The "I Can't Believe There's No Abortion Thread" Part Deux: Electric Boogaloo

[leswp1]

Abused women don’t leave their abusive significant other because it’s “utterly dislocating”? You talk with abused women on a regular basis like I do at my work? Good god, your analogies are hot garbage.

THis and your other post helped me to type less. When I taught Nursing they did a really great mock exercise that gave people a particular background, circumstances, job, money and family members. They then entered the arena with those circumstances and had to figure out how to survive and try to move forward with things like affording food, utilities, transportation, meds, clothing, rent, etc.
It was a great way to help people understand there is a lot more than will involved in surviving. Looks like a few people on this thread could do with participating in something like that to understand you can't just dismiss circumstances and basic needs. Saying it is easier now? No. I spent my whole career caring for people who were doing their damest to move forward. Some were successful but some were OK but some were in bad straits, even with them pedaling as fast as they could. The working poor are over a barrel. Lots of the time all it takes is the car breaking down, someone getting sick, rent increase and the house of cards falls down.

Maybe the mindset may hold true for those who are childless it they are willing to screw the upper generations. There is no way it should be considered OK to put kids at risk of being without food or a roof while taking a leap of faith.

Do genealogy for a hobby. The statement that most of the people coming over here were not dirt poor holds true for most of what I find. ALmost all of the people I have researched were not in a situation where their last dollar was spent on passage. They had large social networks that were established when they came or knew someone who knew someone. Moving now this is NOT what you usually see.

[St. Clown]

Only 43% of Americans state that they could cover the cost of an emergency if it were $1,000.

https://fortune.com/recommends/banki...gency-expense/

I doubt those who can afford that low threshold are the people being discussed here.

[psych]

THis and your other post helped me to type less. When I taught Nursing they did a really great mock exercise that gave people a particular background, circumstances, job, money and family members. They then entered the arena with those circumstances and had to figure out how to survive and try to move forward with things like affording food, utilities, transportation, meds, clothing, rent, etc.
It was a great way to help people understand there is a lot more than will involved in surviving. Looks like a few people on this thread could do with participating in something like that to understand you can't just dismiss circumstances and basic needs. Saying it is easier now? No. I spent my whole career caring for people who were doing their damest to move forward. Some were successful but some were OK but some were in bad straits, even with them pedaling as fast as they could. The working poor are over a barrel. Lots of the time all it takes is the car breaking down, someone getting sick, rent increase and the house of cards falls down.

Maybe the mindset may hold true for those who are childless it they are willing to screw the upper generations. There is no way it should be considered OK to put kids at risk of being without food or a roof while taking a leap of faith.

Do genealogy for a hobby. The statement that most of the people coming over here were not dirt poor holds true for most of what I find. ALmost all of the people I have researched were not in a situation where their last dollar was spent on passage. They had large social networks that were established when they came or knew someone who knew someone. Moving now this is NOT what you usually see.

I did a similar poverty exercise my second semester of nursing school. I loved it. One of my favorite things I did in school. I was a 60-something disabled woman living with her son, daughter-in-law, and three kids. I basically had to forego my medication every other day because we couldn’t afford it.

[Kepler]

Only 43% of Americans state that they could cover the cost of an emergency if it were $1,000.

https://fortune.com/recommends/banki...gency-expense/

I doubt those who can afford that low threshold are the people being discussed here.

A state-forced pregnancy costs a lot more than $1000.

[dxmnkd316]

The question is which sword is sharpest and closest to your neck.

If you're fleeing a civil war, keeping up with the kardashians isn't a priority and you start walking. If you have a theoretical threat like lack of safe abortions, getting shot by police, being assaulted by bigots, etc. it's not the same. It's a risk your mind evaluates and weighs against your worldly possessions and lifestyle. A theoretical threat is not the same as a civil war.

Could people drop everything and start walking? Yep. and if it comes to that, people will. There's always a choice. Which i think is Kepler's point, just presented... abrasively.

At what level of danger are you willing to become a refugee? And what are the blue states doing to help them?

[Jimjamesak]

And what are the blue states doing to help them?

This is the important question to all of this. Because the answer to this question right now is “not a GD thing”.

[MissThundercat]

The question is which sword is sharpest and closest to your neck.

If you're fleeing a civil war, keeping up with the kardashians isn't a priority and you start walking. If you have a theoretical threat like lack of safe abortions, getting shot by police, being assaulted by bigots, etc. it's not the same. It's a risk your mind evaluates and weighs against your worldly possessions and lifestyle. A theoretical threat is not the same as a civil war.

Could people drop everything and start walking? Yep. and if it comes to that, people will. There's always a choice. Which i think is Kepler's point, just presented... abrasively.

At what level of danger are you willing to become a refugee? And what are the blue states doing to help them?

In my case, if MI reverses course and becomes a hellscape like TX/FL/MO, then yes, I'm headed around Lake Michigan to MSP, where my community has a broad, thriving presence. I would love to attend a Twin Cities PRIDE event!

[dxmnkd316]

In my case, if MI reverses course and becomes a hellscape like TX/FL/MO, then yes, I'm headed around Lake Michigan to MSP, where my community has a broad, thriving presence. I would love to attend a Twin Cities PRIDE event!

Even if Minnesota goes red again, MSP will almost certainly be a good spot to land. There's almost zero chance they roll back LGBT protections. If that happens, it's ALL hit the fan and I'll be already heading to the northern border with a coyote.

[Kepler]

The question is which sword is sharpest and closest to your neck.

If you're fleeing a civil war, keeping up with the kardashians isn't a priority and you start walking. If you have a theoretical threat like lack of safe abortions, getting shot by police, being assaulted by bigots, etc. it's not the same. It's a risk your mind evaluates and weighs against your worldly possessions and lifestyle. A theoretical threat is not the same as a civil war.

Could people drop everything and start walking? Yep. and if it comes to that, people will. There's always a choice. Which i think is Kepler's point, just presented... abrasively.

At what level of danger are you willing to become a refugee? And what are the blue states doing to help them?

I genuinely was not trying to be abrasive. I was merely saying the apparently unsayable: as the Nazis turn up the heat, people have a choice.

Now personally I wish they would make the easier choice and get to the polls.

I'm advocating the blue states treat indigent red state emigrees as full scale refugees. They are fleeing a humanitarian crisis and political oppression. The red states are a lame CSA cosplay now. Come with us if you want to live. We're richer, smarter, healthier, more ethical, and more American. Your children have a future here; by staying in the red states you condemn them to poverty, ignorance, disease, hatred, and violence.

[leswp1]

The question is which sword is sharpest and closest to your neck.

If you're fleeing a civil war, keeping up with the kardashians isn't a priority and you start walking. If you have a theoretical threat like lack of safe abortions, getting shot by police, being assaulted by bigots, etc. it's not the same. It's a risk your mind evaluates and weighs against your worldly possessions and lifestyle. A theoretical threat is not the same as a civil war.

Could people drop everything and start walking? Yep. and if it comes to that, people will. There's always a choice. Which i think is Kepler's point, just presented... abrasively.

At what level of danger are you willing to become a refugee? And what are the blue states doing to help them?

My first thought? Well, our federal tax dollars are pretty much supporting what ever safety net, medical services the Red States have. They are not funding anything themselves. The disparity between what Red States use and what they pay in is ridiculous. They are parasites that whine they have to pay taxes.

The Blue States are also doing a fair amount to support access to care for women - stats of out of State patients arriving for care is really, really scary. It reminds me of the underground railroad for women instead of slaves.

How would you envision just drop everything and walk playing out? Where would they be aiming to go to? A true question.

Have taken care of refugees that emigrated and war refugees. The stories of people attempting to emigrate to here are not usually drop and walk. Most of them took time to plan, attempted to marshal resources, paid money, have contact with someone here they know or who claims to offer assistance, have supplies and a semblance of a plan however unrealistic. If you are talking about war refugees their situation is more sudden but usually involves a group of people who need to move all at once and they have each other to help. They go to a waystation and then go from there. Again, the endpoint has some planning to it.

I struggle to see how either of these things applies to folks in country.

[Handyman]

They don't...it is just people trying to find a simple solution to a very complex problem. Picking up and leaving is just no feasible and never has been no matter what oppressed group is being discussed. It is (not here) often just passive aggressive victim shaming. Why don't Black People exit the South or the inner city, why didn't Jews leave Europe, why don't Palestinians leave Israel, why don't women leave Red States...etc. Those of us that might be able to make that work (I couldn't nor could my highly educated and decently well off significant other if Minnesota went Red) can sometimes be blind to the intricacies of these types of situations.

Moving across town is a friggin chore...imagine moving across country with no job, no house and in some cases pregnant. That is not something you can just do even if everything breaks decent for you.

[dxmnkd316]

They don't...it is just people trying to find a simple solution to a very complex problem. Picking up and leaving is just no feasible and never has been no matter what oppressed group is being discussed. It is (not here) often just passive aggressive victim shaming. Why don't Black People exit the South or the inner city, why didn't Jews leave Europe, why don't Palestinians leave Israel, why don't women leave Red States...etc. Those of us that might be able to make that work (I couldn't nor could my highly educated and decently well off significant other if Minnesota went Red) can sometimes be blind to the intricacies of these types of situations.

Moving across town is a friggin chore...imagine moving across country with no job, no house and in some cases pregnant. That is not something you can just do even if everything breaks decent for you.

I mean, our friends just moved from rural Alaska without a house lined up, a tentative job agreement (had to sign when they got here), and only the one works. They just had to get away from Alaska.

I'm not saying it's easy (or even possible!) in most cases. Sometimes it is.

If it happened en masse, it would look exactly the same as the Syrian refugee crisis in Europe.

[Kepler]

I just thought of the perfect name for the Plan B pill.

Ctrl-Z.

[leswp1]

They don't...it is just people trying to find a simple solution to a very complex problem. Picking up and leaving is just no feasible and never has been no matter what oppressed group is being discussed. It is (not here) often just passive aggressive victim shaming. Why don't Black People exit the South or the inner city, why didn't Jews leave Europe, why don't Palestinians leave Israel, why don't women leave Red States...etc. Those of us that might be able to make that work (I couldn't nor could my highly educated and decently well off significant other if Minnesota went Red) can sometimes be blind to the intricacies of these types of situations.

Moving across town is a friggin chore...imagine moving across country with no job, no house and in some cases pregnant. That is not something you can just do even if everything breaks decent for you.

I asked the question because I can't envision it. I notice no one has answered how they think it would play out.

I took care of a lot of people who worked hard to figure out how to get away from places. It was extremely rare to meet anyone who just 'left'. Maybe in the movies but not in real life. Esp if there are children involved.

What do you do for their education if they are on the move? You can't 'homeschool' without submitting a plan to the local board and get it approved. Most homeschooling requires outlay for materials.
What do you do to access healthcare for those who are sick? How do you obtain medication? There are a number of meds that cause significant harm if stopped
What do you do about getting a job Where does the money come from to keep a cell phone (almost universally required if applying for a job), you need an address for a library card and a library card can be required to use the computers in the library.
How do you apply for a place to live? List too long to consider. In temperate times of the yr you can live outside but when weather is bad- too hot or cold- how do you protect the children?

You can leave emergently to get to safety but once you are safe you have to survive

[French Rage]

https://jezebel.com/childbearing-age...uit-1850899899

Last September, New York resident Tara Rule posted a raw, emotional video on Tiktok saying she had been denied a medication to treat a debilitating condition called cluster headaches, because her neurologist told her she was of “childbearing age” and the medication could cause birth defects to a hypothetical fetus.

Blessed be the purely-hypotethical fruit.