Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

Collapse
This topic is closed.
X
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

    Originally posted by trixR4kids View Post
    lololololololol
    are you 12 years old?

    Comment


    • Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

      Originally posted by BassAle View Post
      are you 12 years old?
      You've literally contributed nothing to any of these threads other than attacking me so kindly **** off.

      Comment


      • Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

        Originally posted by Kepler View Post
        Can you elaborate?
        Sure These are just based on arguments me and you have had...there could be more

        1) Mayor Pete shows the center is stronger than you ever give it credit for. A few weeks ago we had a discussion about this and you tried to infer that right now the Far Left and Far Right are where the power is or is headed. (I will concede the Far Right obviously) If the Far Left is as powerful as you want to pretend it is, Mayor Pete would be screwed. If his base is strong...the Far Left is in some trouble.

        2) The Democrats need diversity on the ticket. I guess technically the entire dais of Democrats proves that wrong...but Mayor Pete showing strong numbers makes him as good of a choice for Veep as any of the names you trot out in your (its not racist cause I am a Liberal) schtick. Veep Pete locks up the nom for anyone not named Biden.

        3) The Midwest matters. This really chaps your *** Right now it seems a significant portion want someone who isnt frothing at the mouth over every issue or every tweet.

        4) There are undecideds. The votes that came out for Pete are not all guaranteed to vote Biden or Bernie or Warren, hell they might not like a lot of them. They might also not much care for Trump. Pete is the guy that 10-15% can get behind because he isnt ridiculously crazy Left and his isnt a Nazi. He is just your average White Politician many of us grew up seeing in every election. He doesnt want Forever Wars, he doesnt want to give everything away for free, he doesnt want to restrict voting or Rights for people, and he doesnt want to get bogged down in a ****ing contest over the bonafides for everyone on every single issue. He is Milquetoast, he is the antithesis of everything that the last 4 years for both parties have been about. In most elections he would be looking for a soft landing spot already but right now he speaks to a percentage of the electorate that is sort of done with all of this. No more telling us why SOCIALISM!!1! is bad, or why a candidate sucks because she has friends on Wall Street...just your average guy who served in the military, got a very good education and can talk to people without getting in their face. People right now seem to miss that.

        Look I dont think it lasts...I think South Carolina will be the beginning of the end for him. (unless the major players split all 4 of the early results in which case...GAME ON GRAB THE POPCORN SUPER TUESDAY JUST GOT FUN!) But I think Pete shows that while the majority are tribal, in truth there is a group of voters that are being sidelined with the shifting of the focus of the Parties to the fringes. (something I myself have little issue with) Now the True Believers will tell you they dont exist which is why you seem to discount them all the time but they are there and they are the difference. These arent the people you "drag along with you" they are the people you welcome with open arms and let them get to where you are on a track that is comfortable to them.

        BTW I am using you for this because we discuss this here. You are a stand in for a lot of people on the Left who seem to forget you can be a Democrat and not think everything we want needs to happen on Day 1. it is ok for incremental change. (which I know you know you have argued it before) Right now it seems a large vocal segment of the Dems forget that. The Dems lost a lot of that area in the last decade and it can be won back. Those people I believe make up a lot of the Pete fans and they are showing you the road map to get them back.
        "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
        -aparch

        "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
        -INCH

        Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
        -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

        Comment


        • Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

          Not going to pretend I remember what Kep argued about Mayor Pete but I'm guessing his prediction was based on what would happen nationally rather than in Iowa.

          Comment


          • Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

            Originally posted by Kepler
            Did trix say Warren isn't a progressive? If he did that's incorrect (and so am I) but I doubt he did.
            I believe he intimated she was a Centrist who was "Wall Street Friendly". He absolutely questioned whether she was a Progressive or not. I bet if you ask him right now he will again though her numbers are going down so he probably doesnt have the zeal for her he once did. If she polls well before NH or Nevada though you will see it.

            Since I have no issue with either candidate I just dont get it but whatever I am just a Conservadem anyways
            "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
            -aparch

            "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
            -INCH

            Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
            -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

            Comment


            • Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

              I never claimed she isn't running as a progressive.

              Comment


              • Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

                Originally posted by trixR4kids View Post
                Not going to pretend I remember what Kep argued about Mayor Pete but I'm guessing his prediction was based on what would happen nationally rather than in Iowa.
                And he may end up being correct...but I bet Pete polls about the same everywhere. Not good enough to win but good enough to make a difference. (i.e. better than say Yang, Bloomberg and even Amy outside the Midwest) I think the vocal masses are drowning out a large segment of the populace and they seem to like him. Kepler seems to act like they dont exist, which is something I see a lot in this Party.

                I dont think Iowa much matters in the grand scheme of things, never have. But I think if you take what unofan says at face value it is quite telling. Think of Pete in Iowa as the A's with Moneyball. They never won with the strategy (the Moneyball team lost to the Twins in the playoffs to prove that point!) but it showed the value of other metrics as a way to look at the game. Soon the big spenders adopted it and used to become dominant. Pete is showing there is more to the people than just the loud people shouting from the sides, and it is a large enough swath to not only help take the nomination but to beat Trump.
                "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
                -aparch

                "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
                -INCH

                Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
                -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

                Comment


                • Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

                  Originally posted by trixR4kids View Post
                  I never claimed she isn't running as a progressive.
                  So then you admit she is a Progressive? If so I will mea culpa.
                  "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
                  -aparch

                  "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
                  -INCH

                  Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
                  -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Handyman View Post
                    So then you admit she is a Progressive? If so I will mea culpa.
                    He specifically said "running" as a progressive vs "is" a progressive.

                    Similar to Bernie running as a Democrat vs is a Democrat.

                    Comment


                    • Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

                      Ideology by candidate:
                      Code:
                      SANDERS       SOCIALIST
                      BIDEN         CENTRIST
                      WARREN        LIBERAL
                      BUTTIGIEG     CENTRIST
                      BLOOMBERG     RICH
                      KLOBUCHAR     CENTRIST
                      YANG          ADORABLE
                      STEYER        RICH
                      GABBARD       RUSSIAN
                      Cornell University
                      National Champion 1967, 1970
                      ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
                      Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Kepler View Post
                        Ideology by candidate:
                        Code:
                        SANDERS       SOCIALIST
                        BIDEN         CENTRIST
                        WARREN        LIBERAL
                        BUTTIGIEG     CENTRIST
                        BLOOMBERG     RICH
                        KLOBUCHAR     CENTRIST
                        YANG          ADORABLE
                        STEYER        RICH
                        GABBARD       RUSSIAN
                        Stop using socialist.
                        **NOTE: The misleading post above was brought to you by Reynold's Wrap and American Steeples, makers of Crosses.

                        Originally Posted by dropthatpuck-Scooby's a lost cause.
                        Originally Posted by First Time, Long Time-Always knew you were nothing but a troll.

                        Comment


                        • Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

                          Originally posted by Handyman View Post
                          Sure These are just based on arguments me and you have had...there could be more
                          Fair enough. I'm repetitive; I'm sure I've said the same thing 20x at great and greater length.

                          1) Mayor Pete shows the center is stronger than you ever give it credit for. A few weeks ago we had a discussion about this and you tried to infer that right now the Far Left and Far Right are where the power is or is headed. (I will concede the Far Right obviously) If the Far Left is as powerful as you want to pretend it is, Mayor Pete would be screwed. If his base is strong...the Far Left is in some trouble.
                          I'll concede that. When I say the middle doesn't exist what I have in mind is a hypothetical voter who could go Dem or GOP. I don't believe she exists anymore. I do think, though, that the Dems have the (old) Center and the Left. The difference is subtle but what I am trying to argue is that Moderates are now all Democrats. Further I argue that the Moderates are now the ones "stuck" with voting blue. We can go as far Left as we want and nobody will switch, but more nobody will stay home. When you're fighting Nazis you don't ask what the hemline of your candidate is.

                          2) The Democrats need diversity on the ticket. I guess technically the entire dais of Democrats proves that wrong...but Mayor Pete showing strong numbers makes him as good of a choice for Veep as any of the names you trot out in your (its not racist cause I am a Liberal) schtick. Veep Pete locks up the nom for anyone not named Biden.
                          A 90% white state votes for white people and you think that proves something about POC? I am not following your reasoning.

                          3) The Midwest matters. This really chaps your *** Right now it seems a significant portion want someone who isnt frothing at the mouth over every issue or every tweet.
                          You sound like a Bostonian. The difference between the flyovers and the coasts is the flyovers think the coasts despise them and the coasts just don't care. I have people from Kenya, Iraq, Britain, and Kansas on my trivia team. I don't care where anybody is from. Stop being insecure, I realize the Midwest is nothing special either way. It's just as full of self-pitying, self-absorbed sh-t as NYC, Cali, or other places people would want to live.

                          4) There are undecideds. The votes that came out for Pete are not all guaranteed to vote Biden or Bernie or Warren, hell they might not like a lot of them. They might also not much care for Trump. Pete is the guy that 10-15% can get behind because he isnt ridiculously crazy Left and his isnt a Nazi. He is just your average White Politician many of us grew up seeing in every election. He doesnt want Forever Wars, he doesnt want to give everything away for free, he doesnt want to restrict voting or Rights for people, and he doesnt want to get bogged down in a ****ing contest over the bonafides for everyone on every single issue. He is Milquetoast, he is the antithesis of everything that the last 4 years for both parties have been about. In most elections he would be looking for a soft landing spot already but right now he speaks to a percentage of the electorate that is sort of done with all of this. No more telling us why SOCIALISM!!1! is bad, or why a candidate sucks because she has friends on Wall Street...just your average guy who served in the military, got a very good education and can talk to people without getting in their face. People right now seem to miss that.
                          I don't believe there are D/R undecideds. There are certainly undecided D's.

                          Look I dont think it lasts...I think South Carolina will be the beginning of the end for him. (unless the major players split all 4 of the early results in which case...GAME ON GRAB THE POPCORN SUPER TUESDAY JUST GOT FUN!) But I think Pete shows that while the majority are tribal, in truth there is a group of voters that are being sidelined with the shifting of the focus of the Parties to the fringes. (something I myself have little issue with) Now the True Believers will tell you they dont exist which is why you seem to discount them all the time but they are there and they are the difference. These arent the people you "drag along with you" they are the people you welcome with open arms and let them get to where you are on a track that is comfortable to them.
                          I'm fine with Pete doing well. His economics is blah but it's certainly no worse than Clinton's and I think he won't be so craven as to give everything to the Plutes immediately upon inauguration. I think Pete's fiscal policy would be likely the same as Bam's. Sure beats NASDAP.

                          BTW I am using you for this because we discuss this here. You are a stand in for a lot of people on the Left who seem to forget you can be a Democrat and not think everything we want needs to happen on Day 1. it is ok for incremental change. (which I know you know you have argued it before) Right now it seems a large vocal segment of the Dems forget that. The Dems lost a lot of that area in the last decade and it can be won back. Those people I believe make up a lot of the Pete fans and they are showing you the road map to get them back.
                          I'm fine with that. We're all trying to expand the field as much as possible. I should probably remember that trolling isn't always the best way to make a good thousandth impression. Anyway, if my milkshake brings all the reds to the yard, and yours brings all the conservadems, and trix' brings all the tweaked out paranoids, and Rover's brings all the fatuous Wendy's middle managers then we'll have a big enough turnout to shoot the GOP back to their reptilian Nazi base on the dark side of the Moon.
                          Last edited by Kepler; 02-05-2020, 12:05 PM.
                          Cornell University
                          National Champion 1967, 1970
                          ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
                          Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

                          Comment


                          • Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

                            Originally posted by Kepler View Post
                            Ideology by candidate:
                            Code:
                            SANDERS       SOCIALIST
                            BIDEN         CENTRIST
                            WARREN        LIBERAL
                            BUTTIGIEG     CENTRIST
                            BLOOMBERG     RICH
                            KLOBUCHAR     CENTRIST
                            YANG          ADORABLE
                            STEYER        RICH
                            GABBARD       RUSSIAN
                            uh, this yang isn't a chick
                            a legend and an out of work bum look a lot alike, daddy.

                            Comment


                            • Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

                              Originally posted by mookie1995 View Post
                              uh, this yang isn't a chick
                              All Asians are vaguely feminine.
                              Cornell University
                              National Champion 1967, 1970
                              ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
                              Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

                              Comment


                              • Re: Democratic Challengers 9: Can we climb this mountain? I don't know.

                                Originally posted by Kepler View Post
                                All Asians are vaguely feminine.
                                like kepler is ever getting a yellow library card

                                .....just because the males suffer from SAPS
                                a legend and an out of work bum look a lot alike, daddy.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X