Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Another Mass Shooting: It's Those Darn Video Games!

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • It is when you don't believe guns are a problem...
    "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
    -aparch

    "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
    -INCH

    Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
    -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Handyman View Post
      So Drunk Nazi Judge Pirro said the Michigan Shooting is the fault of Liberal School People because they didn't know he had a gun and never asked if he had a gun. That is definitely one way to go...
      And her drunk *** would have pitched a fit if they had asked that question. Violating his freedumbs and all for even asking that.
      "I went over the facts in my head, and admired how much uglier the situation had just become. Over the years I've learned that ignorance is more than just bliss. It's freaking orgasmic ecstasy".- Harry Dresden, Blood Rites


      Western Michigan Bronco Hockey- 2012 Mason Cup Champions

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Handyman View Post
        It is when you don't believe guns are a problem...
        https://vm.tiktok.com/ZM8WuHKEc/
        “Demolish the bridges behind you… then there is no choice but to build again.”

        Live Radio from 100.3

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Bronco View Post

          But I was told when the meth hoards come you won't have time to get yer gunz out of the safe.
          Exactly.
          **NOTE: The misleading post above was brought to you by Reynold's Wrap and American Steeples, makers of Crosses.

          Originally Posted by dropthatpuck-Scooby's a lost cause.
          Originally Posted by First Time, Long Time-Always knew you were nothing but a troll.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Bronco View Post

            But I was told when the meth hoards come you won't have time to get yer gunz out of the safe.
            Meth hordes.

            Meth hoards are how red states finance their government.
            Cornell University
            National Champion 1967, 1970
            ECAC Champion 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1973, 1980, 1986, 1996, 1997, 2003, 2005, 2010
            Ivy League Champion 1966, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1977, 1978, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1996, 1997, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2012, 2014, 2018, 2019, 2020

            Comment


            • Saw a perspective that I didn't really think about WRT the school vs the parents responsibility.

              We all know that there was a meeting the morning of the shooting to discuss a picture that the shooter drew with a gun, shooter, victim, and blood. Clearly an issue. Apparently the resolution was to get counselling within 48 hours.

              And then the parents didn't take the kid out of the school, and the rest is history.

              It's been brought up that the school should have taken the kid out and suspended him or something like that. But at the time, the school had no idea or even indication that the shooter was armed. And based on history, I really don't see any reason they should have assumed he would be armed that day- that policy may be changing now, I would think.

              So other than a picture threat, which was not directed at a person, the school had nothing really to go on. Maybe they could have connected the search on line for bullets, maybe?

              On the other hand, the parents knew that they gave him a handgun, and they knew he was searching for ammunition the day before. And they did not inform the school that he *could* be armed. They suspected that, since dad went home to look for the gun. But they told nobody about that. And they didn't take the kid out of school. I wonder if they even fought the idea of taking him out of school.

              To think the school is in worse trouble when you look at who knew what just before the shooting, well.... For sure, the parents had info they did not divulge that would have indicated the threat was much higher than the school thought. Let alone supplying the gun.

              I do think the school is in big trouble, and the fact that they hired an outside company to do an investigation as opposed to the parents asking the Michigan AG to do that investigation is kind of telling. Lots of people are going to go down, and parents of the victims will be paid a lot of money by Oakland county land owners over time.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by MichVandal View Post
                Saw a perspective that I didn't really think about WRT the school vs the parents responsibility.

                We all know that there was a meeting the morning of the shooting to discuss a picture that the shooter drew with a gun, shooter, victim, and blood. Clearly an issue. Apparently the resolution was to get counselling within 48 hours.

                And then the parents didn't take the kid out of the school, and the rest is history.

                It's been brought up that the school should have taken the kid out and suspended him or something like that. But at the time, the school had no idea or even indication that the shooter was armed. And based on history, I really don't see any reason they should have assumed he would be armed that day- that policy may be changing now, I would think.

                So other than a picture threat, which was not directed at a person, the school had nothing really to go on. Maybe they could have connected the search on line for bullets, maybe?

                On the other hand, the parents knew that they gave him a handgun, and they knew he was searching for ammunition the day before. And they did not inform the school that he *could* be armed. They suspected that, since dad went home to look for the gun. But they told nobody about that. And they didn't take the kid out of school. I wonder if they even fought the idea of taking him out of school.

                To think the school is in worse trouble when you look at who knew what just before the shooting, well.... For sure, the parents had info they did not divulge that would have indicated the threat was much higher than the school thought. Let alone supplying the gun.

                I do think the school is in big trouble, and the fact that they hired an outside company to do an investigation as opposed to the parents asking the Michigan AG to do that investigation is kind of telling. Lots of people are going to go down, and parents of the victims will be paid a lot of money by Oakland county land owners over time.
                Seems like it would have been pretty easy to ask the kid, or the parents when they were in, whether the kid had a gun on him, in his backpack, or whether the kid had access to guns at home.
                That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by SJHovey View Post

                  Seems like it would have been pretty easy to ask the kid, or the parents when they were in, whether the kid had a gun on him, in his backpack, or whether the kid had access to guns at home.
                  I'm with MichVandal on this one. Forgetting to ask is nowhere near as bad as declining to tell.

                  Stunned that you want to shift the blame away from the irresponsible gun-humping Trumpers. Just stunned.
                  If you don't change the world today, how can it be any better tomorrow?

                  Comment


                  • Again, I'm not trying to weigh or equate the school's liability with that of the parents or the kid or anyone else.

                    It just seems to me that when presented with the facts that the administrators apparently had from the teachers, the steps I think a reasonable administrator would take would be these when I sat down with the kid and parents:

                    Ask the kid to explain the drawings and the ammo search
                    Ask the parents if the kid has a gun, or access to a gun, and why the ammo search
                    Ask the kid if he has a gun with him
                    Ask the parents if the kid has a gun with him
                    Ask the kid and the parents if they mind if they search his backpack
                    If the kid refuses, seems like it would be a red flag, and I'd send the kid home until you could decide on the next steps
                    That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by SJHovey View Post

                      Seems like it would have been pretty easy to ask the kid, or the parents when they were in, whether the kid had a gun on him, in his backpack, or whether the kid had access to guns at home.
                      Maybe. Maybe they did, too. Other than the outcome of the meeting, we don't know what was said.

                      But at the same time, why would they have? The parents agreed to get counseling within 48 hours, so it seemed that the issue was mostly solved. What indications were there other than the picture and the ammo search that the shooter was an immediate threat?

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by SJHovey View Post
                        Again, I'm not trying to weigh or equate the school's liability with that of the parents or the kid or anyone else.

                        It just seems to me that when presented with the facts that the administrators apparently had from the teachers, the steps I think a reasonable administrator would take would be these when I sat down with the kid and parents:

                        Ask the kid to explain the drawings and the ammo search
                        Ask the parents if the kid has a gun, or access to a gun, and why the ammo search
                        Ask the kid if he has a gun with him
                        Ask the parents if the kid has a gun with him
                        Ask the kid and the parents if they mind if they search his backpack
                        If the kid refuses, seems like it would be a red flag, and I'd send the kid home until you could decide on the next steps
                        Again, that path of discussion may have been run down until the parents got upset with the questioning. We don't know that did or didn't happen. We know the parents refused to take him out of school, though.

                        But we also have to remember this is a school that does not have metal detectors- which is kind of a reflection of the conservative area that it's in. Parents would be pretty upset that the school would assume that kids are armed like that- at least they would have been.

                        This isn't suggesting that the school isn't responsible, it's that the parents are far more.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by MichVandal View Post

                          Maybe. Maybe they did, too. Other than the outcome of the meeting, we don't know what was said.

                          But at the same time, why would they have? The parents agreed to get counseling within 48 hours, so it seemed that the issue was mostly solved. What indications were there other than the picture and the ammo search that the shooter was an immediate threat?
                          As I posted early on, to me the key is what was specifically said during the meeting. I don't think we know exactly what the administrators said or asked, and how the kid or parents responded.

                          The school can't bring the kid in, tie him up, strip search him and his backpack, then decide what to do. But the school can go to the full extent they are permitted to go.

                          Why would the school do that? Probably because of the pretty disturbing signs. In most cases, the kid isn't armed, just confused and troubled. But again, if I'm an administrator I want to go to the full extent the law would allow me, which includes asking direct questions and asking for permission to search. If permission is denied, then you can't search. But you can decide whether that's a red flag or not (for me it would be).
                          That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by MichVandal View Post

                            Again, that path of discussion may have been run down until the parents got upset with the questioning. We don't know that did or didn't happen. We know the parents refused to take him out of school, though.

                            But we also have to remember this is a school that does not have metal detectors- which is kind of a reflection of the conservative area that it's in. Parents would be pretty upset that the school would assume that kids are armed like that- at least they would have been.

                            This isn't suggesting that the school isn't responsible, it's that the parents are far more.
                            I find it interesting that in a Republican anti-government district that anyone in that POV would find any fault with the school at all. The school deferred to the parents in this situation which is what every fucking Republican Conservative whiner has been whining about for decades. And now 4 kids are dead and more injured. Can't blame the school for that. They did exactly what the Republican anti-government people wanted them to do. The School Board should not find fault either.
                            **NOTE: The misleading post above was brought to you by Reynold's Wrap and American Steeples, makers of Crosses.

                            Originally Posted by dropthatpuck-Scooby's a lost cause.
                            Originally Posted by First Time, Long Time-Always knew you were nothing but a troll.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by SJHovey View Post

                              As I posted early on, to me the key is what was specifically said during the meeting. I don't think we know exactly what the administrators said or asked, and how the kid or parents responded.

                              The school can't bring the kid in, tie him up, strip search him and his backpack, then decide what to do. But the school can go to the full extent they are permitted to go.

                              Why would the school do that? Probably because of the pretty disturbing signs. In most cases, the kid isn't armed, just confused and troubled. But again, if I'm an administrator I want to go to the full extent the law would allow me, which includes asking direct questions and asking for permission to search. If permission is denied, then you can't search. But you can decide whether that's a red flag or not (for me it would be).
                              The school has every right to search his bag as long as there is reasonable suspicion. (they could search his locker any time) I would say the ammo search and the picture qualify. (I also asked an administrator I know and they agree)

                              The problem here is likely that the parents probably threatened to take action if their kid was sent home or searched. That happens quite a bit. Schools buckle under that all day long especially suburban schools. From what we know of the parents that is totally in line with them.

                              That said the school needed to do more and will pay for not doing more. My local district has suspended and expelled kids for posting images on SM with guns or making even vague threats.

                              If we want to break it down though it is at best 80/20 parents to school. What the school did was negligent, what the parents did was likely criminal.
                              "It's as if the Drumpf Administration is made up of the worst and unfunny parts of the Cleveland Browns, Washington Generals, and the alien Mon-Stars from Space Jam."
                              -aparch

                              "Scenes in "Empire Strikes Back" that take place on the tundra planet Hoth were shot on the present-day site of Ralph Engelstad Arena."
                              -INCH

                              Of course I'm a fan of the Vikings. A sick and demented Masochist of a fan, but a fan none the less.
                              -ScoobyDoo 12/17/2007

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Handyman View Post

                                The school has every right to search his bag as long as there is reasonable suspicion. (they could search his locker any time) I would say the ammo search and the picture qualify. (I also asked an administrator I know and they agree)

                                The problem here is likely that the parents probably threatened to take action if their kid was sent home or searched. That happens quite a bit. Schools buckle under that all day long especially suburban schools. From what we know of the parents that is totally in line with them.

                                That said the school needed to do more and will pay for not doing more. My local district has suspended and expelled kids for posting images on SM with guns or making even vague threats.

                                If we want to break it down though it is at best 80/20 parents to school. What the school did was negligent, what the parents did was likely criminal.
                                I don't even think you have to get into the "reasonable suspicion" issue. That's where you open yourself up to a dispute with the kid. Simply ask him to let you search. If they turn you down, get the kid out of there.

                                I just think it's a mistake to try to equate or compare the responsibility of the parents and that of the school. Two completely different responsibilities there, and when you do that you tend to minimize or reduce the culpability of the two parties. That sort of comparison of fault is best left to the civil case where there can only be 100% among all the parties.
                                That community is already in the process of dissolution where each man begins to eye his neighbor as a possible enemy, where non-conformity with the accepted creed, political as well as religious, is a mark of disaffection; where denunciation, without specification or backing, takes the place of evidence; where orthodoxy chokes freedom of dissent; where faith in the eventual supremacy of reason has become so timid that we dare not enter our convictions in the open lists, to win or lose.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X