QuasiCosmos
Member
Interesting that ECAC travel partners are 1-2, 3-4, 5-6, 7-8, 9-10 and 11-12.
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ECAC '24-25: Who rebuilds? Who reloads?
- Thread starter BowWowWow
- Start date
thirdtime's . . .
Active member
A famous coach once said, "You are what your record says you are". And for Harvard, that means they are the worst team in D-1 women's college hockey (go look it up if you don't believe me). Harvard has two distinct problems. 1. a talent deficit when compared to the rest of the league. They simply cannot skate with the better teams. They are routinely outshot by wide margins and if not for their goalies, would get blown out of most games. (Exhibit A: yesterday's game against Cornell. Outshot 30-8) 2. They have a loser's mentality. By that, I mean that losing has become a way of life inside the program for the past two years. The team expects bad things to happen and it usually does. To wit, the recent games against BU and Colgate. Those were very winnable games even with the talent gap.
Maura Crowell is going through the same thing at Dartmouth. If she can recruit better players, the program will see better days. Hopefully the same is true for Harvard. I'm not convinced that Bellamy is the right coach for the job but time will tell. No question that the fallout from the Stone debacle has affected the program and it may take years for them to recover.
Calling Klaus Kinski! Calling Klaus Kinski!
Oh for the good old forum days when one could post the monkey scene from Aguirre, The Wrath of God.
A full slate of games today and tomorrow, including Colgate and Cornell hosting St. Lawrence and Clarkson:
- Clarkson at Colgate and SLU at Cornell this evening
- SLU at Colgate and Clarkson at Cornell tomorrow afternoon
Those are the only matchups of ranked teams vs ranked teams in the ECAC. All games should be good!
- Clarkson at Colgate and SLU at Cornell this evening
- SLU at Colgate and Clarkson at Cornell tomorrow afternoon
Those are the only matchups of ranked teams vs ranked teams in the ECAC. All games should be good!
Here is a nice resource on women's hockey recruiting for all conferences, made by Sydney Wolf.
As a note to add, D I conferences (it does not include D III).Here is a nice resource on women's hockey recruiting for all conferences, made by Sydney Wolf.
All ECAC teams have four regular-season games left to play, this weekend and next weekend. A lot of standings positions are up for grabs, as the only gap in the standings that is 6 points (2 regulation wins) or more is between 10th-place RPI and 11th-place Dartmouth.
Top four teams will have a first-round bye in the league playoffs. Teams 5-8 will host teams 9-12 in the first round.
Top four teams will have a first-round bye in the league playoffs. Teams 5-8 will host teams 9-12 in the first round.
Standings at end of season:
1 Cornell
2 Colgate
3 St. Lawrence
4 Clarkson
5 Quinnipiac
6 Yale
7 Princeton
8 Brown
9 Union
10 RPI
11 Dartmouth
12 Harvard
Union and RPI have the same number of points, but Union has the tiebreak between them.
The first round of the playoffs next Saturday (2/22) will be:
12 Harvard at 5 Quinnipiac
11 Dartmouth at 6 Yale
10 RPI at 7 Princeton
9 Union at 8 Brown
The winners of these single-elimination games will play series at the rinks of the top 4 finishers in the ECAC the next weekend (2/28 - 3/2). The teams will be re-seeded after each round (meaning the top remaining seed plays the lowest remaining seed - and so on).
The semifinals and finals will be single-elimination games hosted by the top remaining seed on March 7-8.
1 Cornell
2 Colgate
3 St. Lawrence
4 Clarkson
5 Quinnipiac
6 Yale
7 Princeton
8 Brown
9 Union
10 RPI
11 Dartmouth
12 Harvard
Union and RPI have the same number of points, but Union has the tiebreak between them.
The first round of the playoffs next Saturday (2/22) will be:
12 Harvard at 5 Quinnipiac
11 Dartmouth at 6 Yale
10 RPI at 7 Princeton
9 Union at 8 Brown
The winners of these single-elimination games will play series at the rinks of the top 4 finishers in the ECAC the next weekend (2/28 - 3/2). The teams will be re-seeded after each round (meaning the top remaining seed plays the lowest remaining seed - and so on).
The semifinals and finals will be single-elimination games hosted by the top remaining seed on March 7-8.
To be fair, 9 of Harvard's non-wins were decided by 1 goal, losing 6 of them in OT. They were shut out 7x and only scored one goal 11x. Harvard has a rich history and will right the ship. Getting swept twice by the Capital District any given w/e is concerning!A famous coach once said, "You are what your record says you are". And for Harvard, that means they are the worst team in D-1 women's college hockey (go look it up if you don't believe me). Harvard has two distinct problems. 1. a talent deficit when compared to the rest of the league. They simply cannot skate with the better teams. They are routinely outshot by wide margins and if not for their goalies, would get blown out of most games. (Exhibit A: yesterday's game against Cornell. Outshot 30-8) 2. They have a loser's mentality. By that, I mean that losing has become a way of life inside the program for the past two years. The team expects bad things to happen and it usually does. To wit, the recent games against BU and Colgate. Those were very winnable games even with the talent gap.
Maura Crowell is going through the same thing at Dartmouth. If she can recruit better players, the program will see better days. Hopefully the same is true for Harvard. I'm not convinced that Bellamy is the right coach for the job but time will tell. No question that the fallout from the Stone debacle has affected the program and it may take years for them to recover.
Am surprised by Crowell and thought she could have been a contender at 'Gate. I guess the jury is still out on her but with her experience, expectations were higher and rightfully so.
Bill, you're making my point. To lose that many games by either one goal or being shut out says something about talent deficiency and perhaps a lack of coaching acumen to get the team to improve, even by a small margin. That hasn't happened and I don't see the ship turning around any time soon. I hope I'm wrong but recent history says otherwise.To be fair, 9 of Harvard's non-wins were decided by 1 goal, losing 6 of them in OT. They were shut out 7x and only scored one goal 11x. Harvard has a rich history and will right the ship. Getting swept twice by the Capital District any given w/e is concerning!
Am surprised by Crowell and thought she could have been a contender at 'Gate. I guess the jury is still out on her but with her experience, expectations were higher and rightfully so.
Regarding Crowell, I, too, was surprised that she didn't take the Colgate job. The rebuild in front of her is similar to Harvard. Recruiting for the Ivies and smaller schools like Union and RPI is no small task in this era of NIL. Harvard's issues have been well documented so no need to rehash.
Well, there was one upset! And it was Union over Brown. A close game, though - Union was ahead 1-0 most of the game and added an empty-netter in the waning seconds. Quinnipiac, Yale, Princeton, and Union advance. (RPI-Princeton was also close.)Any upsets in the first round??? It is unfortunate that the two programs that have built this year will face each other in round 1. I would have liked to see both Union and Brown advance. RPI may have a shot of upsetting Princeton.
In the next round, the quarters, Cornell will host Union, Colgate will host Princeton, St. Lawrence will host Yale, and Clarkson will host Quinnipiac. Cornell had their first loss to Union at Lynah this season.
The rest of this post is going to be some speculation...
Clarkson and Quinnipiac are toward the edge of national tournament qualification. Quinnipiac is in 9th, and Clarkson in 10th. I've been experimenting with TonyTheTiger's Pairwise predictor. Here are some possibilities for Clarkson and Quinnipiac:
- If Clarkson takes care of business (so to speak) against Quinnipiac at home in the ECAC tournament, though (no small task against a team ranked about the same in Pairwise) -- and then if they also face and beat Cornell in the semis -- Clarkson would be in the NCAA tournament, and Quinnipiac would be out.
- If Clarkson wins in 2 games in the quarters but then loses in the semis (to Cornell, barring upsets), they would still be in, ranked about 8th in Pairwise.
- If Clarkson win in 3 games and lose in the semis, they would probably be in, ranked 9th.
- If Quinnipiac wins the quarters and then loses in the semis, they would be ranked about 9th, with Clarkson out of the NCAA tourney.
- In short, Clarkson and Quinnipiac are fighting not only to advance but potentially to make the NCAA tourney.
Possibilities for other teams:
- St. Lawrence can lose the quarterfinals and still make the tournament. The same goes for Colgate and Cornell. (Some upsets in other conference tournament spots might reduce the number of tournament spots and mean SLU was out after all, though, whereas Colgate and Cornell seem to be locks.)
- Yale, Princeton, and Union need to win the ECAC tournament to make the national tournament.
One game down in each of the Quarterfinals series:
Yale 2 - SLU 3 (OT)
Quinnipiac 3 - Clarkson 1
Union 0 - Cornell 3
Princeton 2 - Colgate 5
Yale-St. Lawrence was the closest game yesterday score-wise. Yet Yale must now win 2 days in a row if they hope to keep their season going.
If Quinnipiac takes their series against Clarkson, the Bobcats will be in position to make the NCAA tournament barring significant upsets elsewhere. They are the only team in the four current ECAC series to take an upset in game one. There's still time for Clarkson to come back.
Cornell remains on track to host the ECAC semis and finals, if they continue to defeat Union in their series. Union has taken a step forward this season. They're being highly outshot by the Big Red, though (42-14 in game one).
Princeton-Colgate is another ranked matchup in addition to Quinnipiac-Clarkson. Princeton has been a high-scoring team this year but also give up above-average goals... In conference games they have only a .907 save percentage and 76.5% PK. They will need to not fall as far behind to Colgate in the next game or two if they have any chance.
Yale 2 - SLU 3 (OT)
Quinnipiac 3 - Clarkson 1
Union 0 - Cornell 3
Princeton 2 - Colgate 5
Yale-St. Lawrence was the closest game yesterday score-wise. Yet Yale must now win 2 days in a row if they hope to keep their season going.
If Quinnipiac takes their series against Clarkson, the Bobcats will be in position to make the NCAA tournament barring significant upsets elsewhere. They are the only team in the four current ECAC series to take an upset in game one. There's still time for Clarkson to come back.
Cornell remains on track to host the ECAC semis and finals, if they continue to defeat Union in their series. Union has taken a step forward this season. They're being highly outshot by the Big Red, though (42-14 in game one).
Princeton-Colgate is another ranked matchup in addition to Quinnipiac-Clarkson. Princeton has been a high-scoring team this year but also give up above-average goals... In conference games they have only a .907 save percentage and 76.5% PK. They will need to not fall as far behind to Colgate in the next game or two if they have any chance.
Advancing to the ECAC semifinals: 1 Cornell, 2 Colgate, 3 St. Lawrence, and 4 Clarkson. On Friday, Cornell will play Clarkson, and Colgate will play St. Lawrence, all at Lynah.
According to the Pairwise predictor, Clarkson could pass St. Lawrence, and move into 8th in the Pairwise, even if Clarkson loses and SLU wins their next game. This is probably because Clarkson wins their head-to-head comparison (2W, 1L, 1T on the season), though their NPI number is a bit lower. (edit: This Pairwise move, though, seems to depend on Boston College beating Boston University in the Hockey East semis, according to the predictor; other results might also tip the scales for these teams.)
According to the Pairwise predictor, Clarkson could pass St. Lawrence, and move into 8th in the Pairwise, even if Clarkson loses and SLU wins their next game. This is probably because Clarkson wins their head-to-head comparison (2W, 1L, 1T on the season), though their NPI number is a bit lower. (edit: This Pairwise move, though, seems to depend on Boston College beating Boston University in the Hockey East semis, according to the predictor; other results might also tip the scales for these teams.)
Semifinals results:
Cornell 2 - Clarkson 1 (3OT)
Colgate 4 - St. Lawrence 2 (including one Colgate empty-netter)
On Saturday afternoon Cornell will host Colgate for the ECAC championship at 3:30 ET.
Meanwhile, in the PWR, Minnesota sits at 3rd. On Saturday afternoon they will play in the WCHA championship, facing Wisconsin (in Duluth) at 2 CT.
If Colgate defeats a possibly-drained Cornell, and if Wisconsin wins against Minnesota -- alongside any other results in other conference championships -- Colgate would move into #3 in the Pairwise. Cornell would drop to 5 and travel to Minnesota for the first round of the NCAA tournament.
(Any combination of BU/Northeastern, Penn St./Mercyhurst, and LIU/Sacred Heart wins seems not to affect these placements or seeds 6-8. So UMD, Penn State, and Clarkson also are in the national tournament as Pairwise #6, 7, and 8. As long as Penn State wins against Mercyhurst, St. Lawrence is in as Pairwise #9. If Mercyhurst wins, St. Lawrence is bumped out, and Hockey East, AHA, and NEWHA receive auto-bids that remove other contenders.)
Back to the ECAC and WCHA, if Cornell fights on and wins the ECAC championship, the Big Red are either #3 or #4. This depends on whether Minnesota stays ahead of Cornell by somehow taking down the Badgers.
If Colgate does beat Cornell, instead, and fellow underdog Minnesota wins, we get the Gophers 3rd, the Raiders 4th, and the Big Red 5th. I guess we'll see what happens -- and send a continued thanks to TTT20 and his BC Interruption predictor for allowing this type of speculation a night or two in advance!
As for the national tourney again, none of this changes Wisconsin and OSU at #1 and 2. I think St. Lawrence would be swapped with the Hockey East champion to avoid an ECAC matchup in the first round with Clarkson (assuming a Penn St. AHA win) -- as discussed a bit more on other threads. (This is the one way in which the committee says they do change the Pairwise bracket.) May the best teams win.
Cornell 2 - Clarkson 1 (3OT)
Colgate 4 - St. Lawrence 2 (including one Colgate empty-netter)
On Saturday afternoon Cornell will host Colgate for the ECAC championship at 3:30 ET.
Meanwhile, in the PWR, Minnesota sits at 3rd. On Saturday afternoon they will play in the WCHA championship, facing Wisconsin (in Duluth) at 2 CT.
If Colgate defeats a possibly-drained Cornell, and if Wisconsin wins against Minnesota -- alongside any other results in other conference championships -- Colgate would move into #3 in the Pairwise. Cornell would drop to 5 and travel to Minnesota for the first round of the NCAA tournament.
(Any combination of BU/Northeastern, Penn St./Mercyhurst, and LIU/Sacred Heart wins seems not to affect these placements or seeds 6-8. So UMD, Penn State, and Clarkson also are in the national tournament as Pairwise #6, 7, and 8. As long as Penn State wins against Mercyhurst, St. Lawrence is in as Pairwise #9. If Mercyhurst wins, St. Lawrence is bumped out, and Hockey East, AHA, and NEWHA receive auto-bids that remove other contenders.)
Back to the ECAC and WCHA, if Cornell fights on and wins the ECAC championship, the Big Red are either #3 or #4. This depends on whether Minnesota stays ahead of Cornell by somehow taking down the Badgers.
If Colgate does beat Cornell, instead, and fellow underdog Minnesota wins, we get the Gophers 3rd, the Raiders 4th, and the Big Red 5th. I guess we'll see what happens -- and send a continued thanks to TTT20 and his BC Interruption predictor for allowing this type of speculation a night or two in advance!
As for the national tourney again, none of this changes Wisconsin and OSU at #1 and 2. I think St. Lawrence would be swapped with the Hockey East champion to avoid an ECAC matchup in the first round with Clarkson (assuming a Penn St. AHA win) -- as discussed a bit more on other threads. (This is the one way in which the committee says they do change the Pairwise bracket.) May the best teams win.
Cornell defeated Colgate yesterday -- 5-1 final! (Cornell's last 2 were empty-netters.) So the Big Red take home the regular-season title and ECAC championship, and they break the Raiders' streak as league champions at 4 years.
The NCAA tournament field looks like it has 4 WCHA teams, 4 ECAC teams, and conference champions of AHA, Hockey East, and the NEWHA. AHA's Penn State makes it both within the at-large field (#7) and as their league's champions, as do Wisconsin (#1) and Cornell (#3).
ECAC teams: Cornell hosts a regional as #3, meaning they play the winner of the first-round game (probably UMD-Sacred Heart). Colgate (#5) will be slotted in to travel to #4 Minnesota. Clarkson and St. Lawrence are expected to make it in at-large, with St. Lawrence the "last team in." This is all pending the NCAA selection announcement on espn+/ESPNU at 11:30am.
The NCAA tournament field looks like it has 4 WCHA teams, 4 ECAC teams, and conference champions of AHA, Hockey East, and the NEWHA. AHA's Penn State makes it both within the at-large field (#7) and as their league's champions, as do Wisconsin (#1) and Cornell (#3).
ECAC teams: Cornell hosts a regional as #3, meaning they play the winner of the first-round game (probably UMD-Sacred Heart). Colgate (#5) will be slotted in to travel to #4 Minnesota. Clarkson and St. Lawrence are expected to make it in at-large, with St. Lawrence the "last team in." This is all pending the NCAA selection announcement on espn+/ESPNU at 11:30am.
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