Another Mass Shooting: It's Those Darn Video Games!

[ScoobyDoo]

Pretty hilarious that they were reporting this morning how Men's Pre-Frontal Cortex isn't fully developed till 25 but we gotta keep the age you can buy an AR-15 at 18 cause reasons.

We're destroying ourselves. That's the goal.

[Deutsche Gopher Fan]

I’m sure womens are formed at 10, when they can be forced to have a kid

[Swansong]

So, A few things:

• I'm disappointed by this agreement as well. Further, it's only a "framework", not an actual draft bill.
• With a 50/50 senate and a GQP hellbent on preventing anything passing, there is zero chance of... anything of substance passing. Don't get mad at the Dems here. We can even likely thank TFG for the two Georgia senate seats just to get us to 50/50.
• Despite 10 GQP senators being signatories to this - again - "framework", I have zero faith that at least a few of them will pull out at the last minute, declare it some word salad of socialism, commies, whatever, and then block it via filibuster anyway.

The GQP is the problem.

[psych]

The Democratic Party is truly ****ed if it’s most educated and liberal members, men and women who understand how government actually works, are going to call them feckless and cowards when they actually might pass a gun control bill with 10 traitors to democracy. If there were 60 Democrats in the Senate, all of those things would likely be included, and maybe more. Is this current bill going to move the needle much? No. We all know this, including Mr. Hovey, who has been telling us all along it’s the guns. But for ****’s sake, we’d be bashing them for not passing anything either. I, for one, am shocked even THIS bill has a chance at passing, woefully inadequate as it is. But that’s because of it requiring the support of the 10 traitors to democracy, not because of the 50 Democrats voting for it.

Edit: Swansong beat me to it with his easier to read bullet points.

[rufus]

I’m sure womens are formed at 10, when they can be forced to have a kid

Absolutely. Look how they use their womanly wiles to lure good men into trouble.

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

Pretty hilarious that they were reporting this morning how Men's Pre-Frontal Cortex isn't fully developed till 25 but we gotta keep the age you can buy an AR-15 at 18 cause reasons.

Then clearly 25 should become the new age of majority for men - booze, pot, tobacco, firearms, porn, strip clubs, voting, entering into contracts, etc. Right?

[Drew S.]

Then clearly 25 should become the new age of majority for men - booze, pot, tobacco, firearms, porn, strip clubs, voting, entering into contracts, etc. Right?

Maybe if we removed CRT from schools men would develop a little bit quicker. No one ever wants to talk about that.

[Kepler]

Then clearly 25 should become the new age of majority for men - booze, pot, tobacco, firearms, porn, strip clubs, voting, entering into contracts, etc. Right?

40.

Speaking from experience.

[ScoobyDoo]

40.

Speaking from experience.

I don't disagree with this.

[WeAreNDHockey]

So, A few things:

• I'm disappointed by this agreement as well. Further, it's only a "framework", not an actual draft bill.
• With a 50/50 senate and a GQP hellbent on preventing anything passing, there is zero chance of... anything of substance passing. Don't get mad at the Dems here. We can even likely thank TFG for the two Georgia senate seats just to get us to 50/50.
• Despite 10 GQP senators being signatories to this - again - "framework", I have zero faith that at least a few of them will pull out at the last minute, declare it some word salad of socialism, commies, whatever, and then block it via filibuster anyway.

The GQP is the problem.

Voters, especially GQP, voters are the problem. If there were fewer idiots in Florida, Ron Desantis would be lucky to have an AM radio overnight show on the weekend conspiracy talk show circuit. If there were fewer idiots in Texas, Ted Cruz would be selling used cars. If there were fewer Nazis and other flavors of fascists in Wyoming we could go back to hating Liz Cheney for her shockingly cruel and backward voting record instead of viewing her as some sort of savior of democracy.

As for the bill being discussed by the Senate, it might pass, or, as Swangsong notes, it might not. Hopefully it does. But the real problem I see with it is it is like having a horribly dislikable coach for your college football team who finds a way to never be worse than 7-5, but will never be 11-1 and play in a New Year's Day bowl game. If this bill passes, it gives fodder to the Biden-esque notion that republicans are honest brokers and takes a lot of wind out of the sails of voters who might possibly be moved enough in places like Texas or Florida to actually vote the right way for once. While we can't let any improvements -- no matter how miniscule they may be -- fall by the wayside, I fear in the long term it does more harm than good. You never want to root against your team, but sometimes 2-10 is better in the long run than 7-5.

[psych]

Voters, especially GQP, voters are the problem. If there were fewer idiots in Florida, Ron Desantis would be lucky to have an AM radio overnight show on the weekend conspiracy talk show circuit. If there were fewer idiots in Texas, Ted Cruz would be selling used cars. If there were fewer Nazis and other flavors of fascists in Wyoming we could go back to hating Liz Cheney for her shockingly cruel and backward voting record instead of viewing her as some sort of savior of democracy.

As for the bill being discussed by the Senate, it might pass, or, as Swangsong notes, it might not. Hopefully it does. But the real problem I see with it is it is like having a horribly dislikable coach for your college football team who finds a way to never be worse than 7-5, but will never be 11-1 and play in a New Year's Day bowl game. If this bill passes, it gives fodder to the Biden-esque notion that republicans are honest brokers and takes a lot of wind out of the sails of voters who might possibly be moved enough in places like Texas or Florida to actually vote the right way for once. While we can't let any improvements -- no matter how miniscule they may be -- fall by the wayside, I fear in the long term it does more harm than good. You never want to root against your team, but sometimes 2-10 is better in the long run than 7-5.

You’re the guy we can count on for saying our democracy is on the precipice of collapsing, and you’re saying let’s risk collapsing a few more times before we bounce back down the road?
Hovey’s argument that Democrats back-slap too much when they pass anything of marginal value with the odds stacked against them is apparently only applicable to me. And I’m not even back-slapping, while Swansong isn’t a lifelong Democrat. I don’t think it should be that way. Those suburban people in Texas and elsewhere are more worried about inflation than any cultural issue. Take the potential small win now, and then if we somehow miraculously have an opportunity to expand it in the future, do so then. I feel like taking the incremental wins toward our ultimate goals is Kepler’s vision? We’re negotiating with ****ing terrorists on one of the things they claim to hold nearest and dearest.

[SJHovey]

Voters, especially GQP, voters are the problem. If there were fewer idiots in Florida, Ron Desantis would be lucky to have an AM radio overnight show on the weekend conspiracy talk show circuit. If there were fewer idiots in Texas, Ted Cruz would be selling used cars. If there were fewer Nazis and other flavors of fascists in Wyoming we could go back to hating Liz Cheney for her shockingly cruel and backward voting record instead of viewing her as some sort of savior of democracy.

As for the bill being discussed by the Senate, it might pass, or, as Swangsong notes, it might not. Hopefully it does. But the real problem I see with it is it is like having a horribly dislikable coach for your college football team who finds a way to never be worse than 7-5, but will never be 11-1 and play in a New Year's Day bowl game. If this bill passes, it gives fodder to the Biden-esque notion that republicans are honest brokers and takes a lot of wind out of the sails of voters who might possibly be moved enough in places like Texas or Florida to actually vote the right way for once. While we can't let any improvements -- no matter how miniscule they may be -- fall by the wayside, I fear in the long term it does more harm than good. You never want to root against your team, but sometimes 2-10 is better in the long run than 7-5.

The blueprint for fighting guns in this country has been laid before us, and anyone who wants to take up the charge and use it will likely achieve a sizable level of success. Maybe it'll be a group like the survivor groups from previous school shootings. Maybe it'll be another group.

Think about it. You have something (guns) that arguably have some level of constitutional protection, while at the same time you have a sizable portion of our country that questions the viability (pun intended) of that constitutional protection and want to do away with a person's "right" to do certain things.

Hmmmm. I wonder where I've seen something like that before, since say 1973 or so? Can't put my finger on it.

You attack it at the local/state level. That's where it's easiest to get laws passed, not Congress. You don't need all states doing it, just a handful of states. Even one. What is wrong with California or NY or any other solidly blue state? Keep passing laws that press the boundaries of what may or may not be "constitutional." You lose a case in the courts, don't give up. Keep pushing the boundaries and taking the case to the courts. The makeup of courts change. Decisions will too. And more like minded states will take up your cause.

Stop whining and just do it if you want it done. If Mississippi can do it to you on abortion, I see no reason why California can't do it right back. It isn't going to happen tomorrow. It may not happen in your lifetime. But it can happen.

[psych]

You realize those laws are being, or have already been, passed in those states, right? Can you at least acknowledge that? There’s a reason Massachusetts has a lower gun death date than Texas. Or New York. Or California. Your snark about California’s strict gun laws not stopping a California shooter last year aside, their stronger laws work. Not as strong as a gun ban, but they work.

[WeAreNDHockey]

You’re the guy we can count on for saying our democracy is on the precipice of collapsing, and you’re saying let’s risk collapsing a few more times before we bounce back down the road?
Hovey’s argument that Democrats back-slap too much when they pass anything of marginal value with the odds stacked against them is apparently only applicable to me. And I’m not even back-slapping, while Swansong isn’t a lifelong Democrat. I don’t think it should be that way. Those suburban people in Texas and elsewhere are more worried about inflation than any cultural issue. Take the potential small win now, and then if we somehow miraculously have an opportunity to expand it in the future, do so then. I feel like taking the incremental wins toward our ultimate goals is Kepler’s vision? We’re negotiating with ****ing terrorists on one of the things they claim to hold nearest and dearest.

I said twice in the post you quoted that it should pass, first by noting that hopefully it passes, and again by saying that we can't let anything fall by the wayside no matter how small the improvement. Yes I think democracy here is on the precipice of collapsing, but I am not saying that I WANT it to. I literally said what I believe the outcome to a watered down bill might be. Again, I don't want that to happen. I always HOPED Brian Kelly would win a championship at Notre Dame even while believing it was NEVER going to happen.

[psych]

I said twice in the post you quoted that it should pass, first by noting that hopefully it passes, and again by saying that we can't let anything fall by the wayside no matter how small the improvement. Yes I think democracy here is on the precipice of collapsing, but I am not saying that I WANT it to. I literally said what I believe the outcome to a watered down bill might be. Again, I don't want that to happen. I always HOPED Brian Kelly would win a championship at Notre Dame even while believing it was NEVER going to happen.

You also said you fear this bill will do more harm than good, and listed one of the reasons as people considering voting Democrat in the midterms or for POTUS may stick with the GOP or not vote at all, based on the potential of this bill passing. I disagree with both of those premises. That all said, there’s a long way to go between the framework of a bill and the actual passage of a bill. We’re both in agreement on that.