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2020 Democratic Challengers VII: Bon Voyage Beto

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  • Originally posted by Kepler View Post
    My opinion, yours may vary:

    72 McGovern Left Lost
    76 Carter Center Won
    80 Carter Center Lost
    84 Mondale Left Lost
    88 Dukakis Center Lost
    92 Clinton Left Won
    96 Clinton Center Won
    00 Gore Center Lost
    04 Kerry Center Lost
    08 Obama Left Won
    12 Obama Center Won
    16 Hillary Center Lost

    Left: 2-2
    Center: 3-5

    I move both Clinton and Obama from Left in their first election for what they ran as to Center in the re-election for their record.

    I would like to point out, however that since 1984 the record is:

    Left: 2-0
    Center: 2-4

    and both Center wins got into office in the first place by running as Left.
    I don’t think I’d put Dukakis as “center”... and B Clinton/ Obama were mayyybe boarderline left their first go around..

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    • Originally posted by Deutsche Gopher Fan View Post
      Obama is a smart guy. :-)

      Comment


      • Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers VII: Bon Voyage Beto

        Originally posted by Kepler View Post
        JFK was not a liberal. His foreign policy was more hawkish than Eisenhower and his fear of communism was legendary. He cut the top marginal tax rate by more than Reagan did.

        We remember JFK as a liberal darling because Bobby was a liberal (and the brains of the outfit) and because he was murdered and is therefore a Democratic Saint. But he was backpeddling from FDR as fast as his shapely legs could go. It was LBJ himself who enacted the great liberal policies of the 60s but he was destroyed by Vietnam.
        Correct. But, oh no, AOC, the squad, and Bernie.
        **NOTE: The misleading post above was brought to you by Reynold's Wrap and American Steeples, makers of Crosses.

        Originally Posted by dropthatpuck-Scooby's a lost cause.
        Originally Posted by First Time, Long Time-Always knew you were nothing but a troll.

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        • Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers VII: Bon Voyage Beto

          Originally posted by The Rube View Post
          .

          This is what some of the uber-left don't realize about themselves.
          No one here is "über-left", except for maybe trix and ticap. Kep thinks he's über-left, but he's too old and too rich to be accepted into the revolutionary brotherhood.

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          • Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers VII: Bon Voyage Beto

            Originally posted by FadeToBlack&Gold View Post
            No one here is "über-left", except for maybe trix and ticap. Kep thinks he's über-left, but he's too old and too rich to be accepted into the revolutionary brotherhood.
            I would nominate rufie and Scoobs. I agree on Kep.
            Never really developed a taste for tequila. Kind of hard to understand how you make a drink out of something that sharp, inhospitable. Now, bourbon is easy to understand.
            Tastes like a warm summer day. -Raylan Givens

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            • Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers VII: Bon Voyage Beto

              Originally posted by FadeToBlack&Gold View Post
              No one here is "über-left", except for maybe trix and ticap. Kep thinks he's über-left, but he's too old and too rich to be accepted into the revolutionary brotherhood.
              Hey! Leftist Poseur is all I got, man.
              Cornell University
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              • Originally posted by ericredaxe View Post
                Obama is a smart guy. :-)
                The dems lost like 1000 state seats and every lever of power in the federal government largely due to his management of the party.

                Comment


                • Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers VII: Bon Voyage Beto

                  Originally posted by trixR4kids View Post
                  The dems lost like 1000 state seats and every lever of power in the federal government largely due to his management of the party.
                  This is another fact that people just don't understand or get. Not only did he lose all those seats while he ran the party but he also tried over and over and over again to negotiate with the terrorists.
                  **NOTE: The misleading post above was brought to you by Reynold's Wrap and American Steeples, makers of Crosses.

                  Originally Posted by dropthatpuck-Scooby's a lost cause.
                  Originally Posted by First Time, Long Time-Always knew you were nothing but a troll.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
                    This is another fact that people just don't understand or get. Not only did he lose all those seats while he ran the party but he also tried over and over and over again to negotiate with the terrorists.
                    Probably because they’re borderline republicans and don’t actually care about winning or taking the type of steps necessary to restore peoples’ faith in government and sustainably defeat fascism long term.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
                      This is another fact that people just don't understand or get. Not only did he lose all those seats while he ran the party but he also tried over and over and over again to negotiate with the terrorists.
                      Well considering the Democrats only had control of the House and Senate from 09-11 in his 8 years...he didn't really have a choice but to try and work with Republicans to get things passed.
                      You keep hammering this negotiate with terrorists narrative but unless you have a majority...things aren't going to get passed otherwise.
                      Hell the Republicans had a majority when Trump was elected and a lot of things still didn't get passed and nothing is being passed now.
                      Vote them out sure...but without the majority...i'd love to know how you expect legislation to get done without negotiations...
                      "If you leave ignorance and stupidity alone, ignorance and stupidity will think it's ok."
                      -Gallagher

                      R.I.P.
                      Grandpa G. ~ Feb 11, 1918-Oct. 6, 1999
                      Grandma ~ Jan 2004
                      Dad ~ Nov. 4, 1958-April 21, 2008
                      Grandpa S. ~ June 21, 1932-November 11, 2013

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                      • Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers VII: Bon Voyage Beto

                        Yes but let’s not act like giving banks money to illegally foreclose peoples’ homes (putting black wealth and home ownership rates back to what they were 100 years prior) whole offering virtually nothing to homeowners did nothing to lead to that wave election cycle.

                        Obviously I see your point that he can’t really negotiate with a side that has no interest in doing so but it’s not like he did anything to keep the power he initially had either.
                        Last edited by trixR4kids; 11-16-2019, 11:27 AM.

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                        • Originally posted by trixR4kids View Post
                          Probably because they’re borderline republicans and don’t actually care about winning or taking the type of steps necessary to restore peoples’ faith in government and sustainably defeat fascism long term.
                          Go Fark yourself, you myopic nincompoop.

                          Comment


                          • Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers VII: Bon Voyage Beto

                            Originally posted by trixR4kids View Post
                            The dems lost like 1000 state seats and every lever of power in the federal government largely due to his management of the party.
                            No. This was debunked by 538, as I have repeatedly demonstrated, and I believe at one point you even accepted that and apologized for continuing to use it. The Dems' losses down ticket and in state legs were in the range of other presidencies. Likewise, Dump and the GOP have been hemorrhaging downticket seats.

                            Please retire this talking point. I understand it is attractive given our impatience with the party apparatus' "pragmatic" betrayal of liberals in order to field centrist candidates who then lose because of their lack of appeal and inability to broaden the electoral base. I share your frustration with the narratives that apparently never die that the only way for us to win is to tip toe around the Plutes' aggressive bullsh-t about "job creation" or "punishing success."

                            I get all that.

                            But the talking about Obama losing 1000 state leg seats because he was a wimp has been refuted. It is dead. One difference between liberals and conservatives is we do not continue to repeat untruths simply because they are useful.
                            Cornell University
                            National Champion 1967, 1970
                            ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
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                            • Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers VII: Bon Voyage Beto

                              538 is trash and didn’t debunk that point at all lol. It wasn’t because he was a wimp, it’s because he went back on a lot of his campaign promises and his actions didn’t come close to resembling his rhetoric at which point people lost even more faith in our democracy and didn’t turn out for Hillary or any of the down ballot elections.
                              Last edited by trixR4kids; 11-16-2019, 11:58 AM.

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                              • Originally posted by trixR4kids View Post
                                Yes but let’s not act like giving banks money to illegally foreclose peoples’ homes (putting black wealth and home ownership rates back to what they were 100 years prior) whole offering virtually nothing to homeowners did nothing to lead to that wave election cycle.

                                Obviously I see your point that he can’t really negotiate with a side that has no interest in doing so but it’s not like he did anything to keep the power he initially had either.
                                See Kepler.
                                Blaming it all on Obama is short-sighted.
                                And BTW...your boy Bernie...isnt going to be some magic uniter either.
                                "If you leave ignorance and stupidity alone, ignorance and stupidity will think it's ok."
                                -Gallagher

                                R.I.P.
                                Grandpa G. ~ Feb 11, 1918-Oct. 6, 1999
                                Grandma ~ Jan 2004
                                Dad ~ Nov. 4, 1958-April 21, 2008
                                Grandpa S. ~ June 21, 1932-November 11, 2013

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