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Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

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  • #16
    Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

    Originally posted by Rover View Post
    Your claim was that he had the most diverse campaign in history nobody seems to be able to back up except for anecdotal observations. Your last sentence is merely a strawman argument that nobody actually made.
    I know you're not talking to me but I did however cite a hard metric that Sanders is the second-most popular choice among non-Hispanic black voters after Biden. So the dismissal of Sanders as a purely white phenomenon is rebutted. And that is the key issue here.

    If we are moving towards Biden v Sanders then all of the demographic factors cancel and we are left with, essentially, Rover vs Kepler for the nomination.
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    • #17
      Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

      Originally posted by Rover View Post
      Your claim was that he had the most diverse campaign in history nobody seems to be able to back up except for anecdotal observations. Your last sentence is merely a strawman argument that nobody actually made.
      You moved the goalposts. I said one of the most diverse in history, you just changed it to the most diverse in history.

      Just out of curiosity, who else would you consider has had a diverse campaign in history? Lincoln? FDR? JFK? Bush? Think they had a lot of women? POC? Religious diversity?

      Let's look at Obama's 2008 campaign staff:

      from wikipedia

      David Plouffe (Manager)
      Penny Pritzker (Finance)
      David Axelrod (Media)
      Michael Slaby (Chief Technology Officer)
      Robert Gibbs (Communications)
      Bill Burton (Spokesman)
      Henry De Sio (Chief Operating Officer)
      Claire McCaskill (Co-Chair)
      Tim Kaine (Co-Chair)
      Paul Hodes (Co-Chair)

      Yeah, lots of diversity there.

      As I said, sorry I made such an outlandish claim. Obviously the people in this thread are much more able to speak on diversity than he is. Just look how diverse this group is in comparison.

      Comment

      • #18
        Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

        Originally posted by ticapnews View Post
        Just look how diverse this group is in comparison.
        Hey! We root for lots of different teams!
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        • #19
          Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

          Originally posted by Kepler View Post
          Hey! We root for lots of different teams!
          Exactly! It's like a Sniffles rally. "A white guy in a red hat standing next to a white guy with no hat standing next to a white guy with a red hat on backwards." Diversity!

          Comment

          • #20
            Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

            Originally posted by ticapnews View Post
            Exactly! It's like a Sniffles rally. "A white guy in a red hat standing next to a white guy with no hat standing next to a white guy with a red hat on backwards." Diversity!
            To be fair they each have a different kind of cancer.
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            • #21
              Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

              Originally posted by Kepler View Post
              So the dismissal of Sanders as a purely white phenomenon is rebutted. And that is the key issue here.
              But who is actually making this claim? Seems like its a strawman argument.

              Originally posted by ticapnews View Post
              You moved the goalposts. I said one of the most diverse in history, you just changed it to the most diverse in history.

              Just out of curiosity, who else would you consider has had a diverse campaign in history? Lincoln? FDR? JFK? Bush? Think they had a lot of women? POC? Religious diversity?

              Let's look at Obama's 2008 campaign staff:

              from wikipedia

              David Plouffe (Manager)
              Penny Pritzker (Finance)
              David Axelrod (Media)
              Michael Slaby (Chief Technology Officer)
              Robert Gibbs (Communications)
              Bill Burton (Spokesman)
              Henry De Sio (Chief Operating Officer)
              Claire McCaskill (Co-Chair)
              Tim Kaine (Co-Chair)
              Paul Hodes (Co-Chair)

              Yeah, lots of diversity there.

              As I said, sorry I made such an outlandish claim. Obviously the people in this thread are much more able to speak on diversity than he is. Just look how diverse this group is in comparison.
              Yes, you are correct upon further review you said "one of the most". My take on diversity is who is supporting the candidate amongst the voters. A cynical candidate could easily manipulate his co-chairs to show a lot of diversity for public consumption. However, whether or not non-whites, women, etc are supporting you is "black and white" for lack of a better term. Sanders himself seemed to struggle with that in the 2016 primaries and I'd be somewhat surprised to see that Sanders has MORE POC support than Obama did just to name two recent examples....
              Last edited by Rover; 02-04-2020, 11:33 AM.
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              • #22
                Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

                Nevada plans to use the same App for their caucus.
                "I went over the facts in my head, and admired how much uglier the situation had just become. Over the years I've learned that ignorance is more than just bliss. It's freaking orgasmic ecstasy".- Harry Dresden, Blood Rites


                Western Michigan Bronco Hockey- 2012 Mason Cup Champions

                Comment

                • #23
                  Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

                  Here is what I have learned from the last couple days:

                  1) White People love to argue with each other over which White Person "The Others" like voting for.

                  2) It is not ok to generalize about the supporters of various campaigns but it is definitely ok if you generalize about the supports of other campaigns. This is true of all candidates though a few are the most obvious examples who we need not name here.

                  3) The media sucks and is conspiring against a candidate...unless they change their narrative for a second thanks to some random poll put out by "Bob's Firm For Taking Numbers and Changing Them" in which case then the media in question is asking the "hard questions" and is "doing their research to put forth the correct narrative".

                  4) The DNC sucks and is conspiring against [insert name here].

                  5) The Iowa Caucus is stupid and is given WAY too much credence by people outside of Iowa.

                  [all points above are true for all candidates from Bernie Sanders to Andrew Yang to Mike Bloomberg]

                  The other truth is that you all are just as liable to fall for the stupid tricks of Putin as anyone. The best part is when you accuse the other side of doing it while using the same misinformation to prove your point. He doesnt care who won this worthless race, but he loves the fallout because all it is is a bunch of monkeys throwing crap at each other.
                  Last edited by Handyman; 02-04-2020, 11:52 AM.
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                  • #24
                    Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

                    Originally posted by bronconick View Post
                    Nevada plans to use the same App for their caucus.
                    They would be better off using the Caesars Rewards app I use when I gamble. That thing is never wrong!

                    So who is Nevada rigging it for
                    "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
                    -aparch

                    "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
                    -INCH

                    Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
                    -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

                    Comment

                    • #25
                      Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

                      Originally posted by Rover View Post
                      But who is actually making this claim? Seems like its a strawman argument.
                      OH! I get it now! When people say "Bernie Bros" they're not saying we're all white guys. They mean "Bernie Bruthas!" as in a bunch of bruthas from the hood. Thanks for clarifying.

                      Yes, you are correct upon further review you said "one of the most". My take on diversity is who is supporting the candidate amongst the voters. A cynical candidate could easily manipulate his co-chairs to show a lot of diversity for public consumption. However, whether or not non-whites, women, etc are supporting you is "black and white" for lack of a better term. Sanders himself seemed to struggle with that in the 2016 primaries and I'd be somewhat surprised to see that Sanders has MORE POC support than Obama did just to name two recent examples....
                      Yeah, these aren't just co-chairs. The campaign manager is a Muslim Pakastani-American. The political director is a Latina. Her deputy is a Muslim woman. The communications director is a woman. Her deputy is a Latina. His senior policy adviser is Kurt Ehrenberg a...oh damm, a white guy. Guess that proves it. All those POC are just figureheads. Kurt Ehrenberg is the real power here.

                      Comment

                      • #26
                        Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

                        Originally posted by bronconick View Post
                        Nevada plans to use the same App for their caucus.
                        mckinsey and co approved
                        a legend and an out of work bum look a lot alike, daddy.

                        Comment

                        • #27
                          Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

                          Originally posted by ticapnews View Post
                          OH! I get it now! When people say "Bernie Bros" they're not saying we're all white guys. They mean "Bernie Bruthas!" as in a bunch of bruthas from the hood. Thanks for clarifying.
                          Bernie Bro doesn't have anything to do with the whiteness of his supporters. We mean a subset of annoying Bernie supporters (of which you and Trix may be members). You're one that conflates a complaint against a certain vocal and obnoxious subset of Bernies supporters with ALL of his supporters

                          Comment

                          • #28
                            Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

                            Originally posted by Handyman View Post
                            So who is Nevada rigging it for
                            Michael Corleone

                            Comment

                            • #29
                              Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

                              Originally posted by bronconick View Post
                              Nevada plans to use the same App for their caucus.
                              Still?

                              LOL. That's special.
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                              National Champion 1967, 1970
                              ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
                              Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

                              Comment

                              • #30
                                Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

                                Originally posted by BassAle View Post
                                Bernie Bro doesn't have anything to do with the whiteness of his supporters. We mean a subset of annoying Bernie supporters (of which you and Trix may be members). You're one that conflates a complaint against a certain vocal and obnoxious subset of Bernies supporters with ALL of his supporters
                                Right. So when people here post

                                I have no issues with Bernie per se. It's his supporters I can't stand. They're the Boston fans of politics.
                                100% This. I like Bernie. I can't stand the Bernie Bros.
                                They really just mean a small subset of supporters. Strange though. If it's such a small subset of supporters that they would get so upset about it.

                                As much fun as this has been I actually have things to do. Ta!

                                Comment

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