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  • Originally posted by state of hockey View Post
    Steve Martin of absolutely fantastic when he's not dumbing it down for the kids. When he is, well, I still like him anyway. Helluva banjo player, too.
    Yeah he is. He and his band play at their live shows with Martin Short and while it isn't my style I really really enjoyed it.

    I guess I never thought of it as "dumbing down" but more that what he is went from being absurd to being sort of part of the collective conscience. He brought people to him not so much that he brings himself to them. Its partly why he quit standup. He describes it well in his book. The jokes he was beloved for when he "retired" were the same jokes he was hated for 5 years prior because people didn't get where he was going. When they did he had nowhere else to really go so he had to stop. You can't be absurd when being absurd is now mainstream.
    "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
    -aparch

    "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
    -INCH

    Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
    -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

    Comment


    • Martin does what the best do. He makes one horrific movie (Father of the Bride) and banks the loot to finance all his smart projects for the next decade. Then he does it again.
      Cornell University
      National Champion 1967, 1970
      ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
      Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Handyman View Post

        Yeah he is. He and his band play at their live shows with Martin Short and while it isn't my style I really really enjoyed it.

        I guess I never thought of it as "dumbing down" but more that what he is went from being absurd to being sort of part of the collective conscience. He brought people to him not so much that he brings himself to them. Its partly why he quit standup. He describes it well in his book. The jokes he was beloved for when he "retired" were the same jokes he was hated for 5 years prior because people didn't get where he was going. When they did he had nowhere else to really go so he had to stop. You can't be absurd when being absurd is now mainstream.
        I wonder if Kaufman would have kept on a trajectory of excellence had he not literally flamed out or was he brilliant enough to make it last longer. I realize a lot of his genius was unrealized by the masses until much later, but I was with him from the day he bellowed, "Here I am to save the dayyyy" on SNL and never left his side.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Slap Shot View Post

          I wonder if Kaufman would have kept on a trajectory of excellence had he not literally flamed out or was he brilliant enough to make it last longer. I realize a lot of his genius was unrealized by the masses until much later, but I was with him from the day he bellowed, "Here I am to save the dayyyy" on SNL and never left his side.
          Kaufman wasn't just that comic genius he was also obviously seriously imbalanced. Maybe his condition gave him a tilted view of the world, or maybe it gave him the anger and impatience not to give a fuck about rules (though that might simply have been his intellect).

          He's one of those guys I'm glad I wasn't personally close to because it would have torn me up to watch him go on, so instead I get to enjoy his art and never worry it was a real suffering person. Half the great painters and poets and philosophers are like that, too. Happiness, profundity, influence-- pick any two.
          Cornell University
          National Champion 1967, 1970
          ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
          Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Kepler View Post

            Kaufman wasn't just that comic genius he was also obviously seriously imbalanced. Maybe his condition gave him a tilted view of the world, or maybe it gave him the anger and impatience not to give a fuck about rules (though that might simply have been his intellect).

            He's one of those guys I'm glad I wasn't personally close to because it would have torn me up to watch him go on, so instead I get to enjoy his art and never worry it was a real suffering person. Half the great painters and poets and philosophers are like that, too. Happiness, profundity, influence-- pick any two.
            Clearly he was troubled and likely in ways we'll never understand and I honestly don't want to know. I mean I couldn't have been 10 when he did his Mighty Mouse bit and it was so mesmerizing, tantalizing and revolutionary. I had to have been in a very small % of folks that was not fully aghast by such an in your face performance and beyond. I wish he never did Taxi to be honest.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Kepler View Post

              Kaufman wasn't just that comic genius he was also obviously seriously imbalanced. Maybe his condition gave him a tilted view of the world, or maybe it gave him the anger and impatience not to give a fuck about rules (though that might simply have been his intellect).

              He's one of those guys I'm glad I wasn't personally close to because it would have torn me up to watch him go on, so instead I get to enjoy his art and never worry it was a real suffering person. Half the great painters and poets and philosophers are like that, too. Happiness, profundity, influence-- pick any two.
              My favorite classical composers were incredibly twisted individuals. Just seems to be the way when it comes to the arts. Also reminds me of when Bourdain said something to the effect of "You don't find great food in places that have always had it pretty good. Sweden, for example." :^D
              the state of hockey is good

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Slap Shot View Post

                I wonder if Kaufman would have kept on a trajectory of excellence had he not literally flamed out or was he brilliant enough to make it last longer. I realize a lot of his genius was unrealized by the masses until much later, but I was with him from the day he bellowed, "Here I am to save the dayyyy" on SNL and never left his side.
                That is a great question. My guess is he would have flamed out and sort of popped in and out of the spotlight for a while. He was very acerbic and never really seemed to like fame all that much and there is only so much people are willing to take even if they love you. Taxi is the ultimate example...everyone on the cast loved him and speak of him fondly but also wanted to kill him because he was miserable and made their lives miserable. He was never going to be able to capitalize on his genius or pivot to something else because his art was all about making people uncomfortable in ways that alienate half the audience.

                I think the world is better off with the amount of time we got. I don't think any of us would want to see the "Fat Elvis" version of Andy Kauffman. Same thing I say for Kurt Cobain...can you imagine Kurt Cobain touring now on those 90s music tours hating life and not playing the hits? (he was sick of playing Teen Spirit when Nevermind was still charting hits!) He would ruin his legacy...
                "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
                -aparch

                "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
                -INCH

                Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
                -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Handyman View Post
                  I think the world is better off with the amount of time we got. I don't think any of us would want to see the "Fat Elvis" version of Andy Kauffman. Same thing I say for Kurt Cobain...can you imagine Kurt Cobain touring now on those 90s music tours hating life and not playing the hits? (he was sick of playing Teen Spirit when Nevermind was still charting hits!) He would ruin his legacy...
                  I don't agree. I think with intelligent artists it is just as likely they would change and deepen their work. It would be different, but it wouldn't ruin the legacy. Think of how much Zappa changed over time. His later work is much less zany and fun, but also much more profound and rich.
                  Cornell University
                  National Champion 1967, 1970
                  ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
                  Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

                  Comment


                  • The Boys season 3 will premiere on June 3 with 3 episodes, and then an episode each week after that through July 8.
                    "The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." George Orwell, 1984

                    "One does not simply walk into Mordor. Its Black Gates are guarded by more than just Orcs. There is evil there that does not sleep, and the Great Eye is ever watchful. It is a barren wasteland, riddled with fire and ash and dust, the very air you breathe is a poisonous fume." Boromir

                    "Good news! We have a delivery." Professor Farnsworth

                    Comment


                    • As I've mentioned a few pages back on this thread, I've been a bit obsessed with Law & Order reruns lately and cautiously excited about its return in late February. I was starting to wonder what real life ripped from the headlines stories they might use and thought it would be fun to list out ones here. I'll start:

                      - the Travis Scott/Astroworld fiasco
                      - Governor Cuomo and Chris Cuomo stories
                      - some version of Jeffrey Epstein/Ghislaine Maxwell

                      Any others?

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by St. Clown View Post
                        The Boys season 3 will premiere on June 3 with 3 episodes, and then an episode each week after that through July 8.
                        I like it. Forcing me to not binge and feel sad when I'm done in two days.
                        the state of hockey is good

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Scarlet View Post
                          As I've mentioned a few pages back on this thread, I've been a bit obsessed with Law & Order reruns lately and cautiously excited about its return in late February. I was starting to wonder what real life ripped from the headlines stories they might use and thought it would be fun to list out ones here. I'll start:

                          - the Travis Scott/Astroworld fiasco
                          - Governor Cuomo and Chris Cuomo stories
                          - some version of Jeffrey Epstein/Ghislaine Maxwell

                          Any others?
                          South Dakota AG hitting and killing a man and fleeing?

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Kepler View Post

                            I don't agree. I think with intelligent artists it is just as likely they would change and deepen their work. It would be different, but it wouldn't ruin the legacy. Think of how much Zappa changed over time. His later work is much less zany and fun, but also much more profound and rich.
                            I think Zappa is more of an exception in part because of the time he started in and how things changed around him. He also never had the self hatred that guys like Kauffman and Cobain did. Cobain isn't Eddie Vedder his pain and loathing was real and was not going to go away as he aged and he really didn't like who he or Nirvana was after Nevermind. Plus...you know all the heroin ;^) (Nirvana is my gf's fave band the amount I have had to hear about Cobain the last decade is more annoying than it was growing up with it. She agrees it is best he died because he would have either sold out or ruined everything)

                            Kauffman would have spent most of the 80s surviving on appearances on Letterman and the like. As comedy boomed he would have been kind of pushed out because comedy clubs don't want people on stage that force the audience to dislike them. Unlike Steve Martin he wasn't a genius writer and well he hated acting. It would have been a bad run until the alt comedy scene of the late 90s showed up which he would have become the hipster poster child of if he was still around.

                            Like a lot of artists...the true genius isn't realized until they died. Even better there is so little of their art out there it makes what exists special. Some people aren't meant to last forever...sometimes even a couple years to long is the difference between being a God like Jimmy Hendrix and being an epic d-bag like Jim Morrison ;^)
                            Last edited by Handyman; 01-07-2022, 12:26 PM.
                            "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
                            -aparch

                            "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
                            -INCH

                            Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
                            -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Scarlet View Post
                              As I've mentioned a few pages back on this thread, I've been a bit obsessed with Law & Order reruns lately and cautiously excited about its return in late February. I was starting to wonder what real life ripped from the headlines stories they might use and thought it would be fun to list out ones here. I'll start:

                              - the Travis Scott/Astroworld fiasco
                              - Governor Cuomo and Chris Cuomo stories
                              - some version of Jeffrey Epstein/Ghislaine Maxwell

                              Any others?
                              Law and Order usually found a way to do a riot episode (especially in the early days) so George Floyd will happen. That has been discussed on other L&O shows a bit but the main franchise is the perfect spot for a full on cop kneeling on the neck episode. (or a Breonna Taylor)

                              Epstein will be the crossover with SVU and Organized Crime is my early guess
                              "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
                              -aparch

                              "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
                              -INCH

                              Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
                              -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Scarlet View Post
                                As I've mentioned a few pages back on this thread, I've been a bit obsessed with Law & Order reruns lately and cautiously excited about its return in late February. I was starting to wonder what real life ripped from the headlines stories they might use and thought it would be fun to list out ones here. I'll start:

                                - the Travis Scott/Astroworld fiasco
                                - Governor Cuomo and Chris Cuomo stories
                                - some version of Jeffrey Epstein/Ghislaine Maxwell

                                Any others?
                                Kyle Rittenhouse?

                                Cornell '04, Stanford '06


                                KDR

                                Rover Frenchy, Classic! Great post.
                                iwh30 I wish I could be as smart as you. I really do you are the man
                                gregg729 I just saw your sig, you do love having people revel in your "intelligence."
                                Ritt18 you are the perfect representation of your alma mater.
                                Miss Thundercat That's it, you win.
                                TBA#2 I want to kill you and dance in your blood.
                                DisplacedCornellian Hahaha. Thread over. Frenchy wins.

                                Test to see if I can add this.

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