughts, feeling, seeing, or hearing things that are not there.

                    I am less of a chemist than a statistician, but FWIW I once used Mefloquine. Once.

                    Going back a day or two, thanks for the Ozark reminder. I watched season one a while back, plan to pick up with two and three.
                    You know the pharma ads on tv where the side effects are longer than the promo for the drug Yikes!

                    You won't regret picking up Ozark Darius
                    UNH Hockey: You can check out any time you like but you can never leave!

                    Comment


                    • Re: COVID-19 - Part 2

                      Note: I tried to send this as a single, long post but, I wasn't aware there was a maximum number of words per post. So, this is Part I of III.

                      Although I have been lurking in the forums for over 15 years, I've only actually posted previously a few times. Most of which were in the Div. I threads but a few in the Div. III threads as well and, always on "hockey related" topics. Still, since the spring of the 2016 presidential campaign, at least 3/4 of my time is spent in the Cafe threads as I've always been very interested in and, have tried be informed about our politics and the various non-sports issues facing our country. A little background as I think it's only fair that others know at least some of your life experiences and the biases those produce. I'm in my early 50's. I live in the northern half of Minnesota in the community I was born and raised in. Been married 25 years and have three kids -- 21, 17, and 13 (1 girl & 2 boys, with the oldest boy beginning his transition into the LGBTQ community). All go to public schools.

                      I received a degree in mass communications with an emphasis in broadcast journalism. I minored in coaching. I spent 23 years in the Guard as an NCO, retiring with honors in 2011. I also spent 15 years as the owner of a small business that I chose to shut down in 2015 as the basic structure of the industry changed which prevented it from being profitable any longer. At least in the way I was set up. That and my wife had received a promotion in her corporate job that she's now been in for over 25 years as well which, from a financial standpoint, allowed me to focus on the various part-time hockey duties I had been involved in since my two seasons as a player in the USHL back in the mid-80s. Playing wise, I was a walk-on at a Div. I school but, when it was obvious I wasn't going to play in the near future, I transferred to a Div. III school that had recruited me in juniors where I was a part of a frozen four team my senior season. I've been extremely fortunate to, at various times, have served in almost every position involved in our game, other than that of commissioner. Some of those as high as the "AA" Minor Pro level.

                      As for my political background/leanings, I started out as a conservative as that's what my dad was (30+ years in full time military and retiring as a General). I voted for the first time in the 1984 presidential election, enthusiastically casting my vote for Reagan. In presidential elections, from 84 thru 2008, I generally voted for either a Republican candidate or, wrote in someone who was at least center-right in their policies and ideas – Reagan in 84, Bush I twice, voted for Perot in '96, voted for Bush II in 2000, wrote in Colin Powell in 2004, voted for McCain in 2008, broke the streak and voted for Obama in 2012, then wrote in McMullin in 2016. As for state and local elections, it's been a very broad mix of democrats and republicans over the years. Usually basing my decision on who I felt was the best qualified personally, regardless of their party affiliation. Around 2000, I came to view myself as an independent, especially after voting for Jesse Ventura for governor in 1998.

                      However, after immersing myself in the Cafe threads the last 3.5 years -- especially the “Trump” thread but, also many others. And, after being exposed to posters such as "Kepler", Handyman", "dx", and many others, my views on where this country is and the direction it needs to go, especially regarding the state of the wealth and wage gaps, the disintegration of the true "middle class", the amount of influence that the top 1% of wage earners and corporations have over our elections and, finally, the way that the "leadership" of the Republican Party has been unwilling to truly challenge Trump regarding the literally hundreds of inappropriate actions and statements -- some of which were flat out illegal -- my whole outlook and perspective has swung 100% to the Democratic Party. Are there issues in that party as well? Absolutely. However, the degree of difference in regards to the undesirable parts of each party isn't even in the same galaxy. To put it even more bluntly and, as others in these forums have already described it, the Republican Party is now a cult that not only is consumed in protecting the 1% and corporations, specifically, their CEOs and other top management AND let’s not forget the stockholders. They have also embraced blatant xenophobia, misogyny, homophobia, transphobia, and racism/white nationalism, just to name a few.

                      As for the other types of media I consume besides the USCHO Forums, I generally watch CNN and CNBC but, I also occasionally switch to MSNBC and Fox (never Hannity or Coulter or the other really right wing echo chamber/Trump base appeasing hosts). That's pretty much where I'm at these days. Now, having said all of that, I refuse to get into name calling or ad hom attacks in these forums. No matter how much I might disagree with someone or, how personal they might get with me. Yes, some people in these forums aren't even worth trying to have a discussion/debate with (Flaggy). However, for the vast majority of people in here that I might disagree with, the whole idea behind these forums is the exchange of information/ideas and the resulting conversation/discussion/debate that might follow, with the hope of possibly, just possibly, either changing someone's mind or worldview OR, maybe even my own. Heck, if "Kepler" and the crew can change me from a "center-right Republican/Independent" to a "Blue no matter who" Democrat, then anything is possible.

                      Now for my actual post.
                      After reading some of the comments and opinions that "Chuck Murray", "ecat", and others have thrown out there in this thread the last few weeks, I feel the need to respond. This post is obviously already quite long but, there's a lot to respond to so it's probably going to be a lot longer by the time it's done.
                      Let me start by going way back to page 14 of this thread where “Chuck” states the following (the first paragraph is a comment from “NCAA Watcher” which Chuck is responding to….

                      Originally Posted by NCAA watcher
                      Even when we knew the truth we took no action for two months and "supressed the data" in the US. If we want to point blame, I suppose we also should point fingers at those who disabled our response capabilities and then, claimed no action was needed in the US. Was Hawley not able to work "blame the New Yorkers" in to the resolution, too? That seems like DeSantis and Trump's go to now. I take it by your post that you support this full examination of blame, right?

                      Chuck’s response to NCAA Watcher –
                      Yes, let's have a discussion. For the last 4 years now, since he was a candidate, President Trump has been warning everyone who would listen that China - NOT Russia - was our most prominent ideological enemy. TO THIS DAY, there are large swathes of the MSM (and even s few USCHO posters) who rise in almost Pavlovian unison to China's defense. Many of those same folks instead tried to float the blatantly false "Russia Russia Russia" narrative for three (3) years, and after microscopic inspection by literally a dozen-plus of the President's loudest detractors, the Mueller thing crashed and burned into the nothingness it always was. Then, when more modest and humbled opposition should have pivoted to do something like infrastructure for the common good of the country … instead the Dems and the MSM (again, I apologize for repeating myself) pivoted to the next garbage attempt at a soft coup with the Ukraine thing, which served not only to protect the Bidens' insanely corrupt involvement in that country, but tried to use the purported delay in providing aid to said same country - aid which BTW had been denied by Obama/Biden which provided blankets and food instead - to impeach the President. That didn't work either. End of Part I...

                      Comment


                      • Re: COVID-19 - Part 2

                        Originally posted by e.cat View Post
                        You know the pharma ads on tv where the side effects are longer than the promo for the drug Yikes!

                        You won't regret picking up Ozark Darius
                        I've had to take a couple of short courses of Plaquenil in the past when traveling to places that i would never want to visit again - all without incident. Have prescribed it for many patients with Systemic Lupus Erythematosus for extremely lengthy time periods almost always without any major problems that would cause discontinuation of treatment. however, for anyone on the medication for longer than 6 months I insist they have an Ophthalmologist see them and a Cardiologist at least yearly. I can attest to the level of safety for the drug and it's effectiveness for the diagnoses I have used it for. of course, I know absolutely nothing of antiviral properties that it seems to exhibit but certainly open minded about it from what i am reading and hearing.
                        Take the shortest distance to the puck and arrive in ill humor

                        Comment


                        • Re: COVID-19 - Part 2

                          Part II...

                          But it had EVERYONE's focus right though early February (2/5/20), in part because of the Speaker's delay tactics to extend the process and try to come up with more crap to support their faux and ever-changing "strategy" (spelled R-E-S-I-S-T), which had changed not one single iota from literally 20 minutes after President Trump was inaugurated, right up through the aftermath of Trump's acquittal. Nevertheless, despite the stupidity literally the entire Congress and most of the MSM was fixated on, Trump entered an order banning travel to/from China on January 31st - yes, while exactly no one else was calling for it - and was then accused of being a "racist" and as a "xenophobe" for his early action. The action did more than any single action to date to curb the virus' impact in the USA.


                          It's important to note that even in mid-February, there were no real signs of the pandemic emerging as a real force beyond the borders of Communist China. Here is a link to a helpful timeline which provides an informative look-see at how things played out in Italy. I think it's fair to say, it was only when the issues in Italy began to emerge full-scale - again, three (3) full weeks after Trump's then-criticized travel ban on China - that folks realized this could become a real problem well beyond China.


                          https://www.timetoast.com/timelines/covid-19-in-italy

                          Picking back up after the latest soft coup attempt impeachment farce ended … while lots of folks were stuck on their latest outbreak of name-calling against the President, the US primary election/caucus season was finally underway. The MSM pivoted to the Dem craziness in Iowa (flunking Math 101, remember? Seems so long ago) and then the series of primaries that followed, and finally over to Super Tuesday (which I believe was on 3/3/20?) and the admittedly fascinating machinations that saw a previously crowded Dem field surprisingly and quickly narrow to overtly try to push Biden back to relevancy at the expense of Bernie Sanders (it worked BTW). There was another slate of elections the following Tuesday (3/10/20).

                          March 10th was a big day in the COVID-19 tale. On that evening, the NBA first shut down for business when one of its players tested positive. I think it was also the evening when the MSM carried news that Tom Hanks and his wife were testing positive in Australia. Yet, on that very morning, communist NYC Mayor Bill DeBlasio was literally downplaying the impact of COVID-19 on national TV to his constituents and beyond. Here's the link …

                          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KxWQywIuhhA

                          Even our dear neighbors from Canada didn't BAN travel to/from China until very recently. I believe PM Trudeau's wife tested positive for COVID-19 earlier this month. An ADVISORY was in place, which as the following article demonstrates, was hardly stopping most airlines from conducting "business as usual" … even when the business involved China.

                          https://globalnews.ca/news/6546569/c...lights-canada/
                          Even the oft-lauded Governor Cuomo was knocked down a little bit off his self-righteous pedestal when he had to admit the other day that his state had full access to a stockpile of thousands of ventilators, despite previous messaging that his state was tapped out. Perhaps the biggest idiot of all is the Mayor of New Orleans, who apparently thought President Trump is psychic, and should have told her to cancel Mardi Gras (2/25/20) - see the Italy timeline above for context - two (2) full weeks before her fellow Mayor DeBlasio was STILL telling anyone who would listen that everything was hunky-dory.

                          Listen … hindsight is 20/20 and clearly, if everyone's leaders knew then what everyone knows now, response to what has been a unique situation could have been FAR different. By lots of people - both here in the US, and well beyond to numerous countries, cities, hospitals, etc. Personally, it is no secret by now that I downplayed the situation initially. Sometimes that happens, and you learn and you live (hopefully). Fault by degrees on how our President, our governors, and/or our mayors is up for debate. Contrary to the prevailing theme in too many corners of the MSM - who until very recently were creating stupid (and harmful) "Fauci Hates Trump" or "Trump Is Jealous Of Fauci" narratives … the American people seem to grasp the unique nature of the situation, and support the President at levels they've not previously supported him.

                          Things may change, new facts may emerge, which change apportionment issues we debate on here.
                          But the one constant in ALL of this - everything - is that the virus started in China. And given the opportunity to act like a true member of the community of nations they regularly steal from, and then sell stuff to using stolen intellectual property, they did nothing, other than try to cover it all up, suppress key information/data, and virtually executed those who stood in resistance.

                          There is a long way to go to get us through this crisis first … but none of us should ever forget where this started, and who is to blame for what we're left with. CHINA. That's a cold, hard FACT.

                          My response to Chuck –
                          Obviously, there’s a lot to unpack there. Although I’m sure it will come as no shock to Chuck, or ecat, or any other Trump supporters in these forums, I completely disagree with Chuck’s description/assessment of what the Mueller investigation uncovered, and whether or not it definitively proved illegal activity by either Trump himself or the campaign. As others have already stated, Mueller concluded that there was a very solid case for obstruction of justice. It’s in black and white in the report Chuck. It’s ok, go ahead and read it. It’s actually quite interesting. However, since DOJ guidelines currently prevent a president from being indicted while in office, Mueller chose not to pursue any charges.
                          As for your assertion that most military/national security leaders and experts view China as a bigger ideological “enemy” than Russia; does China steal more intellectual property from us than Russia? Absolutely. Obviously, that’s not the only item one would use to determine which one was a “bigger” enemy. And, from what I have read in this area the last four years, most neutral/apolitical observers feel that Russia is still the bigger threat. Let’s face it, as interconnected as the global community has become two decades, it’s probably difficult to truly quantify which is the bigger threat at a given moment and, even if one could, it would probably change within a week or a month anyway.

                          Chuck, I also don’t really care if Trump has been saying China is a bigger enemy than Russia for the last 3.5 years. My question to you is, considering his pattern of behavior toward Russia since his being elected president, is it really surprising he would identify China as being a bigger threat? As a proud vet, I still don’t want my C-in-C having the Russian Foreign Minister and his aides who are proven spooks romping around the oval office while he’s publicly ripping James Comey. Or, even worse, meeting with Putin for 2 hours in Helsinki with no other staff to take notes and record what was actually said by each man when the Russians actually did have someone in the room with Putin. Or, possibly even worse than that, standing on a stage next to Putin and telling the world that he was more inclined to believe Putin over literally the entire national security apparatus in regards to whether or not Russia hacked the 2016 elections! Even though no one in any position of authority in our national security apparatus was claiming that the Russian involvement changed the actual result of the election. But, because Trump is such an insecure person, he literally can’t say that Russian interfered occurred because in his mind he thinks that means there’s a possibility he didn’t really win it. Especially after Hillary had 3 million more total votes than he did. End of Part II...

                          Comment


                          • Re: COVID-19 - Part 2

                            In that first paragraph you also criticize the impeachment inquiry. Again, if Obama had ever done the exact same thing and the Republicans would’ve controlled the House, they absolutely would’ve impeached Obama as well. Look, I think Obama was a slightly above average president – although we probably need another 5-10 years to establish his final grade. But seriously Chuck, the Republicans spent days criticizing him because he wore a freaking tan suit. As for your “R-E-S-I-S-T” comment; there's this senator –- I think his name is Mitch McConnell -- who stood at a podium soon after Obama was elected in 2008 and stated that the Republican’s number one priority was ensuring Obama was a one term president. Do you remember that Chuck? Seriously, do you? If so, does it really make sense to cry about the Democrats “RESISTING” when the Republicans set the gold standard on blocking any progress on the agenda of the opposing party’s president? You then commented you felt the “Ukraine matter” was an attempt by the Democrats to shift attention away from the “Bidens’ insanely corrupt involvement in that country”. Was it a mistake for Hunter Biden to take that position? Yes. Was it a mistake for Joe to use his influence to help his son get the position? **** right it was. Were either actions against the law of either country involved? Not that I’m aware of.

                            Since I've acknowledged the Bidens' mistakes, I ask you Chuck, are you willing to acknowledge the far, FAR, greater and consistent level of financial and other benefits the Trump children have gained due to their father’s influence/position? Both Trump and his children have, beyond the shadow of any doubt, violated the Emoluments Clause. So, unlike the Bidens, the Trumps have actually broken a real law. If you aren't willing to admit that the Trumps' "corruption" is levels of magnitude worse than the Bidens, then you are taking the word hypocrisy to levels never before seen. The simple fact he’s allowing his children to have official positions in the White House is beyond the pale compared to what has occurred in any other previous administrations. Period.

                            Chuck, in your second paragraph, you start getting into Trump’s response to the virus. You do realize, although he did halt incoming air travel from China on Jan. 31st (which he deserves credit for) that was already after all of the major air carriers had chosen to halt service from China on their own? In all seriousness, what “courage”/”strength of conviction”/”leadership” did that decision really take? Especially considering the information that was presented today in a Washington Post article about how badly the administration has bungled its response to the pandemic. In which, they reveal that Trump was made aware of how serious the virus could become in his Jan. 3 daily intelligence briefing

                            https://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...n/?arc404=true

                            Oh, and if you really believe that Trump cutting travel into the U.S. from China is really the “action that did more than any other single action to date to curb the virus’ impact in the United States”, then you either aren’t paying attention to even the most basic news coverage OR, you’re simply blinded in your efforts to try and defend Trump’s indefensible performance. Because every legitimate expert on this crisis is saying that social distancing will be the one single action that best curbs the spread of the virus. Not Trump’s travel ban from China.

                            Chuck, you also state in your second paragraph that “it’s important to note that even in mid-February, there were no real signs of the pandemic being a real force beyond China’s borders". Mid-February? Are you really serious with this?!? Again, please see the Washington Post article I linked to above. I certainly acknowledge that thru the end of January, there were conflicting stories in a number of mainstream media about how serious the threat of the virus might be. However, there were still a number of medical experts sounding the alarm as early as mid-January. The WHO sent out its’ first world-wide advisory on the virus on Dec. 30th (or 31st)? Meaning, our government, including those who would normally report to Trump on a daily or weekly basis, were aware of it by that time. By late January, our medical experts in the area of epidemiology/infectious disease knew of the virus’ transmission pathways, as well as how much trouble it was causing in China. And again, Trump was initially briefed on it January 3rd. Here’s another article that indicates Trump was well aware of the virus and how serious his various advisers thought it was. Despite his public proclamations to the contrary.

                            https://www.businessinsider.com/coro...january-2020-3,

                            From the article: “Officials were giving Trump classified briefings on the matter at the same time that the president was publicly downplaying the risk of the novel coronavirus and insisting the US was well prepared to handle the outbreak.” And… "Donald Trump may not have been expecting this, but a lot of other people in the government were — they just couldn't get him to do anything about it," the official added.

                            Let’s be honest, there were likely people in our country carrying the virus by January 1st and probably sooner. Regardless, Trump downplayed the possible seriousness of it for the next 70 days – his actual public emotional acceptance of the seriousness of it didn’t occur until just this past Tuesday!

                            Chuck, to your point about China’s lack of truthfulness in what it has reported regarding the virus: I agree with you completely. And, I don't sense most others here disagreeing either. Regardless, what does China’s lack of truthfulness have anything to do with any of the criticisms being leveled at Trump and his administration for their absolutely inadequate and ineffective response? Again, the potential seriousness of the virus was known and relayed to Trump the first few days of January. His decisions – or lack thereof -- have very likely caused people to die unnecessarily – potentially thousands of people. All because he was more concerned with trying to keep the economy strong.

                            And no, I’m not accepting the other Fox talking point that the Democrats are to blame because they pushed impeachment and, consequently, Trump was too preoccupied with that to be able to give full attention to other challenges at the same time. Really, this supposedly highly skilled businessman/negotiator can’t manage two things at once? I do agree with your assessment that for the vast majority of the American people, the threat finally became real on March 10th when the NBA cancelled its season, which obviously led to a cascade of other sports/leagues choosing to cancel as well. I also agree with your criticism of Mayor DeBlasio in New York as he was obviously downplaying the risk in his city and, his delay in providing strong action and messaging will certainly have contributed to unnecessary deaths as well.

                            To your credit Chuck, you acknowledge you initially downplayed the potential seriousness of the situation. That honesty is to be commended. Still, you also stated that, “hindsight is 20/20 and clearly, if everyone's leaders knew then what everyone knows now, response to what has been a unique situation could have been FAR different.” I’m sorry but, other countries’ leaders did know then what they know now – as did Trump. They just acted quickly and appropriately. As of this moment on the John’s Hopkins website, we have 290,600 confirmed infections and South Korea has 10,150 confirmed infections. We have 7,800 deaths and South Korea has 177. Obviously, our country is very different in its geography which makes testing a little more challenging. But, that’s the key difference. South Korea had a high quality test developed within a week that could be mass produced and mass processed.

                            That’s why some others on here are taking issue with Trump’s contention we are “testing way more than any other country”. The consensus in the broader scientific community is that South Korea has tested a far higher percentage of their population than we have which, when comparing countries so different in population and geographic size, is the only way to accurately compare. Are we testing more people? Sure. Is it “way more”? Not to my definition.

                            Chuck, I’m not sure where you and others living in the Fox News bubble get the idea that the MSM is creating stories that “Fauci hates Trump” or “Trump is jealous of Fauci”. Were there stories stating there might be a tension between them based on how Fauci would skillfully answer a question that set him up to directly disagree with Trump, yet do so without being too direct? Absolutely. And that assessment is based on how Trump has proven by his own actions that he literally can’t stand not being the most important person in the room. However, that’s still a long way from claiming Trump “hates” Fauci or is “jealous” of Fauci. Sorry, I simply haven’t read any such articles or seen any spots on cable news claiming this (and I literally have some sort of cable news on all day). Finally, I get it. You believe China is a super-villain in regards to how they handled the virus. The point is, although I certainly understand how looking back to see what China did or didn’t do can teach us about things moving forward, that still doesn’t excuse Trump or any of our other federal, state, or local leaders that didn’t act with the speed and seriousness the available information was screaming at them to do. Sorry about how long this post is but, Chuck and others on the right have spouted so much inaccurate stuff that it takes time get caught up.

                            Comment


                            • Re: COVID-19 - Part 2

                              the inability of people to admit errors, or ability to deny certain basic facts to support their existing beliefs, is really effin sad, and why we're in this mess.

                              Comment


                              • [QUOTE=net presence;6935588]In that first paragraph you also criticize the impeachment inquiry. Again, if Obama had ever done the exact same thing and the Republicans would’ve controlled the House, they absolutely would’ve impeached Obama as well. /QUOTE]

                                I shortened your response by about 300 lines so everybody wouldn't’ have to scroll down.
                                Etc... Etc.... Etc.... we get it. You hate Trump.
                                Are there Crib Notes available for your posts.
                                Last edited by scoreboard; 04-04-2020, 04:02 PM.

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