UVM Catamounts 2019/20

[Mikey NoNo]

Re: UVM Catamounts 2019/20

Max is indeed Nick’s brother.

[jcarter7669]

Re: UVM Catamounts 2019/20

How much of the budgetary issues start with the fact that less people are going to games?

It's a good point... just browsing box scores from this season, attendance seems to be averaging around 3300. That's a $15,000 / game loss in revenue, or somewhere around $280,000 annual loss of revenue. Sneddon has done a LOT of harm to this program, both in fan loyalty as well as financially. If he hadn't wasted an 8 year waiting list for season ticket holders we'd still be able to afford another assistant coach

[Charlie Catamount]

Re: UVM Catamounts 2019/20

It's a good point... just browsing box scores from this season, attendance seems to be averaging around 3300. That's a $15,000 / game loss in revenue, or somewhere around $280,000 annual loss of revenue. Sneddon has done a LOT of harm to this program, both in fan loyalty as well as financially. If he hadn't wasted an 8 year waiting list for season ticket holders we'd still be able to afford another assistant coach

And that 3300 could be paid attendance too meaning they are counting their season ticket holders I think who might not go to every game or are corporate seats that don't get filled. At least that is how it was but maybe with the scanner things they get an actual number but I could easily see them doing the paid attendance route to not make it look as dire as what anyone can see on the highlights. Either way seems pretty clear that reduction in the budget is tied to on ice performance and if the next coach can dig them out of the hole back to being competitive and respectable while not dwelling in the basement every year you would see more butts in the seats along with more money set aside for the program since it is easy logic that winning = money. UVM would also be wise to make sure the next coach is allowed the coaching budget from 2017 and not this year's otherwise you will be hard pressed to find someone willing to take the job.

[Sean Pickett]

Re: UVM Catamounts 2019/20

And that 3300 could be paid attendance too meaning they are counting their season ticket holders I think who might not go to every game or are corporate seats that don't get filled. At least that is how it was but maybe with the scanner things they get an actual number but I could easily see them doing the paid attendance route to not make it look as dire as what anyone can see on the highlights. Either way seems pretty clear that reduction in the budget is tied to on ice performance and if the next coach can dig them out of the hole back to being competitive and respectable while not dwelling in the basement every year you would see more butts in the seats along with more money set aside for the program since it is easy logic that winning = money. UVM would also be wise to make sure the next coach is allowed the coaching budget from 2017 and not this year's otherwise you will be hard pressed to find someone willing to take the job.

I'm waiting on all the schools 2019 NCAA reports to update my financials spreadsheet, but here are Vermont's men's hockey revenue from 2010 through 2018:



As can be seen ticket sales have dropped some from 2016, while the athletic department stopped using student fees in 2018 to partially fund the hockey program. The department reports no revenue from game programs, novelties, food and concessions or parking for the athletic department overall, not just hockey.

Sean

[UVM Cat in Texas]

Re: UVM Catamounts 2019/20

I'm waiting on all the schools 2019 NCAA reports to update my financials spreadsheet, but here are Vermont's men's hockey revenue from 2010 through 2018:



As can be seen ticket sales have dropped some from 2016, while the athletic department stopped using student fees in 2018 to partially fund the hockey program. The department reports no revenue from game programs, novelties, food and concessions or parking for the athletic department overall, not just hockey.

Sean

Wow, almost a $575,000 drop in operating revenue from the high in 2016 to 2018. That's gotta leave a mark.

[Sean Pickett]

Re: UVM Catamounts 2019/20

Wow, almost a $575,000 drop in operating revenue from the high in 2016 to 2018. That's gotta leave a mark.

Yes and no. A large part of the revenue comes directly from the school, so it is just going from one bucket to another and the athletic department was making the hockey program look good. The program's actual expenses over the same time were generally lower so it appears the department lowered their direct support. That ticket revenue also decline may have been unexpected. Below is the program's overall and earned revenue, expenses, and overall and earned profit/loss:



As can be seen, the program didn't have an earned profit during the time period I have their reports for. Furthermore, the earned loss reached almost $1 million in 2018 as expenses rose and earned revenue dropped.

Sean

[Charlie Catamount]

Re: UVM Catamounts 2019/20

Wow, almost a $575,000 drop in operating revenue from the high in 2016 to 2018. That's gotta leave a mark.

I could see the student fee number being redirected elsewhere at the moment mainly the new basketball arena and Gutterson renovations plus the new fitness center. I think they still charge students the tickets and facilities fee right? The timeline would be lined up because in 2018 was when they really finalized the plans to get started on it. If you look at the records and match them to ticket sales it mostly lines up. 2010-2013 were bad and that also is probably when the wait list began to dwindle and they got a lot of new season ticket holders which could explain the bump in 2012 and 2013 despite the bad results? 2014 they were solid and made the NCAAs but 2015 they were bad again and 2016 was their best season in league in the last decade (6th place) so that makes sense and of course after that all makes sense. Would be really interesting to see what 2019 and 2020 show in that number.

Even if Sneddon wanted to complain about the operating revenue hurting his job there's pretty strong correlation that they'll get the money when the team does well and that's his job (2014 and 2016 two better seasons two highest operating revenue seasons).

[PrezdeJohnson09]

Re: UVM Catamounts 2019/20

Per UVM men's hockey page about 10 minutes ago...

Kevin Sneddon retiring at the end of the season.

https://uvmathletics.com/news/2020/2...of-season.aspx

[TovarishchLisa]

Re: UVM Catamounts 2019/20

Per UVM men's hockey page about 10 minutes ago...

Kevin Sneddon retiring at the end of the season.

https://uvmathletics.com/news/2020/2...of-season.aspx

Finally. The search begins.

[pokecheckguy2]

Re: UVM Catamounts 2019/20

YES!!!! them letting him get to retire is a joke but the deed has been done and its the first win for the Cats in a long time!!!

[theprofromdover]

Re: UVM Catamounts 2019/20

Per UVM men's hockey page about 10 minutes ago...

Kevin Sneddon retiring at the end of the season.

https://uvmathletics.com/news/2020/2...of-season.aspx

Congratulations to all the Catamount fans who have deserved better.

[j24vt]

Re: UVM Catamounts 2019/20

I'm glad they are doing an open search instead of blindly promoting Kevin Patrick

[UVM Cat in Texas]

Re: UVM Catamounts 2019/20

Yes!!! Let the rebuilding begin!!! Best news for this program in a long time.

[The Zlax45]

Re: UVM Catamounts 2019/20

Jim Montgomery would be my first call...

[Catamount93]

Re: UVM Catamounts 2019/20

First, much thanks to Sneddon for his service. Despite where we've ended up, the Cats did have some good moments under him.

Only real issue I have is that what is happening today should have happened a few years ago. Just took a few years too long, and I put that more on the AD than Sneddon.

Excited to see the direction the program takes moving forward. Feels great to be able to follow the team with interest again as we chart a new path.

For what it is worth, I'd look for a new coach who:

-is willing to play a more aggressive, open style of offensive hockey
-has proven college hockey recruiting credentials
-has shown an excellent track record of coaching special teams
-is interested in focusing on pairwise success and the national tournament as primary goals

We are not going to be a national contender every year, and no one expects that. But what alums do expect is credibly trying to make the NCAA tournament each year. Many years we won't make it, but I don't think it is absurd to hope that you'd be watching hockey in February most years with a chance to get there if things fall your way. And, win or lose, I think fans are done with losing games where we score 0 or 1 goal. It's just not fun to watch and virtually impossible to be successful that way.

And let's focus on making the NCAAs. Personally, I don't care about winning Hockey East other than as a means to getting to the national tournament. This is the sport where we can legitimately content for national titles and ignite the alumni base. Let's go for it, and I've got donation money ready when I see that commitment.